Working At AA......

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

Since you constantly cry, ####, piss, and moan about what SWA AMTs make compared to what you make

never cried pissed or moaned about the difference between us and southwest. I hope one day they will set the standard in the industry for pay.

They should dump heavy maintanence and have 4 AMTs per aircraft. I sure hope you are in the top 2800 on the seniority list.But you are right that SWA does not do heavy overhaul

If it would make AA profitable enough to turn a profit and pay better then yes. And no I am not in the 2800 class. But one day would be and thus make a decent wage.

What is dilusional about basic mathematics

It is noy basic math. Different checks require different types of man power. It is not as basic as you claim it to be.

and insults

Sorry for the insult but I couldnt resist

 

[Garfield1966]

Justify the purchase of twa

From what I remember reading in the business papers, it was mainly about STL, Expansion and a cheaper way to do it. We were expanding a t a pretty god clip from what I recall, DFW and ORD were packed to the gills and we needed another hub somewhere in the middle of the country. STL was the perfect spot. In the deal we would get a decent number of aircrafts we could keep, dump the rest, employees to operate/repair/board said aircrafts and we could be come the number one carrier in the US overnight with out the long drawn out process of growing slowly.

Then there was 9/11 and al that went down the drain. As I recall, most of the financial any lists seem to think it was quite a good idea at the time.

I am sure you sent in your letter to indicate why it was not a good idea right? I am sure you had an itemized list of why the transaction was not wise and that you came up with an alternate idea right? Of course you did, and I'll bet it was even better than your SWA idea.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

Ah, the entitlement to bitc# argument... one of my all-time favorites.

Actually, it was posted (somewhat tongue in cheek) in the sense that we, as employees, are entitled, while non-employees are not. Skymess had posted, "We do enough of that ourselves without some newbie bi%cher adding to the mix!"
Some posts by non-employees are downright antagonistic. Losers, get a life.

So, to overstate a little, we are entitled, and outsiders are not. Some of us who work here feel that we have been wronged about something or other, so there is a reason. Why do outsiders seem to have so much need to get into it? Certainly they haven't been wronged by the company or the unions or whomever. I wonder if they go to other gatherings and insert themselves into conversations and start arguments. Of course, some posing as non-employees are AA management.

Some of you guys would complain regardless. If AA gave you a 50% raise, in six months you'd be complaining again.

Yeah, I knew you were going to say that. What a novel and interesting observation. Did you hear any mechs complain about our 2001 raise?

Get a life. Get real.

 

[Skymess]

From what I remember reading in the business papers, it was mainly about STL, Expansion and a cheaper way to do it. We were expanding a t a pretty god clip from what I recall, DFW and ORD were packed to the gills and we needed another hub somewhere in the middle of the country. STL was the perfect spot. In the deal we would get a decent number of aircrafts we could keep, dump the rest, employees to operate/repair/board said aircrafts and we could be come the number one carrier in the US overnight with out the long drawn out process of growing slowly.

Then there was 9/11 and al that went down the drain. As I recall, most of the financial any lists seem to think it was quite a good idea at the time.

I am sure you sent in your letter to indicate why it was not a good idea right? I am sure you had an itemized list of why the transaction was not wise and that you came up with an alternate idea right? Of course you did, and I'll bet it was even better than your SWA idea.

It all went down the drain the minute that fool Carty picked up the reins. He was a dullard from day one. We used to call his hotline just to hear his stupid voice and laugh. He sounded like Lennie from Of Mice and Men.

The ENTIRE company knew the TWA purchase was a losing proposition. I didn't hear one person think the purchase was a good idea. Not one. That was BEFORE 9/11.

Then once 9/11 happened Carty proved he was an even bigger loser than we thought he was by just hanging out and not making any moves to save the company as we slid further and further into the cesspool. He just left things business as usual instead of immediately cutting the schedule and workforce. Instead we just flew thousands of empty planes around the world for months on end with no passengers to be found anywhere near the terminals and with no passengers purchasing any tickets.

He just watched as we imploded and then tried to take his big SERP bonus after he insisted the only way to get the company running again was to take money from labor.

 

[AMFAMAN]

Management decisions are easy to question in hindsight, but if you think rationally they are also easy to justify.

How do you justify the new 767 business class seats purchase?

 

[Garfield1966]

The ENTIRE company knew the TWA purchase was a losing proposition. I didn't hear one person think the purchase was a good idea. Not one. That was BEFORE 9/11.

I guess we move in different circles. I do not recall many people in the company having an opinion one way or the other. People at AA are just like most people in the rest of the country. Uninformed and self absorbed. Now when the sh1t hits the fan they are the first to tell you "I told you so" but they are happily oblivious until they hit the wall.

The reasoning behind the purchase made sense, at least to me. Most of what I read supported the purchase but of course hind sight is 20/20.

I did hear lots of folks bitching about their own little world as far as their seniority and bidding prospects and how TWA would be integrated / screwed into the seniority list but I heard very little if any comments about the advantages/disadvantages of the purchase it self.

 

[eolesen]

He just left things business as usual instead of immediately cutting the schedule and workforce.

I guess I imagined the thousands of people laid off between 2001 and 2003 who never came back to AA, including several people who used to report directly to me. My department used to have eight or nine analysts. Today, it's down to five.

My wife (who I still report to) had her job eliminated in one of the countless re-org's that HDQ went thru, and there are still entire sections of HDQ that are empty, despite having consolidated from four buildings down to just two.

I guess I also imagined all the aircraft retirements and deferred deliveries...

Instead we just flew thousands of empty planes around the world for months on end with no passengers to be found anywhere near the terminals and with no passengers purchasing any tickets.

Stick to "chicken or beef" because math ain't your strong suit.

Load factors for Nov and Dec 2001 were about 65%, which isn't great, but it's still two out of every three seats occupied.

Average LF for both 2002 and 2003 was around 70%. Summer loads for both 2002 and 2003 exceeded 75%.

Yields sucked, but there was certainly no shortage of customers to fill seats.

 

[AMFAMAN]

I did hear lots of folks bitching about their own little world as far as their seniority and bidding prospects and how TWA would be integrated / screwed into the seniority list but I heard very little if any comments about the advantages/disadvantages of the purchase it self.

Had been on the floor where the real work is done and not in some isolated office, you might hear what the workers are saying. Everyone I know said it was a stupid move from day one. It was a reactionary, "my airline is bigger than yours," reponse to UAL/USAIR merger. We all fully expected that TWA after the merger would enjoy the same burial ground fate as the two previous mergers, Air Cal and Reno Air. But on the flipside, look at all the money that some executives and lawyers walked away with because of these mergers.

 

[Wretched Wrench]

I remember publicly saying, "This is the worst thing that has ever happened at AA. No good will come of it." I couldn't have defended that statement to a table full of MBAs but I really had a bad feeling.

 

[Garfield1966]

Had been on the floor where the real work is done and not in some isolated office,

Never been to Crew skd / flt academy huh?

BTW. Can you plz supply a definition of what "real work" is. Thanks

 

[Oneflyer]

How do you justify the new 767 business class seats purchase?

Quite simply, AA needs to stay competitive with other carriers. As to the specific type, lets see what happens when the customers sit in them not just see a picture.

 

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

From what I remember reading in the business papers, it was mainly about STL, Expansion and a cheaper way to do it. We were expanding a t a pretty god clip from what I recall, DFW and ORD were packed to the gills and we needed another hub somewhere in the middle of the country. STL was the perfect spot. In the deal we would get a decent number of aircrafts we could keep, dump the rest, employees to operate/repair/board said aircrafts and we could be come the number one carrier in the US overnight with out the long drawn out process of growing slowly.

Then there was 9/11 and al that went down the drain. As I recall, most of the financial any lists seem to think it was quite a good idea at the time.

I am sure you sent in your letter to indicate why it was not a good idea right? I am sure you had an itemized list of why the transaction was not wise and that you came up with an alternate idea right? Of course you did, and I'll bet it was even better than your SWA idea.

Yes actually i did send my letter of recomendation.
They should have listened.
TWA would have went out of business and AA could have purchased it for a quarter of what it cost to take it over. As for the Aircfaft most are in the desert.

Great planning :down:

 

[Oneflyer]

Yes actually i did send my letter of recomendation.
They should have listened.
TWA would have went out of business and AA could have purchased it for a quarter of what it cost to take it over. As for the Aircfaft most are in the desert.

Great planning :down:

Well maybe you should have gone into management. If you aren't willing to take on the responsibility, get the education, and do the work, then you don't have much right to #### when management screws up. You chose your career and its not one that includes strategic decision making, live with it or put in for management job.

 

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

Well maybe you should have gone into management. If you aren't willing to take on the responsibility, get the education, and do the work, then you don't have much right to #### when management screws up. You chose your career and its not one that includes strategic decision making, live with it or put in for management job.

I was in Mgmt at PAA and it was not the ass kissing suck up types I see at AArogant Air.
So I will pass this time around.
Want to keep my knees clean

 

[Garfield1966]

Just so that I understand correctly. PAA = Pan American Airways? The Airline that is no longer in business due to the non-ass kissing management types that put the airline in bankruptcy (who by your own admission you were part of). That PAA? Or does PAA stand for something else in which case I retract the above statement.