WN drops three stations

[WorldTraveler]

at what point do you think the merger was completed, Kev? Besides your daily obsession that it never happened, the merger was finished long before this announcement was made.

The fleet of Saabs that DL cut from its fleet was a whole lot smaller than the 717s that WN decided they wanted nothing to do with. but that is another story, sort of.

DL people just like those at other airlines have had the opportunity to bid on existing positions in RIF situations. There is nothing holier about what WN has done to protect its position than any other airline.

I still have to laugh that WN people are wiggling so badly over cutting service.

I'm not having a field day that AA WILL cut service but that there will be people proven wrong.

How many sides of his mouth does this guy have?

the same two you do.

The beauty of this whole internet thing is the lengths some people go to to bash other people. The airline is just the mechanism used to do it.

You do realize that nothing on here really moves what happens in the airline industry, don't you?

 

[700UW]

The unionized other airlines can bump into a position, they dont have to bid, they displace the junior person where they choose to go.

 

[WorldTraveler]

you have mentioned that before.

and guess what DL doesn't think that is a fair policy and neither do their employees who have REPEATEDLY refused to embrace the union movement.

what you offer, they aren't buying.

 

[Kev3188]

Besides your daily obsession that it never happened,

How on Earth did you arrive at that conclusion?

 

the merger was finished long before this announcement was made.

Indeed it was.  And?

 

I still have to laugh that WN people are wiggling so badly over cutting service.

So you're not "taking pleasure" in a RIF, but laughing at those it'll affect? Got it.

 

and guess what DL doesn't think that is a fair policy and neither do their employees who have REPEATEDLY refused to embrace the union movement.

what you offer, they aren't buying.

Actually, as an "actual DL employee" I can tell you that in my experience, a consistent/orderly/transparent process is *exactly* what people want.

 

[USFlyer]

you do realize this was 3 years after the merger?

So?
 
Two points:
 
1.  NW would likely not have dropped these cities, as MSP was much more central to its network than it is to DL.
 
2.  You have repeatedly said AA and US have "years" worth of integration work.  So, based on your comments elsewhere, "3 years after the merger" is within that timeframe given the analysis to drop these cities likely started well before the announcement.

 

[WorldTraveler]

NW was in no more position to sustain losses than DL was... they just didn't have to deal with $3/gal jet fuel.

NW didn't also deal with the realities of operating a money-losing 747-200 freighter operation and left the dirty work for DL to do.

since robbed loves to point to MEM as "evidence" that DL cuts cities even though the spokes attached to MEM are served from other hubs, it is worth remembering that fuel went up by 50% after the DL merger but before the merger announcement was made.

Fuel was already at near current levels by the time WN made the decision to acquire FL which resulted in their decision to cut 18 cities. What was their excuse? Were they unable to calculate known labor costs?

AA/US might get it all done in 3 years but as has been discussed elsewhere, they have a far longer laundry list of things to do including competitive challenges than any other airline has ever had after a merger. If someone would like to post a list of things that any other carrier has had that are comparable to what AA/US faces, I'll ready.

And I have no pleasure in seeing anyone be laid off. Nowhere did I say that.

guess what, Kev. tens of thousands of your coworkers don't agree with your proposed union solution(s) or that what DL does offer in RIF's is anything less than what they expect in an unwanted situation.

As much as 700 might want to push bumping, a little common sense indicates that a potentially small event can turn into a much larger event if a handful of bumped employees can cascade into hundreds of displacement. that is probably why what DL does is considered more fair and orderly than union practices.

 

[Kev3188]

And?

 

[robbedagain]

well wt loves to point everything is doom gloom and all for all airlines and if the airlines did do exactly like dl  dl would still rate nbr 1 over all....
 
as far as im concerned  wether or not the new aa cuts cities or reduces them  its wrong in wt eyes  but yrs ago when dl cut other cities as mentioned earlier then its fine....  so whats the probleme here....

 

[WNMECH]

And I have no pleasure in seeing anyone be laid off. Nowhere did I say that.

That is good to hear.
So you must agree that WNs history of NEVER having laid off anyone, is much superior to the rest of the airline industry, where layoffs are the norm.

Come on, I believe you are looking for a third side of your mouth to talk from.

 

[WorldTraveler]

as far as im concerned  wether or not the new aa cuts cities or reduces them  its wrong in wt eyes  but yrs ago when dl cut other cities as mentioned earlier then its fine....  so whats the probleme here....

laying off anyone is something no business wants to do.... I never said it was ok that DL had to terminate any cities.

I did say that there were reasons for DL having to make that decision, just as there have been for other layoffs.

And for the record, I never said that WN hasn't had good reasons for closing these 3 cities.

IN fact, I posted here that WN would be no more able to service FL's network or compete as aggressively as WN because of WN's higher costs and that is EXAcTLY what has happened.

The only dubious part of what WN has done with these latest layoffs which is unprecedented with any other airline is to start JAN at a time when Sen. Trent Lott helped modify the Wright Amendment only to now find that the economics of serving JAN weren't there after all.


 
 

That is good to hear.
So you must agree that WNs history of NEVER having laid off anyone, is much superior to the rest of the airline industry, where layoffs are the norm.

Come on, I believe you are looking for a third side of your mouth to talk from.

You can sift thru the thread and count the number of posts back that something was said if you want but I believe it was YOU who brought up the whole notion of layoffs in an attempt to try to argue that WN has done a better job of protecting its people.

I have never disputed that... you seem to have this need to defend WN against a charge I have never leveled.

I also have never challenged that WN employees wouldn't be given the opportunity to transfer, just as other airlines have done... but we all know that there are a certain number of people at any company - airline or not - that will not accept a transfer because they have reasons to stay where they live, current job or not.

I DID say that WN is now having to deal with multiple city closures something that WN has never done before and they are doing it repeatedly since the FL merger.

And despite the recent dustup that has taken place on this forum, I still have a long history of commending WN for running a very good airline and for being a fierce competitor. That has not changed.

Keep these relatively few disagreements in perspective.

 

[700UW]

Funny how he ignores that he got called out and yet to reply.

 

[USFlyer]

Slightly OT, but reading any thread on this board has become somewhat repetitive.  Every thread ends up in basically the same place -- DL is great, every other carrier is in serious trouble, everyone but 1-2 people are wrong or misinformed, and DL has the greatest network and the most competitive advantages.  I'm just going to start putting that at the end of all my posts to stipulate to that (even if I don't necessarily agree with it) so we can perhaps talk about something else.

 

[WorldTraveler]

And that would be the shame if you came to that conclusion because it is not what has been said.

If you translate strategic advantages into greatness or strategic challenges into being in serious trouble, then you might come to that conclusion - but that is certainly not accurate nor has it been said or even inferred.

Specific to this topic, despite all of the heat, I have acknowledged several times - and my posts have repeatedly said - that WN is a well-run airline that has succeeded because of seizing opportunities, and will succeed.

How you could come to a conclusion other than that regarding what I have said about WN, I am more than perplexed.

 

[robbedagain]

since you said that wn is a well run airline..  how do you say AA US and UA are run?  

 

[TDR1502C]

USFlyer,
   Good call. May I suggest other posters adopt the signature below?