US Airways Commits Suicide !!!

[RealityCheck]

yeppers! Bring on those family of 8 Disney folks!

 

[RealityCheck]

How many stops on SW? Frequency as comparison?? They have 4 one stop flts and 8 daily with 2 or 3 enroute stop flts outbnd and 3 one stops and 3 double or triple stops back..you can get almost anywhere on the US system with one stop or direct svc...and where's first class "potential" which I upgrade people to every single day left and right? wheres advance seating in exit rows if you're preferred? Or will you chance a center seat on SW day of departure? Almost all previous arguments continue to be lame and baseless and without full factual input..most people ,I assume that means greater than 50pct , trvl on orig trvl dates, so the bulk of the flying public got the full 395 value out of their ticket.

 

[airport]

So, this new initative is a bold attempt to change the way US Airways treats it's best customers...IF (and that's a big IF) other major carriers match the program.

So, what if they don't? US Airways will probably beat a hasty retreat, apologize, and thank the thousands of loyal customers who have taken the time to "contact" them on the matter.

But, will these same loyal customers forgive US for even trying this? I wonder how much permanent damage has been done regardless if this program sticks or not????

 

[deelmakur]

Let's put the Southwest thing on the table. While it's convenient to use them as a threat, and indeed, we have all benefited from the downward pressure they put on fares when they enter a market, nobody really wants to fly them instead of US. JetBlue, by the way, is a more interesting product, and isn't necessarily in that category. That having been said, there are other products which will meet the needs of cost conscious frequent travelers, and that's what will bite this company where it sits in this current circumstance.

 

[KCFlyer]

How many stops on SW? Frequency as comparison?? They have 4 one stop flts and 8 daily with 2 or 3 enroute stop flts outbnd and 3 one stops and 3 double or triple stops back..you can get almost anywhere on the US system with one stop or direct svc...

Well since you've asked, there are 4 one stop, with no change of planes and 5 one stops with a change (just like U...no nonstops out of BWI)

and where's first class "potential" which I upgrade people to every single day left and right? wheres advance seating in exit rows if you're preferred?

Here's the part you're missing...at that fare, a traveller on U won't become "preferred", therefore, NO upgrade options and NO exit row seating in advance....you are making it difficult for someone to attain that "preferred" status without paying 10 times the fare that Southwest is offering.

Or will you chance a center seat on SW day of departure? Almost all previous arguments continue to be lame and baseless and without full factual input..most people ,I assume that means greater than 50pct , trvl on orig trvl dates, so the bulk of the flying public got the full 395 value out of their ticket.

There are 22 rows on a Southwest 737. You've got a 33% chance of getting a center seat. That's about the same percentage that someone booking late on U will have of getting a center seat ASSIGNED to them two days before departure. And if you owned a business that was able to book in advance to get a lower fare, would you be inclined to book SWA with the full flexiblity - knowing that if anything came up, before or during the trip that you would get FULL credit towards another flight, whereas on U you'd automatically lose $100, and should plans change during the middle of the trip, you're out the money and should have paid 10 times the fare had you wanted a little "flexiblity". Put yourself in the businesses shoes- not grandma and grandpa and the horrible family going to Disneyland (if you don't want their money, I'll bet AA,UAL, or SWA will gladly take it). What would YOU do when it was YOUR dollars on the line?

FWIW, flights with 3 stops are very, very rare these days on SWA.

 

[whlinder]

And to add to KCFlyer's previous post, UA will let you stand-by earlier in the day if there are seats in your fare class.

But we should just save our breath (or rather our keystrokes) because U will be gone from the skies thanks to this move before long.

USA Today

 

[deelmakur]

Bless your heart "Reality Check", you just don't get it. Bashing the pax may make you feel good (and is the inevitible result of management suggesting that the customer is the problem), however, the company's revenue streams are like a sandwich. The top layer is the full fare business. The bottom is the junk discount, and the stuff in the middle is the mediocre, but steady, above average money that comes from people who respond to the stimulus of competitve marketing. The apparent current idea is to drive that middle to the top. Some of it will move, but a lot will not (or can't) migrate. Meanwhile, it has become fairly obvious that no carrier can restore profitability by squeezing the top layer alone. For one thing, in addition to cutbacks in travel expenditures, many corporate flyers are moving to private planes. This is a sector which, having recognized the opportunity, is aggressively pricing fractional useage to make it competitive with published commercial fares. I may be dogmeat, but getting rid of me (and others) will do nothing for you.

 

[deelmakur]

Amen. That's what I meant.

 

[KCFlyer]

Let's put the Southwest thing on the table. While it's convenient to use them as a threat, and indeed, we have all benefited from the downward pressure they put on fares when they enter a market, nobody really wants to fly them instead of US. JetBlue, by the way, is a more interesting product, and isn't necessarily in that category. That having been said, there are other products which will meet the needs of cost conscious frequent travelers, and that's what will bite this company where it sits in this current circumstance

Okay, lets use AA or UAL instead. They still have the ripoff $100 change fee, but a passenger STILL gets credit towards "elite" status, and the unused portion of your ticket STILL has some value left in it. They have first class, they have airport lounges, they fly to Europe or Hawaii if you want to go there on a free trip. So please tell me....why would they choose U over AA or UAL?

 

[GadgetFreak]

and where's first class "potential" which I upgrade people to every single day left and right? wheres advance seating in exit rows if you're preferred?


Here's the part you're missing...at that fare, a traveller on U won't become "preferred", therefore, NO upgrade options and NO exit row seating in advance....you are making it difficult for someone to attain that "preferred" status without paying 10 times the fare that Southwest is offering.

Thanks again KCFlyer for clarifying this to our friend. The point is, when the preferred benefits go, and with these rules they will, the reason for flying U goes. The nice stuff Reality Check describes is nice, its why I fly US Air. But this takes it away. Thats US Airs right to do if they think it will help. I just will seldom fly them if they do because they dont offer me anything better, or in many cases even as good as their competition.

This is assuming that AA doesnt announce they wont adopt these rules, comp all CP and GP to Plat. and cut fares 25% into and out of Pit, Charlotte and DC. But maybe I am more aggressive than the CEO of AA

[:bigsmile:] If that happens, this is a very academic discussion.

 

[AirplaneFan]

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On 8/29/2002 9:43:13 AM

Let's put the Southwest thing on the table. While it's convenient to use them as a threat, and indeed, we have all benefited from the downward pressure they put on fares when they enter a market, nobody really wants to fly them instead of US. JetBlue, by the way, is a more interesting product, and isn't necessarily in that category. That having been said, there are other products which will meet the needs of cost conscious frequent travelers, and that's what will bite this company where it sits in this current circumstance.
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WHAT?? There are MANY passengers who PREFER SW over U. If memory serves virtually all routes where SW and U used to compete (price and frequency), U pulled out of those routes. SW has kicked the arrognat butts of the so called majors for 30 years. For example, AA decided to compete with SW on the DAL-AUS route. AA matched price, matched frequency (14x daily), even allowed passengers to earn AA miles, let them reserve a seat in advance; what happened? AA ran 30% loads, SW ran 60% loads. AA pulled off of that route. SW is king in many passenger's eyes. They don't pull the pricing stunts that U is attempting to pull right now. So for many passengers if they want to fly domestically the only Internet site they check is southwest.com. If they want a second opinion they go to jetblue.com

 

[deelmakur]

Don't know if this link will work, but the story basically underscores what I said in an earlier post on this thread, concerning full fare flyers moving to private planes.


Yahoo

 

[MCORORES]

Think I have the solution to this hotly debated issue, but kinda doubt it on the other hand...but here it goes. For those DM members who purchase a fully refundable tkt, they get double the segments. For those who buy NR type tkts they get actual segments. For those who buy NR tkts and throw away the return, they get NADA. For those who continue to buy non restricitive tkts their status should be above Gold maybe something like Gold Elite with a little more benis than Gold Preferred and a little less benis than Chariman's Preferred. Now why do I think this is going to nothing but imflame more emotions here.

 

[ClueByFour]

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On 8/29/2002 12:54:41 PM

Think I have the solution to this hotly debated issue, but kinda doubt it on the other hand...but here it goes. For those DM members who purchase a fully refundable tkt, they get double the segments. For those who buy NR type tkts they get actual segments. For those who buy NR tkts and throw away the return, they get NADA. For those who continue to buy non restricitive tkts their status should be above Gold maybe something like Gold Elite with a little more benis than Gold Preferred and a little less benis than Chariman's Preferred. Now why do I think this is going to nothing but imflame more emotions here.
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That's basically what AA does now. It rewards those who overspend, and promotes loyalty amongst those of us who won't blow $1000 PIT-PHL.

Nothing wrong with that, IMHO.

 

[TomBascom]

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On 8/29/2002 12:54:41 PM

Think I have the solution to this hotly debated issue, but kinda doubt it on the other hand...but here it goes. For those DM members who purchase a fully refundable tkt, they get double the segments. For those who buy NR type tkts they get actual segments. For those who buy NR tkts and throw away the return, they get NADA. For those who continue to buy non restricitive tkts their status should be above Gold maybe something like Gold Elite with a little more benis than Gold Preferred and a little less benis than Chariman's Preferred. Now why do I think this is going to nothing but imflame more emotions here.
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It takes care of the "preferred miles" part of things. But we've said right along that there are lots of ways to do that.

It does nothing to correct the other problems with the fare structure (both the old and the new).

There are lots of ways to fix that too. The only ones that won't work are the ones that insist upon $2,000 round trips as the key to profitability.