2015 Pilot Discussion.

[end_of_alpa]

But...But....I'm SPECIAL!!!!!! We own the Northeast!! I've been furloughed!! I'm a (former) USAPA PILOT FOR GOD DAMNED SAKE!!!!!

No more than a Westicle stuck in PHX.  No one feels your pain.  
 
Waiting for the Ninth.

 

[A320 Driver]

Just read APA President Keith Wilson's letter sent today to the APA membership regarding the JCBA.  Sobering.  And he does put the possible scenarios in perspective.  What really surprised me is that he revealed how he intends to vote...YES.
 
As the old saying goes: "A bird in th hand is worth two in the bush."

I've read everything I could get my hands on regarding this JCBA. A few things that stick out for me are:
-These are not section 6 negotiations.
-We were making much more progress with the NC working on negotiations before the APA BOD hijacked them and started making demands.
-Arbitration is not a slam dunk for Green Book. The company can propose buying "cost neutral" for competitive reasons and the arbitrators seem to favor the company.
-The CLT and PHL reps are playing fast and loose with the facts to secure a NO vote.

After much thought I have changed from an angry NO vote to an angry YES vote and have cast a ballot. This thing has been mishandled by management AND APA and I do not
care much for being a pawn in this game of chicken they are playing.

 

[luvthe9]

https://www.alliedpilots.org/DNN/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=FLcS%2fkdqxrk%3d&tabid=690






GOOD READ


YES/NO

Thoughts from former APA President John Darrah



Dear Fellow CLT Pilots

Above is the link to a repost of a letter included in the recent DFW update. The questions raised are enlightneing, and are one man's thoughts about the upcoming JCBA vote. Your decision yes or no, will have far reaching effects on your QOL, income and working conditions for years to come.

It is our intention to provide you with as much information as possible both pro and con to assist in your decision making process.

Please take the time to read the very valid points discussed by Captain Darrah that many of you have raised at the roadshows.

We will be publishing another update on "Trust" in the next few days

In Unity

Bob Frear

Ron Nelson









Use the following link to view this email on the APA Website:
https://public.alliedpilots.org/apa/Home/APAMemberNews/tabid/842/articleType/CategoryView/categoryId/79/Charlotte.aspx

 

[luvthe9]

 
Yes we all went into the profession eyes wide open, when I got into it pilots had a backbone, now? spineless.  One can lay down like a jelly fish, or fight to make changes.  Just because you are not happy being screwed does not mean you should quit.  Maybe if a few more pilots would actually say no to management just once in their pathetic lives small changes might take place
 
CM

Spirit airlines come to mind, And old NYCBD just wants his money because he will be gone very soon and does not have to care about what's left behind because it will have no effect on him, which is fine.

 

[snapthis]

 

 

 ​

 

A Position of Strength
The APA leadership just completed a week of joint collective bargaining agreement briefing sessions, with the national officers and briefing teams composed of Negotiating Committee members and APA department heads having visited most of the domiciles. I hope you were able to attend one of the briefing sessions or at least found time to study the JCBA educational material posted to APA Negotiations. If you attended a briefing session, then you’ve seen firsthand the spirited debate about the JCBA proposal we’re considering.
Based on everything I have seen and heard, I believe the decision before us with the JCBA is binary. Vote yes and achieve industry-leading pay rates, along with other, more modest contractual improvements in exchange for a small number of modifications to our contract consistent with industry standards. Vote no and proceed to a cost-neutral arbitration, which means forgoing immediate raises, retro pay and contractual improvements while preserving unchanged items in the contract management wants to address.
While not perfect — the lack of profit-sharing and calendar day stand out among its shortcomings — there’s no question that the JCBA delivers more value to our pilots than an arbitrated outcome, as management made clear to shareholders in a Form 8-K filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission earlier this month. In that SEC filing, management projected an increase of $650 million in pilot compensation for 2015 if pilots vote to approve the JCBA. Conversely, management projected no increase in pilot costs for 2015 if pilots vote no and we go to arbitration.
In addition to representing industry-standard practice, most of the contractual changes that management seeks are in my view essentially parochial. In other words, they’re changes affecting different segments of pilots, rather than the entire group. “Promptly” versus “reasonably available” for reserves and revised home-base time for wide-body long-haul pilots fall into the parochial category. While each item management seeks is important — particularly if it’s something that affects you personally — we need to consider the proposal in its entirety and decide whether the positive outweighs the negative.
A thoughtful analysis of other proposed changes such as two years of length of service illustrates the gains that would accrue to different segments of our pilot group. Coupled with the increased percentage of captain’s pay in the JCBA pay rates in years two through six, the LOS means that a four-year Super 80 first officer would be paid comparable to what a 12-year 767 first officer now earns, in effect providing additional incremental pay improvements to our junior-most pilots.
American Airlines CEO Doug Parker did state at a recent crew meeting in Charlotte that the JCBA might remain available to our pilots after the arbitration pending approval by the company’s board of directors, so it’s conceivable we could eventually choose between the JCBA and the arbitrators’ ruling. That’s assuming our board of directors would be willing to reconsider the same deal. I won’t venture a prediction there.
What does accrue to all the membership: the pay rates that will put American Airlines pilots at the top of our peers and “in the ballpark” with respect to total compensation. Coming so quickly after exiting bankruptcy and a merger, the pay rates alone will help drive pattern bargaining in a direction beneficial to our profession as Delta, United and Southwest each work toward new contracts in the near future.
When our peers at Delta and United emerged from their respective Chapter 11 restructurings, they did not immediately achieve industry-leading contracts. We have arguably come much further, much faster than either of those pilot groups post-Chapter 11. But instead of making such comparisons, I think we should focus on the choice before us.
We know the arbitration outcome will be cost-neutral, so do we want to wait several months, say “no thanks” to retro pay worth about $48 million each month and at best end up with what’s on the table now minus the time value of lost money? A yes vote locks in real gains now, while a no vote sends us to binding arbitration, delaying any possible prospective gains for months.
As Dirty Harry famously asked, “Do you feel lucky?” I do feel fortunate, but not about our prospects in arbitration or whether we would end up reconsidering the same deal months later. Instead, I’m grateful we’re having a vigorous debate about whether to vote yes for industry-leading pay rates and other contractual improvements 13 months after American Airlines emerged from Chapter 11 bankruptcy.
 
The notion that turning down the JCBA would produce the leverage that delivers an industry-leading contract doesn’t ring true for me. Instead, a no vote would keep our pay rates the lowest of our peers and cement us in a position of trailing our peers by a wider margin for the foreseeable future. When we enter the next round of bargaining, we would have to spend significant capital in an attempt to recoup the gains the JCBA delivers now, rather than negotiating from a position of strength and turning our focus to other contractual areas that need meaningful improvement.
 
For all of these reasons, I plan to vote yes and ask that you give serious consideration to doing the same. Above all, whether you lean for or against the JCBA, I urge you to vote. The only “wrong” choice here would be to refrain from voting. Whether you have two months, two years or most of your career remaining, we all have the same obligation to participate in the democratic process. Cast your vote — decide your future.
Thank you for your patience, support and participation.
 
 

 

[A320 Driver]

https://www.alliedpilots.org/DNN/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=FLcS%2fkdqxrk%3d&tabid=690
GOOD READ
YES/NO
Thoughts from former APA President John Darrah
Dear Fellow CLT Pilots
Above is the link to a repost of a letter included in the recent DFW update. The questions raised are enlightneing, and are one man's thoughts about the upcoming JCBA vote. Your decision yes or no, will have far reaching effects on your QOL, income and working conditions for years to come.
It is our intention to provide you with as much information as possible both pro and con to assist in your decision making process.
Please take the time to read the very valid points discussed by Captain Darrah that many of you have raised at the roadshows.
We will be publishing another update on "Trust" in the next few days
In Unity
Bob Frear
Ron Nelson
Use the following link to view this email on the APA Website:https://public.alliedpilots.org/apa/Home/APAMemberNews/tabid/842/articleType/CategoryView/categoryId/79/Charlotte.aspx

"Pro and con"???
About 95/5 con the way I read it...

 

[nevergiveup]

But...But....I'm SPECIAL!!!!!! We own the Northeast!! I've been furloughed!! I'm a (former) USAPA PILOT FOR GOD DAMNED SAKE!!!!!

Move, you're too much!

 

[luvthe9]

"Pro and con"???
About 95/5 con the way I read it...

Sorry, just trying to put as much info out as possible for this vote.

 

[A320 Driver]

I respect that. I wasn't referring to you. I was speaking about the CLT/PHL reps that seem to be emphasizing the bad stuff much more than the good.

 

[luvthe9]

How can we ever get ahead if we always quit while we’re behind?

Fellow MIA pilots,

Some members have asked, “if we reject management’s current proposal, where is the union’s leverage to get something better?” This presents what may be the most compelling paradox within our current circumstance. On the one hand, we probably all still have a lingering bad taste from the coerced concessions we ate during bankruptcy, so we have no real appetite for enduring even more concessions, especially when coupled with a pay increase that still leaves us compensated far behind our peers. By the same token, it may be difficult for you to vote NO unless you can see we possess sufficient leverage or an advantageous bargaining position, and that the union leadership will be willing to stand and fight.

You are only worth what you are willing to negotiate: APA headquarters hasn't broadcast their intentions in the event of a rejection, so we offer the following thoughts for your consideration. Some of these items are particularly important, as they do not require any action other than simply voting NO. Considering the decision before you and the high priority placed on career earnings and quality-of-work-life (QWL), combined with the fact that this JCBA will likely be our contract for the next 10 years, we urge you to read and digest the information below. We are confident that doing so will enlighten you to positional advantages you did not previously realize, making you much more comfortable with the notion of rejecting this management LBFO. Remember, you are only worth what you are willing to negotiate, that is unless you really want to quit while you’re behind.

Risk versus reward: The reward awaits you while the risks are largely mitigated:
1.The existing MTA has an obligatory implementation schedule with which it seems clear management will be able unable to comply: a.There are still over 36 yet-to-be-implemented provisions of the MTA, most of which are things that APA sought in bargaining. A negotiated new JCBA agreement would relieve management of their implementation deadlines under the MTA, while the arbitration process can offer no such relief and, in fact, the arbitration panel would almost certainly impose an implementation schedule that management has obviously been avoiding.
b.The MTA provides for system-wide separation of Domestic and International divisions (just as we operate now at AA) with an implementation schedule. Without a new JCBA agreement, in addition to not merging divisions at AA, management is obliged to “unbundle” the existing combined operations at LUS to provide for traditional LAA four-part bid statuses. The MTA obligates this “unbundling” absent any agreement otherwise, and yet it is clear management has made no plans to comply with this provision of the MTA. The arbitration panel may well fix that problem by ordering a timeline for management to align LUS with LAA in accordance with the Green Book/MTA.

2.Restrictions on management’s stock payout: Key top executives including Messrs. Parker and Kirby are in line to receive several large “tranches” of stock based upon reaching certain merger milestones (See AAG 8-K Filing, December 9, 2013)[1]. Without an agreement with APA, it may be difficult for them to satisfy the conditions needed to receive their distribution.
3.Mr. Parker’s annual compensation can’t exceed Delta until we get paid like Delta: In making the above disbursement schedule, the AAG Board considered Mr. Parker’s commitment “to maintain his annual target total compensation below his peers at Delta Airlines and United Airlines until the compensation payable to the Company’s [pilots and larger work groups] are adjusted in line with such peers.” (See AAG 8-K Filing, December 9, 2013)[1].
4.The pilots will not have agreed to the “Excise Tax” plan. Management is applying that plan to all other employee groups. Going forward in a manner that treats pilots differently from all other employees would be an untenable example contrary to the “one size fits all” corporate agenda. If APA does not agree to management’s proposal, the Company’s unionized employees will not be boot strapped by the following language; “Notwithstanding the foregoing, the provisions of this Paragraph shall not be effective if, after the effective date of this Agreement, the Company enters into any new or amended collective bargaining agreement having a term of three (3) years or more with any union group that does not contain a provision substantially similar to this Paragraph.” - Proposal Language in Letter 15-02.
5.The AAL/US Airways merger will head further in the direction of the UAL/CAL merger. Investors have balked at how long it is taking United Continental to achieve “net synergies.” Four years after United’s merger with Continental Airlines, United Continental ranks next to last in J.D. Power’s 2014 airline satisfaction ranking[2], is No. 1 among major airlines in bumping passengers involuntarily and ranked only eighth or ninth out of 14 carriers in on-time arrivals through most of last year. For investors, the deal’s benefits have been as slow to appear as some tardy United jets. (See Bloomberg News, January 21, 2015)[3].

Pay No Attention to that Man Behind the Curtain: It should be apparent to anyone that management’s recent conduct and rush on proposals are designed to fulfill the stock vesting requirements of the AAG 8-K Filing, December 9, 2013 [1]. At the very least, top management has personal financial interest in “achieving at least $1 billion in net synergies with respect to fiscal year 2015 or 2016,” but Mr. Parker has also committed to “maintain his annual target total compensation below his peers at Delta Airlines and United Airlines until the compensation payable to the Company’s larger work groups are adjusted in line with such peers.” That means he can’t be compensated like the Delta or United CEOs until our compensation is “adjusted” (increased) to be “in line with such peers.” While management might argue they can achieve $1 billion in “net synergies” on our backs if we agree, the fact is that our total compensation - including
profit sharing - would then not be in line with our peers, so Mr. Parker would be unable to receive total annual compensation higher than the Delta or United CEOs, and that could easily delay his receipt of his stock distribution.

Fulfill Current Obligations Before Agreeing to New Ones: As a reminder, in the event we reject management’s LBFO, when the arbitration panel fashions the JCBA it must do so exclusively in accordance with existing provisions of the MTA. The arbitration panel may well impose implementation deadlines for the 36+ outstanding items from the MTA that have yet to be implemented. Conversely, if we ratify management’s latest LBFO, there is no telling when the 36+ items would be implemented, if ever, because there is no contractual implementation schedule within their LBFO (for any of the outstanding issues or any of the new features).

It’s Greed, Not Need: It boils down to a question of greed or need. The top AAG managers appear to be motivated by greed, not need. We are not inclined to reward their greedy behavior or subsidize their lavish lifestyle, particularly after they openly stated their distain for pilots. After all, just a couple of months ago, in response to a question about profit-sharing for employees, Mr. Parker bluntly stated that, “it’s just not the right way to pay 100,000 employees that don’t have that much impact on the daily profits.” There you have it: Mr. Parker believes that pilots “don’t have that much impact on daily profits” and he is obviously not interested in compensating us like our peers at Delta and United who do have profit sharing. Management’s LBFO leaves us considerably lagging when compared to what we know will be 2015 Delta pilot W2 earnings and, what’s worse, that’s based on a contract that both ALPA and Delta management have
committed to amend before the end of this year. Remember, this is about total compensation; it is not just limited to just hourly pay rates. Even if Delta ALPA only achieves a small hourly rate increase, their 2016 W2 earnings will almost certainly still include profit sharing or other compensation improvements landing them some 20% higher than our own management’s LBFO compensation proposal of today.

If Not Now, When? Remember, what you are voting on is another management LBFO that has simply been passed along to you, apparently as some sort of ploy by management to question the union’s legitimacy. Management runs a business, not a charity. They make business proposals to create agreements that are most beneficial to them and nobody else, and this time is no different. They are attempting to get off on the cheap at your expense. You just gave away the store in bankruptcy, brought some new folks in with the hope it would change the culture, but now find that you’re right back in it with lowball offers from disrespectful executives and are being asked to concede again. If we cannot get our rightful due in the current market, with billions in profits, then when? When will we ever?

They have the money and we have the leverage. NOW is the time.

Captain Thomas Copeland
First Officer Tom Gallagher

 

[luvthe9]

"2.Restrictions on management’s stock payout: Key top executives including Messrs. Parker and Kirby are in line to receive several large “tranches” of stock based upon reaching certain merger milestones (See AAG 8-K Filing, December 9, 2013)[1]. Without an agreement with APA, it may be difficult for them to satisfy the conditions needed to receive their distribution.
3.Mr. Parker’s annual compensation can’t exceed Delta until we get paid like Delta: In making the above disbursement schedule, the AAG Board considered Mr. Parker’s commitment “to maintain his annual target total compensation below his peers at Delta Airlines and United Airlines until the compensation payable to the Company’s [pilots and larger work groups] are adjusted in line with such peers.” (See AAG 8-K Filing, December 9, 2013)[1]."

 

[EastUS1]

 
 
 

 

 ​

 
A Position of Strength
 
 

 

 
So why all the concessions then? Why ANY concessions at all? If this is supposedly "industry leading", then where's the profit sharing, just for starters? "industry leading" my arse! This thing's a recipe for quickly becoming the lowest both compensated and quality of life pilots in the big 3 airlines for at least a decade. How do people not see that? Why accept anything with language that leaves the door wide open to hose everyone on future medical expenses? If this is supposedly a show of "Strength" well, I'd rather commune with jellyfish.

 

[EastCheats]

No more than a Westicle stuck in PHX.  No one feels your pain.  
 
Waiting for the Ninth.

Phoenix is my home what makes you think I am stuck or in pain? I'm glad you are happily waiting on the appeal the West filed:

22 April 2014.
Today, the West class filed a notice of appeal with Judge Silver's court.

" The Clerk at the Ninth Circuit will receive a copy of this notice and they will initiate their process of docketing our case, and the West attorneys will soon file a notice to the Ninth Circuit which designates the parties to the appeal."

Single Carrier Status (APA takes over)

"A finding of SCS will quickly eliminate USAPAs role as our collective bargaining agent (CBA), and thereafter it will be legally barred from representing anyone. The Allied Pilots Association (APA) will become the CBA for all American Airlines pilots, just as USAPA became the CBA for all US Airways pilots when it was certified by the NMB."

Fast forward to after the arbitration order granting the West a seat:

"As we all know, the primary purpose of USAPA was to remove any and all authority America West pilots had with regard to the bargaining rights over our seniority, and hand those rights to the East pilots who could then attempt to unilaterally dictate new seniority terms to us. The Preliminary Arbitration Award (PAA) affirmatively returns those rights to their rightful owners: the America West pilots. In other words, we have now officially survived USAPA's reign and have once again assured that our seniority rights can ONLY be resolved according to fair and equitable principles in a fair and equitable process."

"Today's news also means that the burden of defending or bringing seniority-related lawsuits is no longer that of the West pilots."

Best of luck trying to get U-decertified reinstated as the bargaining rep and convincing the 9th dual-unionism should be allowed.

 

[EastUS1]

How can we ever get ahead if we always quit while we’re behind?

 
Indeed. Sign me off as just plain disgusted with Wilson and this whole bunch of impatient invertebrates. Oh well...Life goes on. "A Position of Strength"? Yet it's time to vote in yet more concessions during a time of never before seen profits?...Thanks for the laughs Wilson. That's surely some truly impressive "Strength" being shown.
 
"As Dirty Harry famously asked, “Do you feel lucky?” I do feel fortunate, but not about our prospects in arbitration or whether we would end up reconsidering the same deal months later." English translation: The mighty APA's very President subconciously sees himself as the pathetic little punk with the gun pointed toward him, and elevates the likes of purple tutu attired bufoons to somehow being "Dirty Harry". If all this juvenile idiocy didn't properly make me want to vomit; I'd have to just laugh. Oh wait, the laughters coming after all. I almost forgot the following line: "When we enter the next round of bargaining, "
 
"the next round of bargaining"? As in the same round that's being completely surrendered for years by by voting yes? Yeah, sigh...No doubt that everyone will evolve brains, magically grow spines, and generally just get really, really tough by then...whenever that oh-so-perfect year for "the next round" even finally shows up.

 

[EastUS1]

The notion that turning down the JCBA would produce the leverage that delivers an industry-leading contract doesn’t ring true for me.

 
Then Wilson, you're a pathetic excuse for a union "leader" and should find another job..Period.