USAPA Files

Status
Not open for further replies.
Everybody knows USAPA's only raison d'etre is to benefit the East at the West's expense. Dissing ALPA is a convenient deflection. Everybody knows!

Funny coming from one engaged in theft. Almost all on the East see it as righting one of ALPA's many wrongs. The days of the ALPA scab mentality are coming to a close.

ALPA has underwent a slow perversion starting with a failure in 78 to institute a National seniority list, to JJ Odonell telling the public it was safe during the controller stike, to not taking care of the Braniff pilots who 400 or 500 scabbing led to the next disaster of breaking the union at CAL and so on an so forth. Over the last 25 years it has went from an advocate for the profession to a corporation abandoning all principles in business for itself and willing to engage in thuggish behavior.

Eventually when a once honorable institution becomes perverted, people will throw off the yolk. Unfortunately is takes time and happens over a period as fond memories are continually replaced by disappointments.

It first started at Airways in 1992, when 1500 cards were collected in the duty rig give back contract, the first crammed down the memberships throat without a vote. Now with ALPA's complete failures in regards to representation on the pension, MDA, bankruptcies and finally the Nicalou gift/theft, less than half the group is now near the plurality of voices on the East.
 
That sentence doesn't make sense because it's the job of the arbitrator to determine how to administer said policy. Not you, not me, not Prater, not the EC, EB, USAPA, nor even a federal court judge. I know you feel your opinion holds the force of law but that doesn't make it so.

Thanks for the promotion. But I decline. My opinion is just that. No force of anything. If you had kept the sentence in context it makes perfect sense.

Wow, so simple. Reminds me of "justice" in the former Soviet Union. Shoot or imprison anybody accused of a crime and you don't have to worry about messy trials. Seems you share in their vision of fairness. I'll give you simple: if Nicolau felt that DOH/LOS was fair he would've ruled that way. It's funny how the intial East response last May was that Nicolau is senile, corrupt, and/or insane. When that didn't stick it was time to find another scapegoat: ALPA Merger Policy? Yeah, that's what's wrong. Who are you gonna blame next?.

It is simple. You just happen to not like our solution. Besides I was not even around these boards until July. So I wouldn't know about what was said prior to that.

So dissapointing! Are you turning into another EastUS, Nostradamus, etc. clone, spewing bitter vitriol, who ran out of sentient arguments long ago? So I'm an ALPA clone, incapable of independent thought and you're a Enlightened One?

No, I'm not enlightened. But your defense of ALPA is disheartening. The same defense posed in an ever changing format. If that doesn't work, then asking leading questions to gage my what? Loyalty? Steadfastness? It's beyond old. The answers you seek are on the website or try e-mailing the Comm. Chairman your questions.

Right. Everybody knows USAPA's only raison d'etre is to benefit the East at the West's expense. Dissing ALPA is a convenient deflection. Everybody knows!

We know? In 1992 about 1500 pilots started a dump ALPA campaign. The only problem was there were not any credible alternatives. Some said IBT, others said IBEW. For the first time we have a credible alternative. 47% of your own pilots tried the same thing. I guess they didn't think AWAPA was a credible alternative.
 
Quote by AAA73Pilot:
It is simple. You just happen to not like our solution.

That's because I know your "solution" is no solution at all. Changing unions without changing the constituency will change nothing!

Quote by AAA73Pilot:
Besides I was not even around these boards until July. So I wouldn't know about what was said prior to that.

Fair enough. So am I to infer that your initial response to the Nicolau Award was "darn that ALPA!"?

Quote by AAA73Pilot:
But your defense of ALPA is disheartening.

My defense isn't of ALPA but of a fair process. Talk, mediate, arbitrate. This contrasts your view of DOH/LOS everytime, all the time. Which integration strategy accounts for the vagaries of different mergers? Hint: the one which benefits YOU.

Quote by AAA73Pilot:
We know? In 1992 about 1500 pilots started a dump ALPA campaign. The only problem was there were not any credible alternatives. Some said IBT, others said IBEW. For the first time we have a credible alternative. 47% of your own pilots tried the same thing. I guess they didn't think AWAPA was a credible alternative.

Everybody thinks about dumping ALPA. Why has it only happened once, and at that forty-four years ago? Maybe because in the end people realize that another union can't do any better. The problems the Easties face will not be solved by USAPA. You have my word.
 
. The problems the Easties face will not be solved by USAPA. You have my word.
[/quote]


Wont be solved by ALPA either. You have my word.
 
Well, you have failed to convince anyone from the west, save a few morons, that USAPA stands for fairness for all when USAPA will allow a slotted Shuttle pilot keep their position but not an AWA pilot. Seems you guys are missing a little on the logic front. But good look in your fruitless efforts.

Prechildi

You have not always been a fan of AWA, what changed your view on the economic viability of the company?

Mechanics turn down the concessions.
prechilill
Rating: 0
View Member Profile
Add as Friend
Send Message
Find Member's Posts
Posted on: Nov 28 2002, 03:36 PM


Advanced
***

Group: Registered Member
Posts: 201
Joined: 28-November 02
Member No.: 1,341



Let's talk a little about outsourcing maintenance.
Let's look at some case studies in oursourcing. Remember Bill Franke? Yes, the guy that fired 500 mechanics on Christmas Eve. You see, the plan was to outsource maintenance and save America West 25 million a year. AWA fell a little short of that goal, however, to the tune of about -75 million. The costs acutally went up 5o million a year. Now, that is no chump change for a little company that only has 2 billion a year in sales.
Want another example? How about Valujet? Now there is a great example of outsourcing. But, you probably say those companies are mismanged, and I agree 100%. In fact, so is UAL, so what makes you think UAL management could do any better managing an outsourcing program than say Bill Franke at America West. By the way, I did not include the ten million in maintenance fines AWA got nor did I mention AWA was hours away from being shut down for maintenance record errors.
You see, the IAM just saved this management from itself by voting no. History proves it!
Forum: United Airlines · Post Preview: #29456 · Replies: 216 · Views: 6,487
 
Answered where? I didn't see an answer.

So here is a simple question for the USAPA advocates: if DOH is sacrosanct, why does it not apply to the Shuttle pilots?

Is it because the Shuttle pilots got their slotting through an ALPA process? But wait, isn't that what the AWA pilots got too . . .

Arrogant post by tech boy below.

"I suppose that the case could be made that even accounting for my multiple degrees and highly specialized knowledge that I am grossly overpaid."

"However, there are less than 10 people qualified to do what I do, so I get paid a boatload to do it."

What do you do, techboy, that only 10 other people in the world can do, get along with women all the time?


TechBoy
Rating: 0
View Member Profile
Add as Friend
Send Message
Find Member's Posts
Posted on: Aug 10 2004, 09:32 PM


Senior
****

Group: Registered Member
Posts: 329
Joined: 3-July 04
Member No.: 4,046



Busdrvr,

I was just poking fun at pilot salaries. It's fairly clear that some pilots are overpaid and others are underpaid. I suppose that the case could be made that even accounting for my multiple degrees and highly specialized knowledge that I am grossly overpaid. However, there are less than 10 people qualified to do what I do, so I get paid a boatload to do it. That is the market.

Right now, there is a surplus of trained pilots. That means that salaries will fall, no matter what ALPA tries to do to suppress the market. (IIRC, you are a pro-ALPA guy.
 
Nostradamus,

Do you ever have an original thought to add to a thread?

Posting endless old (and rarely on-point) quotes does not add to the debate.

But I suppose if you are devoid of any originality, that is the best you can do.
 
Answered where? I didn't see an answer.

So here is a simple question for the USAPA advocates: if DOH is sacrosanct, why does it not apply to the Shuttle pilots?

Is it because the Shuttle pilots got their slotting through an ALPA process? But wait, isn't that what the AWA pilots got too . . .


Yes...That is a valid question. So AAA73 or you Nostra, what do you plan to say to the Trump shuttle pilots or any other pilots that didn't get DOH ? Either you believe in DOH or you don't and your list may have some problems with that
 
Nostradamus,

Do you ever have an original thought to add to a thread?

Posting endless old (and rarely on-point) quotes does not add to the debate.

But I suppose if you are devoid of any originality, that is the best you can do.

I respect you hypocritical, original quote that added so much to this thread.
 
Yes...That is a valid question. So AAA73 or you Nostra, what do you plan to say to the Trump shuttle pilots or any other pilots that didn't get DOH ? Either you believe in DOH or you don't and your list may have some problems with that

There is no meat left on the horse you are beating.
 
Thanks for not answering the questions, except you forgot to mention the little point that the MDA pilots listed on the seniority document as being in a furloughed status from USAir, just like all other furloughed pilots. And since the company and ALPA agreed to keeping the MDA pilots separate, how can that be grounds for a (floundering) lawsuit now when ALPA and the company have also agreed to keep the wholly owned pilots separate? IF the MDA pilots really had a case then wouldn't the WO also have a case?
The shuttle pilots were slotted, were they not? So they are not going to have their seniority adjusted but all of the AWA guys will. I see now this USAPA effort is soley directed at the America West pilots. Thanks for your eloquent clarification.

Here is some advice: being a fifty-something floundering FO at a humpty dumpty airline is no way to go through life.

Isn't that part of the basis for the MDA lawsuit. The MDA pilots on the certified list that the AAA MC submitted and accepted by the AWA MC, showed the MDA pilots as active, yet the list that was used showed them as furloughed. Does anyone know the facts?
 
Yes...That is a valid question. So AAA73 or you Nostra, what do you plan to say to the Trump shuttle pilots or any other pilots that didn't get DOH ? Either you believe in DOH or you don't and your list may have some problems with that
It's not a valid question. More like baiting. USAPA was where when the list was constructed? Our input was where?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Back
Top