US Airways ALPA MEC Code-a-phone update (extract)

[aquagreen73s]

A320 Driver,

6. The US Airways MEC retained the law firm of Baptiste & Wilder, who can be used to help decertify ALPA, file suit against ALPA seeking damages if the EC passes on the Nicolau Award to the company, or for advice on how to proceed to right the egregious Nicolau Award. As the MEC indicated in today's code-a-phone message, "the battle for our seniority" proceeds.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

You do realize that the MEC functions as ALPA national's agent in its representation of US Airways pilots, don't you? And surely you must realize that as ALPA National's agent, the US Airways MEC owes a duty of loyalty and care first and foremost to ALPA National - not the pilots. For the MEC officers to retain legal cousel for the purpose of decertifying ALPA is a clear breach of the officers' duties which they all owe to the union. Think about it...if what you say is true, then the MEC officers were meeting while on union business (using funds that belong to ALPA) to turn right around and begin to decertify that very same union. That's an ethical breach if there ever was one. Secondly, if the MEC in fact did retain cousel for the express or constructive purpose of decertifying ALPA, then each and every one of them would be personally liable to ALPA national for their breaches. Now, Joe Six Pack ALPA member is not in any sort of agency/fiduciary relationship with National (J6P is not an "officer"). Therefore, no duties are owed to National so J6P is welcome to get together with other J6Ps, collect funds and organize a decertification. In other words, it's not necessary to resign from ALPA before starting a decertifying drive. But make no mistake, for the MEC to supposedly "retain counsel with the goal of decertifying should the Nic Award not be overturned...", that is clearly a breach by the MEC members.

There is NO WAY the MEC retained any counsel for the purpose of decertifying. Maybe counsel has been retained to challenge the Award which, in that case would be a complete waste of money. But for the MEC to retain counsel to do what you say they are doing...no way Jose. I can't believe anybody on the MEC would be that stupid.

 

[EastUS]

And surely you must realize that as ALPA National's agent, the US Airways MEC owes a duty of loyalty and care first and foremost to ALPA National - not the pilots.

...........I can't believe anybody on the MEC would be that stupid.

You're joking on both parts...umm....aren't you?

 

[Bob Loblaw]

At the risk of sounding petty, it continually amazes me the depths to which USA320 is willing to sink. He latches onto every rhetorical statement from his MEC, he sucks the teet of anyone who has second or third hand information and he masturbates himself in the mistaken belief that the ejaculate he spews in the form of reasoned and sensible business acumen is Harvard grade seed. We have our share of wackos on the west but this guy - in my 30 years - takes the cake of absolute inanity.

Of course the east is asking for pay parity. What idiot union would not do so? And I'm dumbfounded that it took them this long to do it. The chance of it happening? ZERO. Tempe management may be clueless but they're not stupid. But it's rally the flag stuff for the bootlickers of union unity. Its required stuff. And the MEC spent THE WHOLE DAY in strategy development? Wooooooo. I used to have a fairly high opinion of ALPA at USAirways. Now that I've seen it up close it is such a joke that it even makes the AWA MEC seem like seasoned warriors.

All of this is opinion as are all anyone posts here. The brightest person posting here is no better than the most idiotic. Only the facts will rule the day. Not any of us. And certainly not any MEC resolution of resolve.

June 26th is the day this process will begin moving forward again. Despite what anybody on either side has to say about things the facts of the situation will be laid down on that day. Based on past history and actions by ALPA I'm not putting any bets on any of the east positions. Their day in the sun passed a decade ago. They are like the Mongolian warriors of ancient times in thinking that their resolve, their unity, their aggessiveness, their past successes and their numbers are still all it takes to win the day. I know only 20% of the east feels this way and that is what is represented on this board. But still! Lord in heaven guys. Give it a rest USA320. It really is embarrasing even for those of us on the west.

Bob

 

[USA320Pilot]

Aquagreen,

The "grass roots" effort to decertify ALPA and MEC members calling for this action is much stronger than many people realize.

Furthermore, I think most US Airways pilot's would settle for the company's proposed pay raise, no joint contract, and no action taken on the Nicolau Award or any other type of seniority integration.

What would this do? The two pilot groups would have pay parity and they would maintain their pre-merger career expectation. What is wrong with that?

Finally, today the US Airways MEC "authorized the retaining of the services of the law firm of Baptiste & Wilder. To help us, we are now bringing the Washington DC Labor Law firm of Baptiste & Wilder into the battle for our seniority," ALPA Communications Committee Chairman Arnie Gentile said.

What this means is that the US Airways pilots now has its own private legal counsel, which is from a Labor Law Firm.

By the way, did you see that US Airways' stock hit a new 52-week low?

_______________________________________________

Bob,

Bob said: "Of course the east is asking for pay parity. What idiot union would not do so? And I'm dumbfounded that it took them this long to do it. The chance of it happening? ZERO. Tempe management may be clueless but they're not stupid."

USA320Pilot comments: Want to bet your comments above are wrong? By the way, did you notice US Airways ALPA's comment about a pay raise were independently made and not done at a JNC-Company meeting. Hummmm????

Furthermore, "the (East) MEC reconfirmed the corporation owing the original US Airways pilots $70 Million dollars (two $35 million payments) as a contractual stipulation of LOA-93 and also called for an accelerated time frame for the distribution of those funds," which are payments not due the America West pilots. Can you tell me why this action was done outside of JNC talks?

For discussions purposes, if you divide $70 million by approximatley 3,000 US Airways pilots the LOA 93 pay out is over $23,000 per pilot, which is a payment the America West pilots are not eligible for.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[ableoneable]

Please explain how "demanding" equal pay will have any affect on anything?

The east contract is not yet ammenable. The only negotiating vehicle open to the east is through the JNC.

Why would management even consider raising east pay while not gaining the advantages of a joint contract?

I can see why the east would want a pay raise but why would management even talk to you?

Mobilizing the SPC is not exactly going to strike fear into management's heart:

A. East rolls over faster than my dog.

B. Even if your contract was ammendable you would be no closer to a release from a cooling off period than you are now.

C. Given the current legal atmosphere even if management took us back into BK and voided the CBAs the courts would not let anyone strike anyway.

As long as we can make demands and expect them to be fullfilled: I demand that USA320 grows a brain. - What? no effect! But I DEMANDED it damn it!

 

[USA320Pilot]

Ableoneable,

Ableoneable asked: "I can see why the east would want a pay raise but why would management even talk to you?"

USA320Pilot comments: To buy US Airways pilot labor peace, stop the 3-engine taxi program, find a resolution to the Nicolau Award, and take a major step to improve customer service in each area of the DOT consumer report matrix.

Another words it would be "just business."

Regards,

USA320pilot

 

[ableoneable]

Ableoneable,

Ableoneable asked: "I can see why the east would want a pay raise but why would management even talk to you?"

USA320Pilot comments: To buy US Airways pilot labor peace, stop the 3-engine taxi program, find a resolution to the Nicolau Award, and take a major step to improve customer service in each area of the DOT consumer report matrix.

Another words it would be "just business."

Regards,

USA320pilot

So the company will soon announce that they will open negotiations early with the east? They will also announce that they have no intention of further combining the operations, after all they just gave the east a large raise. All this is to buy labor peace and stop the three engine taxi program. (BTW - the three engine taxi program? Does the east have some 340s that no-one has seen?) Wow, the east must have suddenly brought an incredible amount of pressure to bear on the company.

The easy solution would be to announce that a couple of new 330s will be operated by the west and the east will be single engine taxiing their asses off.

 

[hp_fa]

I still don't see how ALPA National has any real and/or pragmatic choice then to accpet the Nicolau award. Any other action would cause a DFR lawsuit that would likely finacially break ALPA.

The AWA MEC is best served to keep a low profile until ALPA National accepts or rejects the award, and then decide where to go from there.

 

[ableoneable]

I still don't see how ALPA National has any real and/or pragmatic choice then to accpet the Nicolau award. Any other action would cause a DFR lawsuit that would likely finacially break ALPA.

The AWA MEC is best served to keep a low profile until ALPA National accepts or rejects the award, and then decide where to go from there.

That is what their legal team has advised.

 

[aquagreen73s]

Aquagreen,

The "grass roots" effort to decertify ALPA and MEC members calling for this action is much stronger than many people realize.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

You don't understand - the MEC cannot do anything which would harm ALPA national. You said that the MEC was retaining a firm which could assist in decertifying ALPA national. I'm telling you, if the MEC actually did such a thing, then they really are dumber than a box of rocks. In a sense, the MEC officers are ALPA national - they're the representative of the union which has been employed by the pilots of US Air to act as the bargaining agent. Meeting on union business time, using union business dollars, with the purpose of discussing decertification would be a clear breach by the AAA MEC officers of their duties of loyalty to National. They personally would be liable. Whatever firm has been retained could therefore never participate, advise, or assist in any way with a decertification. Whatever decertification drive takes place, it has to be completely separate from ALPA, the MEC or any LEC.

 

[BoeingBoy]

The code-a-phone indicated that the East pilots want a pay raise, but it did not say they want a joint contract.

If you'll examine my post, I said nothing about the East pilots wanting a joint contract. Still that reading comprehension problem, huh?

Finally, can you tell me where there is any indication that "Apparently the MEC has decided that they'd rather not continue indefinitely under LOA 93 after all. A change of sentiment in the East pilot group maybe?"

Simple - LOA 93 has no mechanism for a raise other than achieving a joint contract or waiting for the amendable date. Unless you can point out language otherwise - care to try?

You have said numerous times that the East pilots would rather "live under LOA 93" - with no raise to West pay rates - than accept the award and reap the fruits of a joint contract - one of whose fruits is a raise:

USA320Pilot comments: I agree that no US Airways pilot likes LOA 93, but they prefer the thought of living with LOA 93 and preventing the Nicolau Award from being implemented, if necessary. Why? Attrtion based career expectation and growth up the seniority list provides meaningful pay raises, improved DC Plan contributions, and imporved quality of life, which is what the US Airways pilots brought to the merger.

The majority of US Airways pilots believe the best option is to obtain an acceptable solution to the Nicolau Award and if one cannot be obtained then the preferred option would be to live under LOA 93 versus having the Nicolau Award implemented.

USA320pilot comments: I do. The vast majority of East pilots prefer to live under LOA 93 than to accept the Nicolau Award. In fact, the East pilots are now very content with LOA 93.

Why? The East pilot group has a contract in place and the vast majority of the pilots would prefer to live under LOA 93, which is legal, versus having the Nicolau Award proceed.

So you tell me - if LOA 93 has no provisions for an "immediate" raise to West pay, and the East pilots were so content to "live under LOA 93" to keep the award from being implemented, is not the demand for an "immediate" raise indicative that East pilots don't want to "live under LOA 93" and all it's provisions?

If you'd like, I can quote all the posts you've made explaining how the East pilots would be financially better off foregoing the benefits of a joint contract, with it's raise, by continuing to "live under LOA 93" to keep the award from being implemented.

As I said, seems to be a change of heart - don't want a joint contract, don't want the award implemented, but want the pay rates that LOA 93 doesn't provide. So much for preferring to "live under LOA 93".......

Jim

 

[PA18]

* The AAA MEC is demanding immediate pay increases in order to obtain parity with the AWA pilots, and that the Strike Preparedness Committee is reactivated in support of our efforts seeking “Equal Pay for Equal Workâ€￾ for the AAA pilots.


* After debate, the Negotiating Committee (NC) member recall resolution of Captain Donn Butkovic failed.

Jim,

It would appear that the above two items are mutually exclusive.

 

[BoeingBoy]

It would appear that the above two items are mutually exclusive.

Well, when one's aspirations are higher than being "just a pilot", it's hard to be too interested in the trials and tribulations of the little people.....

Jim

 

[AWA320]

I still don't see how ALPA National has any real and/or pragmatic choice then to accpet the Nicolau award. Any other action would cause a DFR lawsuit that would likely finacially break ALPA.

The AWA MEC is best served to keep a low profile until ALPA National accepts or rejects the award, and then decide where to go from there.

They don't!!! Any move other than what's outlined in section 45 will result in the destruction of ALPA. This is all for not as NWA has pretty much spoken in their assessment of the case and UAL will soon as well. All the letter writing and begging of the EC will do nothing for them as ALPA will not destroy itself for a bunch of furloughed pilots.

The absolute funniest thing I've read thus far "we are prepared to live under LOA 93 for years" Now even funnier "Mr.Parker we demand that you give us pay parity today with the west"

I guess LOA 93 isn't too comfortable after all huh boys and girls. USA320 did your reps also tell your pilot group that Parker's offer was a 15% pay increase for your pilots!!! Too funny, no milk without the cow boys...

 

[TheLarkAscending]

... it continually amazes me the depths to which USA320 is willing to sink.

Oh, that is limitless and immeasurable, you'll observe, over time. Looking forward to the anticipated return of the super-secret :wacko: invisible :wacko: sources, as they most assuredly will make their predictable reappearance for our reading pleasure.

"You ain't seen nothin' yet". Bachman-Turner Overdrive