Why Tim Nelson is Dangerous to IAM-represented employees at United Airlines

[Kev3188]

How come you didn't condemn part-time reserve the IAM willingly added at Hawaiian Airlines, completely identical to DL ready reserve?

Josh

How do you know they didn't?

Two wrongs don't make a right...

 

[737823]

That's all you have to say? Care to respond/comment on the rest?

Josh

 

[saywhat]

The IAM is hurting airline workers collectively, not DL. DL ready reserve has been around for nearly 30 years, people like the program and the flexibility it offers. No different than other industries transitioning away from full time benefited positions and towards part-time/contract/consultant type arrangements, similar to the growing reliance on adjunct faculty at colleges and universities. How come you didn't condemn part-time reserve the IAM willingly added at Hawaiian Airlines, completely identical to DL ready reserve? What about the fact that most/all of the stations NWA contacted out went to Air Wisconsin, also part of DL 143 allowing the IAM to continue to collect dues? How about all the Air Wisconsin staffed stations at UAL? Bottom line is people are gladly willing to work under the terms DL is offering, I have seen college students, retirees working in DL ACS under the RR program. If you are too good for those terms, don't work for DL but having that attitude because it isn't up to your standards others should not avail themselves to it is outrageous. A program like RR actually would be in the interest of the IAM, more heads to collect dues from although dues per employee would be smaller under the current scheme driven by hourly wage.

Again Kev has ignored the question, but it speaks volumes about the value of union representation when the unorganized sCO passenger service employees join the IAM and then find themselves out of a job or needing to relocate to a hub to maintain employment. Why did DL 141 willingly sign away sCO cargo jobs? They should have taken the better of the two agreements and worked to bring sUA cargo work back in house, which the IAM also gave away years ago.

Josh

You are kidding, right? You are a banker in Boston? Please tell me which one so I don't bank with that Company. Pilots give away scope and it dominoes through the whole work force. Look at the explosion of growth in the express carriers with $8 an hour jobs and Companies like DL with RR. Until Pilots keep their work and the rest are organized there will be challenges.If you can't figure this out how do you count money or give financial advice or whatever it is you do?
 
Regarding RR, no raises or benefits is a great thing? How about being told we don't have any work for you, go home. DL is leading the way to poverty for many airline workers. They and the express carriers need to be organized.  

 

[737823]

You are kidding, right? You are a banker in Boston? Please tell me which one so I don't bank with that Company. Pilots give away scope and it dominoes through the whole work force. Look at the explosion of growth in the express carriers with $8 an hour jobs and Companies like DL with RR. Until Pilots keep their work and the rest are organized there will be challenges.If you can't figure this out how do you count money or give financial advice or whatever it is you do?
 
Regarding RR, no raises or benefits is a great thing? How about being told we don't have any work for you, go home. DL is leading the way to poverty for many airline workers. They and the express carriers need to be organized.

I just come into this with a different perspective. I understand and appreciate your interest in maintaining a middle class lifestyle for those in this profession but times change, the industry needs to adjust.

Guess you didn't realize many of the regionals are union and have played along in facilitating the race to the bottom. AFA, ALPA, IAM, IBT, CWA, TWU all represent various classifications at regionals and ground handlers.

The pilots have had numerous opportunities over the years to hold the line on scope but prove time and time again they are happy to relax scope in exchange for other contractual enhancements directly benefiting their workgroup. Restrictive scope is great and all but despite you and others calling for solidarity ALPA and other pilot unions exist to advance and protect the interests of pilots, not F/As, ramp or passenger service. Sure labor leaders hide behind solidarity and say they believe elevating the standards for everyone but at the end of the day people care about themselves, but help others in their struggle when it is convenient.

The company knows this and uses it to their advantage each and every day, and more times than not the unions play into it. Look at the divisional UA agreement dividing hubs and out stations. The IAM/TWU alliance agreement is another excellent example of this. So yes, organized labor and complacent, narrow minded dues centric leadership have facilitated the downward spiral of airline careers.

Josh

 

[Kev3188]

That's all you have to say?

Why use 500 words when 50'll do?

 

[saywhat]

I just come into this with a different perspective. I understand and appreciate your interest in maintaining a middle class lifestyle for those in this profession but times change, the industry needs to adjust.

Guess you didn't realize many of the regionals are union and have played along in facilitating the race to the bottom. AFA, ALPA, IAM, IBT, CWA, TWU all represent various classifications at regionals and ground handlers.

The pilots have had numerous opportunities over the years to hold the line on scope but prove time and time again they are happy to relax scope in exchange for other contractual enhancements directly benefiting their workgroup. Restrictive scope is great and all but despite you and others calling for solidarity ALPA and other pilot unions exist to advance and protect the interests of pilots, not F/As, ramp or passenger service. Sure labor leaders hide behind solidarity and say they believe elevating the standards for everyone but at the end of the day people care about themselves, but help others in their struggle when it is convenient.

The company knows this and uses it to their advantage each and every day, and more times than not the unions play into it. Look at the divisional UA agreement dividing hubs and out stations. The IAM/TWU alliance agreement is another excellent example of this. So yes, organized labor and complacent, narrow minded dues centric leadership have facilitated the downward spiral of airline careers.

Josh

Interesting that you say times are changing in the industry but yet when a Union has to give in to more part time, RR or scope it is their fault.  I haven't met one Union leader that likes seeing people lose their jobs, etc. If pilots give work away how are flight attendants, maintenance, pax service or ramp supposed to keep the work? Unions have been under attack for many years now and it isn't up to a few Union bosses to change this trend by themselves. Somebody needs to educate the non-Union employees to the positives of being a member of a Union. It is time that people stop accepting that Unions are bad and that greedy CEO's and corporations are the problem.

 

[Kev3188]

It is time that people stop accepting that Unions are bad and that greedy CEO's and corporations are the problem.

Agree 100%, though I'm not sure it's acceptance so much as it is being conditioned by constant messaging.

 

[jet job]

Timmy are you going to make another run for the grand lodge?

 

[jet job]

Seems your green slate isn't doing to well in Chicago

 

[jet job]

Looks like cronk isn't letting timmy on the team. Eulo booted him off her slate like a used tissue is tossed away.......... Unless Eulo promised him an appointment down the road.

How bout it Eulo , are you gonna give a Nelson a job? ....... Oh wait a minute, my bad, you got to get elected first..

Cronk I gotta title for your video....... I walk the line, ....... You should have had a guitar then it might have been believable. Better get timmy to run your campaign he is only 0-2 .....while,
Karen is oh for four.

 

[Thomas Paine]

Tim;  I hope you run and win over at the IAM, lord knows the people who are running it have forgotten what Unionism is all about. There has been changes at the TWU, Little and all his appointed cronies are gone, they leave behind destroyed careers and a bankrupt union but at least there is new blood. Maybe that's what the IAM needs as well. 73 pages where they say you are dangerous, sure sounds like you are the right guy for the job.

 

[jet job]

Well Paine , it takes more than a loud mouth, a pea brain and an ego the size of Lake Michigan to run a union. Nelsons give us all or nothing would have put half of the workers in the streets to satisfy his perverse sense of justice and respect. Who wins with that? Certainly not the members he says he gives a **** about. You say right guy for the job. I disagree with you and so did the membership in 2012 and again with the recent ratification. We don't believe this sell out to the highest bidder one iota. I for one, used to just show up to work, do my time mind my own business until I found up this jerk and a few others were screwing up our contract ratification. I will continue to post until he and his phony pretenders are exposed for what they really are scab opportunist s.

 

[jet job]

Looks like cronk isn't letting timmy on the team. Eulo booted him off her slate like a used tissue is tossed away.......... Unless Eulo promised him an appointment down the road.
How bout it Eulo , are you gonna give a Nelson a job? ....... Oh wait a minute, my bad, you got to get elected first..
Cronk I gotta title for your video....... I walk the line, ....... You should have had a guitar then it might have been believable. Better get timmy to run your campaign he is only 0-2 .....while,
Karen is oh for four.

Cricket

 

[WorldTraveler]

today is UA investor day. Perhaps Tim will be vindicated. UA promised that they would detail plans to cut $1B in costs at their investor day presentation.

 

[Kev3188]

Tim;  I hope you run and win over at the IAM, lord knows the people who are running it have forgotten what Unionism is all about. There has been changes at the TWU, Little and all his appointed cronies are gone, they leave behind destroyed careers and a bankrupt union but at least there is new blood. Maybe that's what the IAM needs as well. 73 pages where they say you are dangerous, sure sounds like you are the right guy for the job.

+1.

A change in direction and having the DL knocked out of complacency can only be a good thing...