2014 Fleet Service Discussion

[ograc]

I do not believe, if an election is ordered, the choice will be between the TWU the IAM or no representation at all. It is my understanding, based on the co representation agreement, already in place between the TWU and the IAM (the Association), the ballot choice will be representation by the new "Association" or to not be represented at all. Let's wait for direction from the NMB. In the meantime... drawing comparisons of advantages or disadvantages of either union is unnecessary, premature and somewhat divisive. Going forward; the combined workforce needs to focus on unity and solidarity. It's in everyone's best interest. Let's fall in! 

 

[rockit2]

Just throwing this out...................how long does it take you to get from your parking area into your work area? It takes me about a half of an hour each way. In the UPCOMING NEGOTIATIONS, does anyone think it would be absurd to ask for some type of compensation for this extra time we take just to get on the property?

 

[cltrat]

I don't think it's absurd at all rockit.
 
you must be here at CLT where even on a good day the parking /bus situation is terrible and a bad day is next to impossible.
and it's usually just as bad trying to get to your car leaving.

 

[28L_or_10R?]

I don't think it's absurd at all rockit.
 
you must be here at CLT where even on a good day the parking /bus situation is terrible and a bad day is next to impossible.
and it's usually just as bad trying to get to your car leaving.

God forbid your shift starts at 1430. Good luck finding a space.

 

[cltrat]

God forbid your shift starts at 1430. Good luck finding a space.

mine is it's like the mall at Christmas

 

[Jester]

Just throwing this out...................how long does it take you to get from your parking area into your work area? It takes me about a half of an hour each way. In the UPCOMING NEGOTIATIONS, does anyone think it would be absurd to ask for some type of compensation for this extra time we take just to get on the property?

 
Some have raised that issue around PHX with the partial migration of some agents to 44th Street and Washington station (with the eventual plan to move everyone to that location and the addtional parking garage under construction.)  While the train station is very clean and modern and a public facilities "white elephant" meant to (unsuccessfully) appeal to the flying public regardless of inconvience, the outer edges of the lot to the train platfom is hike, and the tram ride adds another 5-6 minutes to the terminals.  Then it is more inconvient walking to the actual work place.  So figure about 25 minutes from car to workplace using the outer employee parking lot.

 

[ograc]

Just throwing this out...................how long does it take you to get from your parking area into your work area? It takes me about a half of an hour each way. In the UPCOMING NEGOTIATIONS, does anyone think it would be absurd to ask for some type of compensation for this extra time we take just to get on the property?

Maybe 10 minutes at the most. Of course you know I work in a smaller outline station. However, we work under the same policies and procedures. I think the issue warrants attention in future talks. I see the members in the larger stations being disadvantaged by at least 30 minutes a day. Then again; there is job security in the hubs and larger stations.

 

[NYer]

Not sure why the idea of an Association is so negative. It allows most Members to stay with the union they're comfortable with and have invested in.

With that said, it seems the biggest contention is merely the ability to have a vote. The simple act of voting or not voting is what many are basing their opinion on whether they like the Association?

OK, let's say we have a vote and either the TWU or the IAM wins that vote. Does everyone believe the combined memberships will live in harmony? I don't. It is far more likely that the losing party will be in a continuous battle to get a card drive going in order to get their choice back in power.

Why would we want to go through that when those that want the IAM can keep them and those that want the TWU can also keep them, at least the majority would be able to.

At a time when unity and solidarity in unionism is what would work best for us, I can't understand the advocacy to create a chaotic atmosphere for the mere sake of an illusion of choice.

The APA is taking over the USAPA membership and the APFA is taking over the membership from the AFA in mutually agreed to terms. For the TWU and especially the IAM that would be very difficult to do (because of the multi-employer pension and the multi-employer medical). However, the Association gives each membership group the ability to keep what they value and move towards a better contract sooner rather than later, with minimal disruption to our current status.

 

[freedom]

Well there are some problems ...

What about TWU members who would like to become IAM members and enroll in the pension. ..

And what of IAM workers who would like to leave the pension and join the TWU 401K?


It's the small fact that the unions we are a part of tend to lock us into either this retirement route or that one ...

I'm OK with the IAM pension today so I'm not looking to jump ship but who knows how others feel ..

 

[737823]

Freedom AA/TWU 401K is far superior than the IAMNPF which is just for straight time, AA covers overtime and shift premiums.

Josh

 

[Jester]

Freedom AA/TWU 401K is far superior than the IAMNPF which is just for straight time, AA covers overtime and shift premiums.

Josh

 
That's alittle hasty to make a judgment without the use of any numbers and the underlying assumptions.
 
Probably the most fair way would be to examine the Company matching amount of the 401K (thus excluding the employee contribution as the employee isn't paying for their pension) to a retirement date using reasonable estimated market returns up to calculate a future value.  Compare that figure against a discounted cash flow to the retirement amount of the IAMNPF benefit based upon life expectancy with the same estimated rate of return as the discount rate.
 
This method would focus on the same retirement date, recognize the time-value of money in both net present valuations and provide fair means to make an intelligent comparison.

 

[ograc]

To be represented by the Association or to have no bargaining representative at all; that is the question. That will be the choice the combined Fleet work groups will have to make. Let it be known... under the new election procedures of the NMB, 50% + 1 of the ballots cast will the determining factor. Comparing the pros and cons of being represented by either union is irrelevant at this point. It is my understanding... the choice, going forward, will be Union represented (by the Association) or employee at will.

 

[Jester]

Maybe 10 minutes at the most. Of course you know I work in a smaller outline station. However, we work under the same policies and procedures. I think the issue warrants attention in future talks. I see the members in the larger stations being disadvantaged by at least 30 minutes a day. Then again; there is job security in the hubs and larger stations.

 
Here's the Express (Sky)Train to Hell to be followed by a circuitous and lengthy hike to the work place...
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZkL_JxY2DE
 
I am sure all of us PHX people will be moved out there eventually once the new inconvient parking garage under contruction is eventually opened, so figure a solid 30 minutes to get to work once that happens.

 

[NYer]

Well there are some problems ...
What about TWU members who would like to become IAM members and enroll in the pension. ..
And what of IAM workers who would like to leave the pension and join the TWU 401K?
It's the small fact that the unions we are a part of tend to lock us into either this retirement route or that one ...
I'm OK with the IAM pension today so I'm not looking to jump ship but who knows how others feel ..

In the Joint contract everyone will be given a one time chance to either go for the matching 401K or the IAMPF. For most, that choice is fairly simple...stay where they are. It would silly to change and start saving for your retirement from scratch. That's because most Members are already heavily invested in one or the other. The newbies or those young enough (20's and 30's) can try to determine which option better fits their needs as both options have flaws.

With the Association each group will be able to rely on what they currently have.

 

[NYer]

That's alittle hasty to make a judgment without the use of any numbers and the underlying assumptions.
 
Probably the most fair way would be to examine the Company matching amount of the 401K (thus excluding the employee contribution as the employee isn't paying for their pension) to a retirement date using reasonable estimated market returns up to calculate a future value.  Compare that figure against a discounted cash flow to the retirement amount of the IAMNPF benefit based upon life expectancy with the same estimated rate of return as the discount rate.
 
This method would focus on the same retirement date, recognize the time-value of money in both net present valuations and provide fair means to make an intelligent comparison.

Break it down further. The IAMPF contributes $1.15 for up to 40 hours per Member. (PT rates are lower, correct?)

The 401K contributes the equivalent of about $1.25 to $1.35 for Fleet Service Clerks & Crew Chiefs and close to $2 for Mechanics, assuming the 5.5% match. Those contributions are for all hours worked.