Want afa-CWA representation? Just wait for the afa-CWA Raid

[donttouchthebeauty]

Yes ma'am I still do get crew meals on some flights. If we don't, there is always food left over on the international flights. Not a problem. I would rather be paid more and bring my own food, which I am guaranteed to like, than rely on a company provided crew meal. Maybe that is just me, but please do enjoy that meal. I also get 36 hours off after international trips sometimes even 48, which only I can reduce. But if you had any knowledge of our contract, you would know that. Why would I want 36 hours off after every trip? I commute and want to get it over with, not sit around for a day and a half waiting to be able to go back to work. Yes, we can do international and domestic in a given month. Sometimes, even on reserve. I don't want to though. I would guess 90% or more of the people that fly international have no desire to do any domestic trips. The vast majority are more than happy with the way we do it here. If they aren't, they are very new and don't want to put in their dues to get to that point, or they refuse to commute to an Int'l base. If you really read the contract or had knowledgable "friends" you would know that. Yes we can also bid Europe and Asia. There is no restriction to doing one or the other. As a matter of fact, some lines for OCT. have PVG and LHR on them. Some pure lines, some not. WOW, I can see why your work rules are so much better. One of the biggest differences in the way we are scheduled is that we, AA, prefer to be home more than it seems UA-AFA-CWA does. We go to work and come home. No mini vacation on every trip. Which is what our membership has said they want. On the call out language, it is 2 hours to sign in, but they know full well that we might not make it. They usually waive sign-in, and if you miss your flight, most are smart enough to blame it on a multitude of things. I.E. daycare, traffic, shower, car problems etc. So what else you got? Try reading the contract next time, if you really have access to one.

I know for a FACT that you are lying... and that is SAD!!!! If you are working a transcon do you get a crew meal? No....As for the 36 hours, I also know that you do trips without 36 hours off... Most of all, you don't even know that you cannot bid back and forth and do domestic and international in the same month. AT AA you bid to do International or you bid to do domestic, alot of domestic f/as at AA aren;t even qualified on anything but the S80 737 and 757.... I can't believe you DON'T know that, oh wait - yes i can. When I said BID Europe or Asia, It means to be based there.. and that you cannot do.. It is sad that you are telling your members to lie about the 2 hour callout and blame it on kids, car problems, etc.. What a shame!!! I would venture to say that AA would say "That is your problem, not mine" you have a 2 hour obligation... you are obviously way out of the loop, and
you are proving it with every post. I quoted you whole post by the way b/c every sentence is wrong and untruthful.

 

[StraaightTaalk]

I know for a FACT that you are lying... and that is SAD!!!! If you are working a transcon do you get a crew meal? No....As for the 36 hours, I also know that you do trips without 36 hours off... Most of all, you don't even know that you cannot bid back and forth and do domestic and international in the same month. AT AA you bid to do International or you bid to do domestic, alot of domestic f/as at AA aren;t even qualified on anything but the S80 737 and 757.... I can't believe you DON'T know that, oh wait - yes i can. When I said BID Europe or Asia, It means to be based there.. and that you cannot do.. It is sad that you are telling your members to lie about the 2 hour callout and blame it on kids, car problems, etc.. What a shame!!! I would venture to say that AA would say "That is your problem, not mine" you have a 2 hour obligation... you are obviously way out of the loop, and
you are proving it with every post. I quoted you whole post by the way b/c every sentence is wrong and untruthful.

You are, indeed, a very sad individual. I am sure most of your flying partners would agree, too.

 

[StraaightTaalk]

When the AA FAs decided to leave the TWU they approached the AFA who turned them away (bad move), the APFA was formed as a second choice because their first choice was unavailable.

Many years ago one of the founders of the APFA addressed a group of mechanics who were trying to oust the TWU and she shared her experiences, she was the one who told us of their goals and struggles.

You only got part of the story. AFA then courted us several times in the 1980's, both with raids, and once, with an offer of an outright merger between AFA and APFA in 1987. The raids were unsuccessful, and we voted down the merger when it was put out to a vote of the membership.

AFA is nothing more than a paper tiger. Lots of smoke and no fire.

Let's see how long the CWA puts up with Pat Friend wasting their money too.

 

[Bob Owens]

You only got part of the story. AFA then courted us several times in the 1980's, both with raids, and once, with an offer of an outright merger between AFA and APFA in 1987. The raids were unsuccessful, and we voted down the merger when it was put out to a vote of the membership.

AFA is nothing more than a paper tiger. Lots of smoke and no fire.

Let's see how long the CWA puts up with Pat Friend wasting their money too.

I heard that the NWA FAs were rejected by the APFA, thats why they formed the short lived PFAA. They couldnt go from the IBT to the AFA because of the AFL-CIO no raid policy. But for some reason the APFA only wants to represent workers at AA, that makes them a company union and puts AA FAs at a disadvantage since everything they have is tied exclusively to something that somebody else owns.

 

[StraaightTaalk]

I heard that the NWA FAs were rejected by the APFA, thats why they formed the short lived PFAA. They couldnt go from the IBT to the AFA because of the AFL-CIO no raid policy. But for some reason the APFA only wants to represent workers at AA, that makes them a company union and puts AA FAs at a disadvantage since everything they have is tied exclusively to something that somebody else owns.

You heard wrong. The NWA FA group never approached APFA to represent them. They wanted their OWN independent union, out from under the AFL-CIO umbrella.

AFL-CIO affiliation means nothing when you're out on the street, on strike, for example. Just ask an ORIGINAL Continental pilot. Or Eastern pilot. Or Eastern flight attendant...

The list goes on.

 

[Bob Owens]

You heard wrong. The NWA FA group never approached APFA to represent them. They wanted their OWN independent union, out from under the AFL-CIO umbrella.

Thats not what they told me. They wanted out of the IBT because of their heavy handdness, would have preferred going into the AFA but couldnt because of the AFL-CIO no raid policy, asked the APFA but were told the APFA was not interested.

Thats why they went to the AFA the first chance they got. The PFAA leadership was pushing for the TWU(so they could retain their positions) but the members wanted the AFA.

 

[FA Mikey]

I heard that the NWA FAs were rejected by the APFA, thats why they formed the short lived PFAA. They couldnt go from the IBT to the AFA because of the AFL-CIO no raid policy. But for some reason the APFA only wants to represent workers at AA, that makes them a company union and puts AA FAs at a disadvantage since everything they have is tied exclusively to something that somebody else owns.

Sorry Bob, and wrong, it makes them an independent union without affiliation to the BS AFL-CIO. We have had better working and pay them most other carriers and would never think of entering into a 10 year contract like the AFA did with UAL. A union who over time has out shined your TWU, going to bat against AA. I guess thats why we still make more than UAL and U and NWA and DAL, need I go on?

 

[StraaightTaalk]

Thats not what they told me. They wanted out of the IBT because of their heavy handdness, would have preferred going into the AFA but couldnt because of the AFL-CIO no raid policy, asked the APFA but were told the APFA was not interested.

Thats why they went to the AFA the first chance they got. The PFAA leadership was pushing for the TWU(so they could retain their positions) but the members wanted the AFA.

Again, wrong. At the time you purport the NWA FAs were approaching APFA about representation, there was strong talk about an AMR acquisition of NWA (1999). The NWA f/as would never have wanted APFA, with its AA flight attendant history, to deal with both groups on seniority issues, etc.

The NWA flight attendants have changed unions more times than anybody can remember, in any case. Not a very stable bunch.

 

[StraaightTaalk]

Sorry Bob, and wrong, it makes them an independent union without affiliation to the BS AFL-CIO. We have had better working and pay them most other carriers and would never think of entering into a 10 year contract like the AFA did with UAL. A union who over time has out shined your TWU, going to bat against AA. I guess thats why we still make more than UAL and U and NWA and DAL, need I go on?

Exactly.

Yeah, AFA did really well with UA and US. NW was already a mess when AFA came in, but old Pat Friend and her bunch, with all their chest-beating and promises, didn't get them a thing.
Admittedly, the courts were against them, but, according to Pat and all the AFA cheerleaders, isn't AFA the most powerful union in the world?

UA? AFA did really well. They got to keep holiday pay. What about the reduction in return to work off active status from 7 to 3 years, and all the people who were already out with medical conditions over 3 years were "separated" from the company?

Well said, Mikey.

 

[FA Mikey]

In the end the end Aislehopper and friends need only look at the state of the afa member carriers and there gutted CBA's to say thanks but no thanks. Delta went through a BK just like UAL and U, yet its FA's are doing better than both of those groups. AFA is in to lose millions more on another wasted trip trying to organize DAL FA's.

 

[StraaightTaalk]

In the end the end Aislehopper and friends need only look at the state of the afa member carriers and there gutted CBA's to say thanks but no thanks. Delta went through a BK just like UAL and U, yet its FA's are doing better than both of those groups. AFA is in to lose millions more on another wasted trip trying to organize DAL FA's.

Pat Friend was not content with bankrupting AFA. She is now working on the CWA treasury with her obsessive need to "get" the Delta flight attendants.

I wonder how long it will be before somebody stops this woman from continually throwing money down a rat hole.

Nobody (outside of AFA's cheerleaders) is very impressed with AFA. Pat Friend needs to realize the 80's are over.

 

[LCC_#1]

If I were an AFA member, and my dues money was going to organize Delta for the 3rd or 4th time, I'd be VERY angry.

Many of us are!!

 

[donttouchthebeauty]

In the end the end Aislehopper and friends need only look at the state of the afa member carriers and there gutted CBA's to say thanks but no thanks. Delta went through a BK just like UAL and U, yet its FA's are doing better than both of those groups. AFA is in to lose millions more on another wasted trip trying to organize DAL FA's.

Sad and bitter Queen --- all of you - you don't realize you are sitting on 20 billion in debt.. uneconomical aircraft (365 of them)... high labor costs... should i go on??? Open your eyes, look around... Did the APFA save your a@@ in BK??? NO, you gave up everything outside of BK,, you still gave it up and didn't go into BK.. GET REAL!!!!! come on... I am not an AFA cheerleader - but if you think the APFA did something special, then you are SADLY mistaken..

 

[FA Mikey]

Sad and bitter Queen --- all of you - you don't realize you are sitting on 20 billion in debt.. uneconomical aircraft (365 of them)... high labor costs... should i go on??? Open your eyes, look around... Did the APFA save your a@@ in BK??? NO, you gave up everything outside of BK,, you still gave it up and didn't go into BK.. GET REAL!!!!! come on... I am not an AFA cheerleader - but if you think the APFA did something special, then you are SADLY mistaken..

Its a great point to make when you have to start it with an insult directed at every AAer. If you want to contribute to the discussion you should get some facts and not made up numbers and generalizations.

 

[FWAAA]

It's funny how so many employees (pilots, mechanics, rampers and FAs) at various airlines complain that their work group gave up more than at any other airline. Except when they're trying to insult the work groups at other airlines - and all of a sudden they didn't give up as much as those other airline employees. jimntx pointed out something similar the other day. Consistency, people. Either you've got it worse than everyone else or you don't.