AA "Why You Fly" TWU Style
- Thread starter Ken MacTiernan
- Start date
Name me an airline union that hasn't had either pay cuts or lost jobs in the last 3 years.
Better yet, when the steel industry was in termoil, name one union that had neither pay cuts or job losses. Hell, I'll give you the manufacturing industry as well.
It doesn't matter.......................................
Hackman
Veteran
- Sep 30, 2003
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- #48
Ok bootlicker, how about our ol' friends at SWA? Management seems to do fairly well with its unions, and the lazy and worthless (your words) employees that are members. Why is it they are the most unionized airline flying, and also the most profitable?Oneflyer said:
I'd like for you to explain this from your failing anti-union management bootlicker point of view. This should be good....
There time is coming, give them 10 years, they'll be in the same boat as everyone else. Southwest benefits from the fact that they have been, while unionized, incredibly small and can grown at a steady pace. There growth allows them to bring in new employees at the low end of the pay scale, as Southwest matures and their growth slows, their workforce will age and move towards the top of the pay scale as a group. Right now while their top end workers get paid well, their overall labor costs are less. As those workers age, they will become less productive and as their stock price appreciation slows they will become more disgruntled. It will happen.
What the hell is a bootlicker?????
AMFA NATIONAL
Lets see, according to this document, Southwest submited a non-negeotiable offer to the AMFA and they took it. They didn't do a damn thing.
Lets see, according to this document, Southwest submited a non-negeotiable offer to the AMFA and they took it. They didn't do a damn thing.
Who said anything about AMFA? I said give me 10 years worth of their salary and I'm outta here. Your getting very predictable, almost twu like in your responses. Do you guys go to the same school? That Overland Group has you talking the same crap.
Hackman
Veteran
- Sep 30, 2003
- 3,997
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- #53
Yeah, maybe. I don't see them as bad off as AA is right now in 10 years, even with the fuel prices they still are making money. I don't see the management at SWA buying every airline trinket they think they need to be the biggest and the baddest, inflating the upper management ego. Slow, steady growth, hedged fuel for years to come, and a management style that encourages the worthless and lazy (your words) union employee to go the extra mile instead of trying to bully it out of them. Seems to work for SWA, its too bad Centerport will never get it. People are disgruntled because of the constant management lies, bully tactics, and the poor business desisions that have been made, over and over again.Oneflyer said:
As the workers age at most companies, many become leaders, that is if their management didn't piss them off enough that they don't even bother trying to make a dent. They make a big difference in seeing problems in the operation and helping the young workers in the process. Exsperienced workers are a big help in aircraft repair, it cannot be done without them. This exsperience is what is leaving the airlines right now, and it looks to be getting to the crisis stage. Farm out all the work to China, and El Salvador, see what you get. Smoking holes. Maybe not right now, but its coming. I guarantee it.
A bootlicker: Yes man, coffee go-fer, management suck-up, one that if the boss stops too quickly....well you get the picture.
Can I ask a question? In general terms, what is it that you do here at Arrogant Airlines and how many years?
AA...on AMT's add $5/hr license..1,2,3,cents shift differential, no longevity.
SWA, I assume????
SWA BASE Rate
Premiums
Stock Options
Profit Sharing Article 16
You also have to look at holidays, ot, sick, etc, etc, etc...
SWA, I assume????
SWA BASE Rate
Premiums
Stock Options
Profit Sharing Article 16
You also have to look at holidays, ot, sick, etc, etc, etc...
Just for the record, without fuel hedges SW would have lost money 3 out of the last 8 quarters and had AA had those same hedges AA would have been more profitable than SW almost every single quarter.
That being said, selling the fuel hedges was unforgivable. It wasn't as much stupid or gready, but risky. A company that generates $20 billion in revenue competely exposed itself for $41 million in cash. In a simple financial analysis, the reward just didn't justify the risk.
Financial analysis for several different groups. AA has so many finance groups its easy switch from different aspects of the busines. I've only been at AA a couple of years, I am fairly young, though I have worked in a couple of different industries other than the airline
So if I read this correctly an avg. AMT at AA would make roughly $31.50 and hour while the same person at southwest would make just under $37 per?
That SW AMT would get 7 more vacations days including their birthday.
Both have profit sharing plans.
AA has a defined benefit plan, while SW has a defined contribution plan matched by the company with SW stock. During a normal environment the DBP would probably be preferable to the DCP, assuming the company never goes into bankruptcy though having all your retirement in one stock is equally risky, ask an Enron employee.
AA does offer better healthcare benefits, current and retirement.
So lets see $5.50 an hour is roughly about $11k a year with benefits on the AA side being a bit better and a bit safer considering that a SW 401k is all in SW stock which can go to zero, while your pension is guaranteed, at least to some level.
While I'd definately agree that SW has a better deal, without going into the work rules details, I wouldn't say its that incredibly better.
That SW AMT would get 7 more vacations days including their birthday.
Both have profit sharing plans.
AA has a defined benefit plan, while SW has a defined contribution plan matched by the company with SW stock. During a normal environment the DBP would probably be preferable to the DCP, assuming the company never goes into bankruptcy though having all your retirement in one stock is equally risky, ask an Enron employee.
AA does offer better healthcare benefits, current and retirement.
So lets see $5.50 an hour is roughly about $11k a year with benefits on the AA side being a bit better and a bit safer considering that a SW 401k is all in SW stock which can go to zero, while your pension is guaranteed, at least to some level.
While I'd definately agree that SW has a better deal, without going into the work rules details, I wouldn't say its that incredibly better.
