nycbusdriver
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I would wager that "Express" is on those EMB-170's to keep any further ammunition from the unions, especially the IAM, on who gets to do what work under which contract and when.
Us Airways Emb170
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Light Years
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Interesting. Thats possible, but they seem to have made sure the division between the MAA division and mainline is pretty clear in all the other contracts. I'm not sure but I'd think the same goes for the mechanics. Since it is going to use actual US Airways employees (albeit at Express wages) I'm not sure the brand name is a contractual issue. Anyone have any insight?
ringmaruf
Veteran
My guess is that they decided to go with the Express titles when they decided to make the configuration one-class. That way, everything operated under the US Airways banner is two-class, and everything operated by the US Airways Express banner is one-class.
About the shuttle configuration...is there a seat limit for these things in the ALPA contract? What's keeping them from getting rid of the shuttle configuration and jamming in a few more rows?
About the shuttle configuration...is there a seat limit for these things in the ALPA contract? What's keeping them from getting rid of the shuttle configuration and jamming in a few more rows?
FYI: NW's oldest DC-9-14 (line #50) was built in 1966, their oldest DC-9-31 (#95) in 1967.Light Years said:Ok, that was an exaggeration, but Northwests must be getting close!
Ironically, while they have plenty of 'nines that have spent their entire 35+ years in the NW "family tree" (originally delivered to Bonanza, North Central, Southern, or West Coast), both of these oldest type examples were originally Eastern airplanes.
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Light Years
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Thanks guys....
Thats still pretty old, really says a lot about the design and the Douglas company that they are still in service and will be for some time.
My point was that people freak out when they see a Dash 8 built in the 90s but dont think twice on a "mainline" flight. People associate props with old planes, and Express with props, small, noisy, old, unsafe, inexperienced etc.
Thats still pretty old, really says a lot about the design and the Douglas company that they are still in service and will be for some time.
My point was that people freak out when they see a Dash 8 built in the 90s but dont think twice on a "mainline" flight. People associate props with old planes, and Express with props, small, noisy, old, unsafe, inexperienced etc.
I would guess that you are right... Although I agree that the "Express" titles are a mistake for every marketing reason in the book.ringmaruf said:
Generally, most passengers don't care about an upgrade on relatively short flights, the kind which the company has said it intends to use them on.
While I am sure some elite DM members would complain, they could put all MDA flights in the 2000-2999 series and explain to elites that these flights have no First Class on US Airways.
Plenty of other airlines have one class cabins... Southwest, Frontier, Midwest, ATA.
CynicalResAgent
Veteran
This is how how calling MDA "express" will affect us from the Res side -
(Agent) - You'll depart Pit at 9:30 am on US Airways Express flight 2978 operated by MidAtlantic Airways-
(Infrequent flyer-Average person) - Umm what terminal is that Mid Atlantic out of?
(Agent) - It's a US Airways Express Aircraft. We own the plane, we just have to advise you of the operators name which is Mid Atlantic whenever we mention an express flight.
(Infrequent Flyer) It's Express? What kind of plane is it? Is it one of those puddle jumpers?
(Agent) - No, it's an Embraer EMB-170's.
(Infrequent Flyer) - a what? is that like a DC-10?
(Agent) - No it is a jet aircraft, It seats 70 passengers.
(Infrequent Flyer) - Thats good cause I hate those little prop jobs, they scare me. oh, so it's a big plane.
(Agent) - Yes and I hear they are nice, I have not been on one yet but they have 2 seats on each side of the aisle, so you will not be seated in a middle seat. In fact you'll think your on one of our mainline jets.
(Infrequent Flyer)- So why did you say it was a US Airways Express flight?
(Agent) - I have no clue.
Obviously I think branding it as US Aiways Express is a Mistake. It will not invoke the positive image that we want but rather the negative image that most of the public has towards turboprop aircraft. They Should have branded it US Airways-Mid Atlantic since we are destined to only service the Midatlantic states, but I am guessing the fueselage is not long enough.
The other option would be to paint them just like a mainline but with a white tail and a stylised speedbird logo that matches the other colors and call it Piedmont. I never worked for them but I think the public would respond well if we used Piedmont's name for something other than express. (No offense to the my express brothers and sisters.) Although, I do not have confidence that the we could ever have a Piedmont brand that could ever live up to the publics perception of them the way things are now. If we ever decide to create a Division like Song or Ted then Piedmont would be the name to use.
Marketing would not have to do anything (I won't say anymore than that). Like I said I never worked for them (too young) but everyone who ever mentions Piedmont always says, "Now that was one fine airline." or something to that extent. Atleast in my experience anyway.
Oh, by the way - I don't work in RES, I umm work.....someplace else. Yeah that's the ticket.
(Agent) - You'll depart Pit at 9:30 am on US Airways Express flight 2978 operated by MidAtlantic Airways-
(Infrequent flyer-Average person) - Umm what terminal is that Mid Atlantic out of?
(Agent) - It's a US Airways Express Aircraft. We own the plane, we just have to advise you of the operators name which is Mid Atlantic whenever we mention an express flight.
(Infrequent Flyer) It's Express? What kind of plane is it? Is it one of those puddle jumpers?
(Agent) - No, it's an Embraer EMB-170's.
(Infrequent Flyer) - a what? is that like a DC-10?
(Agent) - No it is a jet aircraft, It seats 70 passengers.
(Infrequent Flyer) - Thats good cause I hate those little prop jobs, they scare me. oh, so it's a big plane.
(Agent) - Yes and I hear they are nice, I have not been on one yet but they have 2 seats on each side of the aisle, so you will not be seated in a middle seat. In fact you'll think your on one of our mainline jets.
(Infrequent Flyer)- So why did you say it was a US Airways Express flight?
(Agent) - I have no clue.
Obviously I think branding it as US Aiways Express is a Mistake. It will not invoke the positive image that we want but rather the negative image that most of the public has towards turboprop aircraft. They Should have branded it US Airways-Mid Atlantic since we are destined to only service the Midatlantic states, but I am guessing the fueselage is not long enough.
The other option would be to paint them just like a mainline but with a white tail and a stylised speedbird logo that matches the other colors and call it Piedmont. I never worked for them but I think the public would respond well if we used Piedmont's name for something other than express. (No offense to the my express brothers and sisters.) Although, I do not have confidence that the we could ever have a Piedmont brand that could ever live up to the publics perception of them the way things are now. If we ever decide to create a Division like Song or Ted then Piedmont would be the name to use.
Marketing would not have to do anything (I won't say anymore than that). Like I said I never worked for them (too young) but everyone who ever mentions Piedmont always says, "Now that was one fine airline." or something to that extent. Atleast in my experience anyway.
Oh, by the way - I don't work in RES, I umm work.....someplace else. Yeah that's the ticket.
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Light Years
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Why dont they just have the EMBs and CRJs in the red livery like Metro had. Red is the short haul division and navy is the long haul divison. The blue is our long haul, dual class product, the red our enhanced single class product for short haul. Both would just wear US Airways titles. I think that would be pretty simple, differentiates it slightly while retaining the marketing power of the US Airways name alone.
With the way things are going, it'd make more sense to call the Express US Airways and paint US Airways Special Big Plane on the dwindling mainline fleet. Some of our customers in certain markets could easily fly to a different city each week untilizing a different hub and still never set foot on an actual US Airways aircraft. If I'm correct there are much more Express aircraft and flights than there are mainline ones.
I was on an Express flight in PIT where a customer asked the FA how many airlines made up US Airways- they were under the impression that it was like Star Alliance, just a collection of regionals operating under a single brand (it kind of is these days, especially the PIT hub). They had obviously come in on one Express and connected onto the other. The flight attendant didnt explain it to him very well and I think he was left with the impression that there is not an actual airline called US Airways (this was on one of our lovely contract carriers that arent known for thier sharp flight attendants or for bothering to wear a uniform).
With the way things are going, it'd make more sense to call the Express US Airways and paint US Airways Special Big Plane on the dwindling mainline fleet. Some of our customers in certain markets could easily fly to a different city each week untilizing a different hub and still never set foot on an actual US Airways aircraft. If I'm correct there are much more Express aircraft and flights than there are mainline ones.
I was on an Express flight in PIT where a customer asked the FA how many airlines made up US Airways- they were under the impression that it was like Star Alliance, just a collection of regionals operating under a single brand (it kind of is these days, especially the PIT hub). They had obviously come in on one Express and connected onto the other. The flight attendant didnt explain it to him very well and I think he was left with the impression that there is not an actual airline called US Airways (this was on one of our lovely contract carriers that arent known for thier sharp flight attendants or for bothering to wear a uniform).
autofixer
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Why don't they just let the mainline fly the 170s under the old mainline contract at F28 rates, like the F28s? No confusion, no different brand. Just look at the discussions on this thread. Look how far this issue has come since 911. How many different divisions do you have to have flying a hodgepodge of high operating cost small jets? Management is so bent on gutting labors' contracts, that they will destroy what is left of UAIR, if that is what it takes. I believe that management,as an industry whole, is drawing a line in the sand and it is "do or die" time. Always remember, Dave and the boys WILL move on to another airline someday. If they can win the labor battle here at UAIR, even if they sink it, they are going to win no matter what. Victory as defined by management, will only raise Dave's stock in the trade.
AKA_trvlr64
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Light Years,Light Years said:
I like your suggestion for the 2 color schemes. Makes sense to you and I but alas we are not management. I was hoping that MAA was going to have just the USAIRWAYS name on the planes. And I hope that MAA will slowly replace MESA. Get them out of the US family.
ringmaruf
Veteran
The two color scheme idea sounds pretty good to me, but think of the unfortunate comparisons...US Airways using red planes to fight off Southwest. Where have I heard that one before?
Under the Bombardier agreement, US Airways has firm orders for 60 CRJ Series 200, 50-seat single-class aircraft; and 25 CRJ Series 700, 75-seat dual-class aircraft. The 50-seat order for the CRJ Series 200 aircraft is scheduled to be delivered beginning in October 2003 to US Airways Express wholly owned subsidiary PSA Airlines. All firm order CRJ aircraft will be delivered by April 2005.
US Airways also has placed firm orders for 85 Embraer 170, 70-seat, dual class aircraft, with the first delivery scheduled for November 2003 to MidAtlantic Airways, a regional jet division of US Airways, Inc. US Airways has the option to convert the Embraer 170s to Embraer 175s with 76 seats. All Embraer 170 deliveries are to be received by September 2006.
Siegel said that these smaller jet aircraft are extremely well suited to serve the US Airways network and will fill in nicely with schedules at key times at the airline's hubs in Charlotte, N.C., Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, as well as its major East Coast operations at Boston, New York LaGuardia and Reagan Washington National.
US Airways also has placed firm orders for 85 Embraer 170, 70-seat, dual class aircraft, with the first delivery scheduled for November 2003 to MidAtlantic Airways, a regional jet division of US Airways, Inc. US Airways has the option to convert the Embraer 170s to Embraer 175s with 76 seats. All Embraer 170 deliveries are to be received by September 2006.
Siegel said that these smaller jet aircraft are extremely well suited to serve the US Airways network and will fill in nicely with schedules at key times at the airline's hubs in Charlotte, N.C., Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, as well as its major East Coast operations at Boston, New York LaGuardia and Reagan Washington National.
