AA and APFA expidite talks

[BigBangTheory]

Thankless had nothing to do with it. It was just two more of those confessed to the Blessed Order of the Perpetually Trip-Removed not being able to face having to be flight attendants again.

I didn't see your a** on the ballot for National Officer. All you do is complain about our union reps being trip removed. Get over it!

 

[AC AA LA FA]

I didn't see your a** on the ballot for National Officer. All you do is complain about our union reps being trip removed. Get over it!

Amen..
..put up or shut up dude...

 

[jimntx]

I didn't see your a** on the ballot for National Officer. All you do is complain about our union reps being trip removed. Get over it!

Were you born that dumb, or did you have to go to school for it? I've never complained about union reps being trip removed. I complain about them being trip removed to do NOTHING for 4 years.

Well, nothing other than sign multiple side LOAs (as THB did) to get around the membership that will last much longer than she did. You should be particularly concerned since the current bunch is talking about more or less extending the current mess for 2 more years. Let's wait and see what we "gain" in return for giving in to management again.

 

[FA Mikey]

Were you born that dumb, or did you have to go to school for it? I've never complained about union reps being trip removed. I complain about them being trip removed to do NOTHING for 4 years.

Our CBA is filled with LOA's. Which ones in particular were detrimental to us?

Well, nothing other than sign multiple side LOAs (as THB did) to get around the membership that will last much longer than she did.

She lasted over 30 years more than you or I will last here.

You should be particularly concerned since the current bunch is talking about more or less extending the current mess for 2 more years. Let's wait and see what we "gain" in return for giving in to management again.

Jim, a contract extension is all they are talking about right now. They are looking to see if they can come up with something that offers some relief to the FA's who should understand that a full CBA will be years away in typical negotiations. Added to that the state of the economy and the price of oil, I am not expecting to see much. I say get something now and work on a long term agreement down the road, as the economy improves and/or oil retreats.

 

[jimntx]

Sounds to me like what the TWU members say is their union leadership's battle cry...WE'LL GET 'EM NEXT TIME, BOYS.

And, seriously with oil pushing $140/bbl (and I think it will hit $150 before the end of the summer), what do you REALLY think is the chance of us getting a raise that will even be noticeable after they increase medical premiums, non-rev fees, etc?

I happened to notice yesterday that non-rev charges just between DFW and STL have been increased 22%. Granted, none of us who have more than 5 years have to pay the charge if traveling in coach, but...

Also, what duty rigs will be given up in return for that "raise?" So many f/as prattle about "quality of life" yet all they look at is the bottom line on the paycheck. Work rules should be at least as important as pay.

There is a sequence on the STL bid sheet that begins with an STL-ORD leg. It is listed on the computer as a "through" flight to SAT! (Let's not even get into why someone would go to ORD from STL on the way to SAT--particularly with 10 flights/day STL-DFW and 15 flights DFW-SAT.) Ok, because it is a "through" flight, the f/as have to clean. Now comes the interesting part. The flight is scheduled to arrive ORD at 0900. It is scheduled to depart for SAT at 1045! 1 hour, 45 minutes on the ground, and they call it a through flight. Of course, the STL f/as have to change planes to go to RDU; so, it's not like they get to enjoy the 1:45 airport appreciation pause.

There are many other examples of flight routings that are nothing more than the opportunity to make the f/as clean the a/c. How much business do you suppose there is between RDU and OMA? Yet, there is an RDU-DFW-OMA through flight.

Another sequence: Day 3 of a 757 trip. Following a 9:30 layover, the crew works a transcon from LAX to MIA, sit for 3:15, then a final leg to STL. Of course, the a/c for the last leg is coming in from the Caribbean and is rarely on time. The sequence is rarely less than 2 hours late getting to STL, and it is scheduled in at 22:30.

I'm sure there are horrendous sequences like this on every bid sheet. The company does it because they can. Because hourly pay is more important to the APFA than the fact that the f/as can't pass a chair without trying it out by the end of the trip. Couple that with multiple turn lines that are 1on-2off or 2days that are 2on-2off and neither commutable. There are some issues we should be concerned about in addition to pay rate.

 

[tWade]

For an extension agreement, yes it is possible. As they said on the web site. "We have now agreed to meet with the Company. APFA’s purpose is to spend the next three weeks focused exclusively on reaching an agreement that provides immediate relief to the Flight Attendants. While success may be unlikely, if we do not at least make the effort, failure is certain."


I dont think we will see that happen. Worst case though, we can stop it with a vote.

Don't be so sure about that.
Remember, we voted one down in 2003, but APFA ignored its members and agreed to outrageous concessions anyway, including elimination of furlough pay, which might come in handy again soon for many f/as. I imagine that the AA negotiators had a second or third offer in their back pocket back in 03 but didn't have to proffer it as APFA caved so easily then. I am hoping that the current negotiating team carefully weighs the costs/benefits of contract changes and represents all the members without throwing members under the bus again. I am hopeful, maybe foolishly, that something good might come out of this. Both parties have motivations that might produce mutual benefit in these crazy times.

 

[L1011Ret]

Don't be so sure about that.
Remember, we voted one down in 2003, but APFA ignored its members and agreed to outrageous concessions anyway, including elimination of furlough pay, which might come in handy again soon for many f/as. I imagine that the AA negotiators had a second or third offer in their back pocket back in 03 but didn't have to proffer it as APFA caved so easily then. I am hoping that the current negotiating team carefully weighs the costs/benefits of contract changes and represents all the members without throwing members under the bus again. I am hopeful, maybe foolishly, that something good might come out of this. Both parties have motivations that might produce mutual benefit in these crazy times.

The current APFA administration appears as much more honest and by far less hateful than that of JW.

 

[jimntx]

I shall reserve judgement. THB et al, seemed a breath of fresh air at first.

 

[L1011Ret]

I shall reserve judgement. THB et al, seemed a breath of fresh air at first.

true enough. Pitty the current administration arriving in office just as AA is getting in dire straights and there is very little goodies to settle the contract with. The membership will slam them for not restoring pay to pre RPA levels.

 

[BigBangTheory]

Were you born that dumb, or did you have to go to school for it? I've never complained about union reps being trip removed. I complain about them being trip removed to do NOTHING for 4 years.

jim,

You're very unprofessional. How pathetic you have become. You do complain about them being trip removed all the time. If you're so unhappy...

Quit, do something about it besides bi**hing, or run for a National Officer position!

 

[jimntx]

jim,

You're very unprofessional. How pathetic you have become. You do complain about them being trip removed all the time. If you're so u happy...

Quit, keep your mouth shut or run for a National Officer position!

The day I start taking instructions from you will be a cold day in Hell. Besides, you're the one who is pathetic. You never figured out that my Blessed Order of the Perpetually Trip-Removed name for the APFA is a JOKE! Try getting a sense of humor. I hear they're on sale at Wal-Mart.

 

[BigBangTheory]

true enough. Pitty the current administration arriving in office just as AA is getting in dire straights and there is very little goodies to settle the contract with. The membership will slam them for not restoring pay to pre RPA levels.

Elections are held every 4 years. No pitty on them at all. Its just bad timing.

 

[BigBangTheory]

The day I start taking instructions from you will be a cold day in Hell. Besides, you're the one who is pathetic. You never figured out that my Blessed Order of the Perpetually Trip-Removed name for the APFA is a JOKE! Try getting a sense of humor. I hear they're on sale at Wal-Mart.

I could careless who you take instructions from. I don't think your trip removal talk is a joke. You have been bi**ing about it for a loooooong time. You are all talk and now show. As the saying goes...put your money where your mouth is. Can't get one at Wal-Mart because I don't shop at Sweat Shops.

Enjoy SLT/STL while you can because its being closed!!

 

[Mrs. McFly]

Don't be so sure about that.
Remember, we voted one down in 2003, but APFA ignored its members and agreed to outrageous concessions anyway, including elimination of furlough pay, which might come in handy again soon for many f/as. I imagine that the AA negotiators had a second or third offer in their back pocket back in 03 but didn't have to proffer it as APFA caved so easily then. I am hoping that the current negotiating team carefully weighs the costs/benefits of contract changes and represents all the members without throwing members under the bus again. I am hopeful, maybe foolishly, that something good might come out of this. Both parties have motivations that might produce mutual benefit in these crazy times.

Very true. AA set the precedent by offering short term relief to the mechanics. Although it may not have been much, it was indeed something. Personally, I feel APFA is making a smart move no matter what the motives are. A short term deal is much better than a long dragged out fight. This deal could offer protection in the near future as the airline is in a precarious position. Also, two years from now, AA could be on much more stable ground and more gains could be made. APFA, in the very least, are demonstrating the desire to work with the company which could prove to very wise in the long run.

 

[Joe Patroni]

Very true. AA set the precedent by offering short term relief to the mechanics. Although it may not have been much, it was indeed something. Personally, I feel APFA is making a smart move no matter what the motives are. A short term deal is much better than a long dragged out fight. This deal could offer protection in the near future as the airline is in a precarious position. Also, two years from now, AA could be on much more stable ground and more gains could be made. APFA, in the very least, are demonstrating the desire to work with the company which could prove to very wise in the long run.

I have to ask. What short term relief did AA offer the mechanics?