Who Is This?

[will fix for food]

Buck,

You know, you should be wishing for a major pay raise for Eagle for a few reasons.

1. There are American mechanics coming to Eagle. It would be less of a hardship on them if they received something resembling a decent paycheck.

2. If we make more it is less of an incentive for AMR to shift flying to Eagle which in turn might save a few jobs at American.

3. A rising tide lifts all boats. You could use our pay raise as an argument in your negotiations. As it stands now, 1% is not going to buy you much leverage.

Now try and think that over. I know it might be hard for you to try and grasp anything complex, but let's try anyhow, OK?

 

[Buck]

First, I would like to see Eagle mechanics in a mechanics union. Then of course I would hope that their skills are as important as mine. As for compensation, it is the industrial union mentality or the company union mentality of the TWU that drives wages down. Is one type of aircraft different when it comes to maintaining them and people ( yes even pilots ) lives are in the balance? Wages should be equal for the experience you have earned. Not this division the TWU has created. What I grasp is that we appear to wanting the same thing, because I agree with you 100%. If that is hard for you to grasp maybe you should fire your representive.

 

[Drippy Quill]

Then of course I would hope that their skills are as important as mine. ...ohhhh..you big Buck you...and if they are not?...hahahahahahaha

 

[will fix for food]

First, I would like to see Eagle mechanics in a mechanics union. Then of course I would hope that their skills are as important as mine.

Of course our skills could NEVER be as important as your's Buck!

 

[Buck]

Of course they are. I believe you are misquoting me?

It is not I who is the advocate of the division of the Major and Regional mechanics and it is not you either. If we had a union for the mechanic craft and class we could fight to put this seperation behind us. Why are you so defensive when I believe that you as a mechanic are just as qualified as any other and should be compesated accordingly?

 

[MCI AFL-CIO]

.

Buck,...............Wages should be equal for the experience you have earned.


We have mechanics here, without A&P tickets with a wealth of knowledge and skill, with as much as 40 years experience, And we have skilled mechanics who have 5 years or less experience.Do you want the 40 year veteran with his wealth of knowledge and skill to be paid for his knowledge more than a junior mechanic, who might have spent his adult life in the miliary learning his carreer, to make alot less, just because he has not worked for the airline as long?
We have mechanics who are very skilled who not possess an A&P, but are sharp, talented mechanics, Who are as good and as equal as those with the A&P.
If we were to live by your philosophy, each year we would get a raise for our experience, the senior most talented, skilled, experienced mechanic would double our wages. Where would you draw aline at experience, If we were to be paid for our experience, then we would all gain but will still be lower than the best mechanics

 

[Rusty]

Maybe I am missing something in this thread but, in my opinion Eagle mechanics should make wages equal to AA mechanics wages. Eagles mechanics are experienced mechanics and are as good as experienced American mechanics and I see no reason they should not have equal pay and benefits. I believe that is what Buck is saying. I suspect some of these people in here promoting division are in fact management. I do know there is at least one pilot in here trying to promote division, maybe more.

 

[Ed Norton]

The AFL-CIO has convinced many of us that we are worthless and should be"happy you have a job, brother". Lose your job a carrier A after 10 years? Too bad. Go to carrier B and start at the bottom of the pay scale you lug!
By contrast lets look at the average executive/CEO management type puke.
Screw up a profitable airline and ge fired, or resign looking for greener pastures and what happens?. Now you can go to another carrier or industry expecting and getting a larger salary than what you had before plus all the added perks; this on top of what you were able to hussle out of your previous employer.

What's wrong with doing the same for our profession? It should not matter if have 5, 10, 20 or 30 years experience.You should be paid for it. That to me doesn't mean you get hired on and go straight to day shift with weekends off. It means you get paid what you are worth.

That as a matter of course, goes against the philosophy of the industrial union leadership. This philosophy states that you help yourself to CEO type perks and benefits at the expense of your members and to hell with those same members.
Time for a change!


WOO, WOO!

 

[Buck]

Buck,...............Wages should be equal for the experience you have earned.


We have mechanics here, without A&P tickets with a wealth of knowledge and skill, with as much as 40 years experience, And we have skilled mechanics who have 5 years or less experience.Do you want the 40 year veteran with his wealth of knowledge and skill to be paid for his knowledge more than a junior mechanic, who might have spent his adult life in the miliary learning his carreer, to make alot less, just because he has not worked for the airline as long?
We have mechanics who are very skilled who not possess an A&P, but are sharp, talented mechanics, Who are as good and as equal as those with the A&P.
If we were to live by your philosophy, each year we would get a raise for our experience, the senior most talented, skilled, experienced mechanic would double our wages. Where would you draw aline at experience, If we were to be paid for our experience, then we would all gain but will still be lower than the best mechanics

These senior unlicensed mechanics should be given the opportunity to gain their A&P tickets based on their experience. Just recently American Airlines failed to grant experience to even junior mechanics based on aircraft wieght class and the TWU went along with that scam. I believe that experience should be rewarded. It is the current contract that penalizes a non-licensed mechanic. And no not a lot less, but the senior mechanic should be there to assit the more junior mechanic, even if the more junior has been a mechanic his whole working life. Experience, even in day to day operations is important. It is also important that this knowledge be passed to future generations. Experience has nothing to do with how long a mechanic has worked for an airline, it is the accumulated knowledge aquired over a mechanics career and that should be repected. I bet there are even some unlicensed mechanics at your location who are sharper that some of those that are licensed.

What would be wrong with experience and talent being rewarded?

Why can't these senior experienced mechanics pass on their knowledge and make it possible for the less experienced to be rewarded as well?

I am sure that the industry and supply and demand of the mechanic will be a factor in determining where the wages finally stabilize.

It appears to me that you have little faith in your profession to progress any further?

It reminds me of a mechanic during the 80's who said at contract time, "When is enough , enough. Do you think you are worth $25 an hour?"

I believe that as mechanics, due to our skill requirements and the knowledge that can be shared between fellow mechanics, we are compensated far to low.

My philospphy, is we are underpaid and all of us should belong to a mechanics union and attempt to correct this as soon as possible.

 

[MCI AFL-CIO]

ED Norton...............What's wrong with doing the same for our profession? It should not matter if have 5, 10, 20 or 30 years experience.You should be paid for it. That to me doesn't mean you get hired on and go straight to day shift with weekends off. It means you get paid what you are worth.



I didnt say Im against doing that, I agree it would be nice if we as mechanics had that ability to exercise our talents and skills, Much as teamsters, truckdrivers did in the past. When they were laid off at one line, they could apply to another and if hired would keep the union senority and pay scale while being addressed to the bottom of senority within the company and also keeping their vacations accruel
While Ford and GM are represented by the UAW, I do not know if this follows their guidelines, but it should
If we in the airline business had this luxury, in my opinion, I would rather it be with a union that supports politics, and setting guidelines for the workforce internally as well as with Legislative Bills they endorse and lobby for

 

[Buck]

And which of these political entities has aided the airline mechanic craft and class lately?

Since the mighty AFL- CIO has done nothing to aide our profession, it is time to form a coalition to protect our profession, a mechanics union. Once formed, under the AMFA constitution, the membership has the right to form any and all political action committees they would like.

That's right the membership!

And what politics should be supported. The liberal left wing agenda, the evil conservative right or politics that are a key to our profession.

I would suggest that you find and read many of the posts on this board by Bob Owens concerning these issues.

 

[Ed Norton]

MCI, you have to clean up your own house before you can start worrying about the plight of the Almagamated Chicken Coop Workers or any other's plight.
Buck is right. The Mighty AFL-CIO has done nothing for our class and craft and not muchfor others. The AFL-CIO is but a self serving dues collection agency. :down:

 

[Rusty]

If we in the airline business had this luxury, in my opinion, I would rather it be with a union that supports politics, and setting guidelines for the workforce internally as well as with Legislative Bills they endorse and lobby for

MCI AFL-CIO, here is a book you can buy that may help you help reform the AFL-CIO if you are interested.
http://www.laboreducator.org/bookten.htm

In the mean time if we want to lobby, use shoe leather we can, it will be totally up to the membership with AMFA. As the mechanic and related rise up to share common goals, personally I don't believe we have the time to fix it before our window of opportunity closes.

 

[Ed Norton]

Here's a better one. It shows how the AFL-CIO is but a mere political whore and corporate stooge. :down:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detai...=glance&s=books

 

[will fix for food]

I am sure that the industry and supply and demand of the mechanic will be a factor in determining where the wages finally stabilize.

Supply and demand is key.

Back in early to mid 2001 I remember the shortage was so acute that AW&ST had airlines advertising in the back of it for A&P's. AW&ST usually doesn't advertise for anything less than engineers. At the same time Eagle was bumping the starting wages up about $4.00/hour and offering multi-thousand dollar hiring bonuses for some locations. Yep, even the TWU could have negotiated a good contract back then.

But now here we are....