2015 Pilot Discussion.

[EastUS1]

Maybe you are so self-absorbed or soaked in alcohol to notice the previous posts by your USAPIAN buddies. Faith with the APA? I went to the meeting when they were in town and made the obvious choice based on their presentation. I don't listen to Courtney's misinformed opinions or his imaginary Delta jumpseaters.

 
Umm hmm. "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought.."...."I went to the meeting when they were in town and made the obvious choice based on their presentation." Might one specifically ask what made your decision "the obvious choice", versus "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought.."...? You're obviously proud of your vote. I'm just asking what your basis for both the vote and the pride are...?
 
"Maybe you are so self-absorbed.." Not-so-much in this case at all. I've a short time left in the airline world, and if this passes, could just chuckle at the extra bit of chump change such as yourself would add to my remaining work here, but you will be the ones living with the products of any concessions now eagerly accepted for many years to come.

 

[CactusPilot1]

Umm hmm. "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought.."...."I went to the meeting when they were in town and made the obvious choice based on their presentation." Might one specifically ask what made your decision "the obvious choice", versus "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought.."...? You're obviously proud of your vote. I'm just asking what your basis for both the vote and the pride are...?
 
"Maybe you are so self-absorbed.." Not-so-much in this case at all. I've a short time left in the airline world, and if this passes, could just chuckle at the extra bit of chump change such as yourself would add to my remaining work here, but you will be the ones living with the products of any concessions now eagerly accepted for many years to come.

Vote NO for all I care. Roll the dice. Just be sure not to blame George Nicolau for the results of the arbitration you certainly will be complaining about in the future.

 

[EastUS1]

Vote NO for all I care. Roll the dice. Just be sure not to blame George Nicolau for the results of the arbitration you certainly will be complaining about in the future.

 
"Vote NO for all I care. Roll the dice." Careful there son, you're coming dangerously close to "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought.."   It's no dice roll for me. I gain a few bucks for the duration of my time if this passes, but almost cannot believe that in a time of record profits, that people are even discussing, much less actually considering additional concessions. Exactly what sort of "leverage" might you even imagine would be available for the next time a contract's to be "negotiated"? Management's derisively laughing at the pilot group already.  Per "the results of the arbitration you certainly will be complaining about in the future."..? Seriously? Speaking of "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought.."
 
P.S. I must guess my earlier question was a bit troublesome to directly address: "Might one specifically ask what made your decision "the obvious choice", versus "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought.."...? You're obviously proud of your vote. I'm just asking what your basis for both the vote and the pride are...?"

 

[luvthe9]

Did you vote yet?
2015 APA - AA Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement Amendment Vote
Vote Receipt
Confirmation Number: xxxxxxxx
I vote as indicated on the JCBA between the Allied Pilots Association and American Airlines.
[ X ] I vote to APPROVE the JCBA between the Allied Pilots Association and American Airlines.

Good for you, You do have a history with AWA of keeping salaries low so I would not expect that to change. Ask a Delta guy what they are looking at for there contract. Like I said before some has to be the lowest paid might as well be us again.

 

[luvthe9]

{

 

[CactusPilot1]

Good for you, You do have a history with AWA of keeping salaries low so I would not expect that to change. Ask a Delta guy what they are looking at for there contract. Like I said before some has to be the lowest paid might as well be us again.

The ALPAArbitration Board
-------------------------------------------------------------x
In the Matter of the Seniority Integration of
The Pilots of US Airways, Inc.
and
The Pilots of America West Airlines, Inc.

Gains also came in other ways. Though the US Airway pilots
argue that the collective bargaining agreements are comparable, that
is not the case. In pay, the America West Contract is better for
comparable aircraft except for the B757. Though A330 and B767 pay did
not exist at America West, those 19 aircraft are only 5% of the
combined fleet and the B757s only add another 13%. The bulk of the
fleet (81%) is comprised of the 292 A320s and B737s, where America
West's higher rates, even without increases that a combined contract
may bring, will result in a collective benefit to US Airways pilots of $23 million a year.
There are other benefits that will accrue to US Airways pilots in the
form of increased vacations, higher caps and pay guarantees as well as salaries,
that would have been unachievable until, at the earliest, the December 31, 2009
amendable date of the US Airways/ ALPA agreement.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I'm sure this was Nicolau's fault too....did he make the numbers up?

 

[usabusdriver]

 
No, not really.  The west committee, though required, is appointed by the APA.  Disagree too much, and the APA can unilaterally fire your nitwit committee, and appoint another.

 
 
Would that not also work for the former usapa committee?

 

[EastUS1]

Gains also came in other ways. ...
I'm sure this was Nicolau's fault too....did he make the numbers up?

 
CactusPilot1: Did you vote yet? [ X ] I vote to APPROVE the JCBA between the Allied Pilots Association and American Airlines." 
 
Umm....So who's fault is it now, for knowlngly voting in favor of yet more pilot concessions during a time of almost obscene, all time record profits? Do "you'se" even begin to understand "the numbers" versus what you're so eagerly and even proudly surrendering? I've not the slightest doubt that you've a virtual cornucopia of well considered reasons to offer in reply, sans any tainted flavoring of "Hysterical....emotion, not rational thought..", yet you seem surprisingly unwilling to share so much as even one such "thought". What might those reasons be? Just consider all the affirming support and gained yes votes you might find from forwarding "you'se" wisdom?
 

 

[nycbusdriver]

 
 
Would that not also work for the former usapa committee?

 
The arbitrators did not rule that APA must appoint a committee for the east pilots, did they?  Did I miss that statement?
 
The east committee relies on the McCaskill-Bond Law for its existence.  The west committee, by definition, depends on th APA appointments for its existence.

 

[CactusPilot1]

CactusPilot1: Did you vote yet? [ X ] I vote to APPROVE the JCBA between the Allied Pilots Association and American Airlines." 
 
Umm....So who's fault is it now, for knowlngly voting in favor of yet more pilot concessions during a time of almost obscene, all time record profits?

Fuel prices are low now but history shows we a a crisis away sky high oil prices again which leaves the door open for ParKirby to say we can't even match the previous offer. I doubt they will stay this low regardless.

Like I said, vote NO if you want to roll the dice in arbitration. Just don't blame the arbitrator for buying ParKirby's argument.

 

[CactusPilot1]

The arbitrators did not rule that APA must appoint a committee for the east pilots, did they?  Did I miss that statement?
 
The east committee relies on the McCaskill-Bond Law for its existence.  The west committee, by definition, depends on th APA appointments for its existence.

East pilots and West pilots have the same rights. You get a seat, we get a seat. Period

 

[EastUS1]

 
The arbitrators did not rule that APA must appoint a committee for the east pilots, did they?  Did I miss that statement?
 
The east committee relies on the McCaskill-Bond Law for its existence.  The west committee, by definition, depends on th APA appointments for its existence.

 
"The west committee, by definition, depends on the APA appointments for its existence." As well as composition, one might surmise, but, were I sitting with the APA's table; I'd much prefer to square off against the umm.."Army of Leonidas" Reps, as currently constituted, than risk facing any people with actual brains.

 

[EastUS1]

Fuel prices are low now but history shows we a a crisis away sky high oil prices again which leaves the door open for ParKirby to say we can't even match the previous offer. I doubt they will stay this low regardless.

Like I said, vote NO if you want to roll the dice in arbitration. Just don't blame the arbitrator for buying ParKirby's argument.

 
Ah! So it's an issue of always-and-forever looming disaster, and one must simply take whatever scraps are suitable from management's table and be thankful...even during a time of never before even dreamed of profits? Do you also assume that Delta's people and ops will be economicially stricken in the foreseeable future, so that simply having some patience for the long run would prove fruitless to all here? Predictable raises are already, contractually in place, with the added benefit of being able to enter into new (and perhaps even actual this time) negotiations in just a matter of months. What's the rush to surrender ANYTHING for just a few, more quickly gained, shiney pennies now based on? I honestly just don't get it.
 
"Just don't blame the arbitrator for buying ParKirby's argument." Is it your belief then, that the absurd concessions now demanded from them can be magically obtained in arbitration, so why not just vote them into being instead? Please explain a bit further, if you will. All east-west/west-east nyaah nyaahs aside; I simply do not understand how anyone with many years yet to work, would willingly choose ANY concessions, especially at this time.

 

[nycbusdriver]

 
"The west committee, by definition, depends on the APA appointments for its existence." As well as composition, one might surmise, but, were I sitting with the APA's table; I'd much prefer to square off against the umm.."Army of Leonidas" Reps, as currently constituted, than risk facing any people with actual brains.

 
I know that there are many pilots with "actual brains" on the west.  We don't hear from any of them, though.  And, having actual brains, they are smart enough not to get into union BS, and hence the whack-a-doodles that "rise to the top" of the west leadership.
 
If they were smart, the APA would appoint the west committee from within the top 15 or 20 (minus any Ansett scabs) on the west seniority list.  

 

[EastUS1]

 
I know that there are many pilots with "actual brains" on the west.  We don't hear from any of them, though.  And, having actual brains, they are smart enough not to get into union BS, and hence the whack-a-doodles that "rise to the top" of the west leadership.
 
If they were smart, the APA would appoint the west committee from within the top 15 or 20 Minus any Ansett scabs) on the west seniority list.  

 
Agreed.