US Airways & AFA Reach Tentative Agreement

[StewGuy86]

I think it's 41.50 per hour hr. if u fly CSD u get 6.50 on top of that and int. pay

Yep...current top rate (14+ years) is $41.51.

 

[Kev3188]

Off topic but can anyone tell me how to use the ignore feature on this website?

In the upper left hand corner it should say "Signed in as FlyUS." Click the drop down arrow next to it, and select "manage ignored users," and follow the prompts from there.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Yep...current top rate (14+ years) is $41.51.

Is that the top rate for the USAIRWAYS T/A ? 41.51? MM!

 

[StewGuy86]

Is that the top rate for the USAIRWAYS T/A ? 41.51? MM!

That is the current top rate as of 1/1/2012, when a wage increase went into effect for the US East FAs. We've yet to be told the compensation details of the T/A.

 

[FlyUs]

In the upper left hand corner it should say "Signed in as FlyUS." Click the drop down arrow next to it, and select "manage ignored users," and follow the prompts from there.

Thanks Kev3188

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

That is the current top rate as of 1/1/2012, when a wage increase went into effect for the US East FAs. We've yet to be told the compensation details of the T/A.

Thanx for the info, at the grind on SUNDAY, will probably be some info from that intl division! They always know! MM!

 

[BoeingBoy]

I'm not trying to get to any result. I'm just stating that $40/hr isn't an accurate description of FAs true hourly rate, but that working 8x5X50 isn't an accurate description either.

Yes you are and the last part of the second sentence is the point you're trying to make - that the average 40 hours/week worker spends as much time at "work" as an average FA and is paid about the same.

Most people don't consider getting from home to work and back as "at work" - I certainly didn't in any job I ever had including pilot. Most regular FT workers consider 40 hours/week as being at work and thus 40 X the hourly pay = weekly pay. An east FA, since they fly the same trips as the pilots (trips I know pretty well) spends 40 hours/week or more on the job and 60 or more at work to make 20 hours of pay. So tell the average hourly worker that FA's make $40-50/hour and they envision making up to over $100k/year - a pretty nice gig. Yet FA's don't make near that and spend an average of 60 or so hours/week on the job to make ~$40K/year - not quite what most regular workers envision. Heck, many airline ground workers don't understand how FA pay works. Why would you thing that the general worker population would?

Jim

 

[Newsound]

One thing I really wish they would come up with something that more accurately reflected what the average F/A earns then the hourly wage. Average person sees $40 to $50 per hour and thinks F/A's make a ton of money which is of course untrue. in my view, if the average person knew what a day in the life of a F/A looked like the flying public might not be so openly hostile towards flight attendants

In all reality a FA's hourly pay is more like half of the actual rate.

 

[Newsound]

I think the "average" person is smart enough to know that flight attendants do not make a ton of money. All you have to do is Google the question and you can get a pretty good idea of what a new or a seasoned FA would likely make in the industry. There are pros and cons to any industry or profession, but I think the public perception is that being an FA would have substantial perquisites compared to say being an AP clerk or a cashier at Home Depot, especially if you want FT benefits.

The average FT worker in America puts in 40 hours per week for 50 weeks a year to get benefits such as medical, dental and a 401k plan. They have to drive back and forth to work five days a week in order to earn a living. If we add an hour a day to account for the commute, that works out to 2,250 hours per year with roughly 116 days off for weekends, holidays, and vacation. That means that about 70% of their days in a year are spent at work to earn their $30-40k year in a career that doesn't require a college degree.

Now compare that to the same basic wages for a FA who has gained enough seniority to earn about that same level of income. They are paid for about 75 hours per month which equals a gross pay of about $36,000 at $40/hr. (75 * 12 * 40). The 75 hours per month works out to 900 hours per year. Of course not of their time at work is compensated at that rate, so let's add a factor of 50% to the 75 hours for uncompensated time to represent that time that they are "on-duty" plus their commute time. That works out to 1,350 hours per year or just 60% of the hours worked by a land-based FT worker. If the FA puts in five days a week or so, then they are "on-duty" for less than 5 hours per day or perhaps they are getting more than two days off per week. Either way, that works out to a 40% increase in time away from work or roughly 160-180 days per year or more where the FA is not on duty. That is probably where the average person will develop deaf ears about how miserable it is to work as an FA. I can hear it now, "Gee you only work about half of the days a year and get to travel to various cities and have the company pay for your hotel room and such while I'm stuck at a desk 8 hours a day / five days a week and all I get is a paycheck with very little chance to explore the great cities of this nation/world. So why are you complaining exactly?"

I'm glad that the AFA finally got past waiting for the east pilots to accept the arbitrated list and have come to a TA with Management, but hour for hour or dollar for dollar there are far worse jobs in that pay scale that a person could have to do in order to earn a living. Don't think so? Then why are there so many people trying to break into a career as an FA after all this time? Perhaps those on the outside are able to see the benefits a little more clearly than those on the inside.

I don't know where you get your #'s from but they sure are not from a FA. Most of my duty days are 10-13 hours. I don't know what flights you get to work but most desk jobs get to sleep in their own beds at night and have a regular sleep schedule. Yes I get to explore places, at the same time I do have to operate at weird random hours that a person at a desk would rarely if ever have to do. I have worked with the company 4+ years and have yet to make 20k!!!!! Even if you doubled my pay I wouldn't hit 40k

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

I don't know where you get your #'s from but they sure are not from a FA. Most of my duty days are 10-13 hours. I don't know what flights you get to work but most desk jobs get to sleep in their own beds at night and have a regular sleep schedule. Yes I get to explore places, at the same time I do have to operate at weird random hours that a person at a desk would rarely if ever have to do.

CG is unabashedly pro company.

What CG says is from a management point of view.

CG is useful against the pilots but just another company shill.

Take CG for what he/she is worth.

Not much to us.

CG IS the company.

 

[SparrowHawk]

What I find more than a bit interesting is he we are at post #38 and we have a Customer and a retired Pilot defending Flight Attendants against the Union Bashing "Company Man" and his string of half truths, obfuscation and bald faced lies promoting his Animal Farm bleating "Unions Bad, Company Good" mantra. Where are the F/A's in all of this?

Years ago, "Lime Boy" tried his part time job bull spit argument with me and until I looked into it, I swallowed the excrement hook, line and sinker. Like the song by the Who, I won't be fooled again.

As far as this mostly former customer is concerned, Management has absolutely no credibility whatsoever when it comes to Employee and Customer. I'm happy the F/A's got something and I wish the other groups well in their endeavors. Keep in mind that with the AA Merger Activity ongoing it's very possible that US may need to get it's contract issues resolved in order to get financing to do a deal with AA.

 

[NYCDelta]

In all reality a FA's hourly pay is more like half of the actual rate.

That's how I used to explain it. If I flew 80 hrs/month, it was pretty equivalent to a person at a "regular" job working 160 hrs/month for half the pay. So $40 per hour for a F/A is roughly $20 per hour for a ground employee. Of course, if you fly more, add in per diem, international pay, language pay, etc., it comes out to much more.
But I think most people forget about quality of life. My first 6 Christmas's at DL were spent in a hotel. If I was an "extra" I was by myself-and often most things within walking distance of the hotel were closed. As a nurse, I may work Christmas, but it's at time and a half, and I will still be home at night to celebrate. These are the little things that people don't stop and realize when they say how great it would be to be a F/A. Do I miss it? Absolutely! There are certain aspects of being a F/A (especially the camaraderie) that were great. But, the older I get, I am grateful for a job that gives me a quality of life I just didn't have as a F/A.

 

[CallawayGolf]

Okay, so the reality according to BB & Newsound is that the "average" FA at the TOS is working six days a week on ten hour shifts in order to earn the "average" 75-80 hours per month of pay, which at $40/hr in order to gross $36k or so per year. So that works out to about $11-12/hr as an effective pay rate. Is that the numbers everyone agrees on? 10hr*6-days*51 weeks to earn ~$36k?

If all of that is true then why aren't the FAs out looking into a job a Home Depot, Red Lobster, or Wal-Mart where they can reach an equivalent paying job that only requires 40 hours a week and gets them home each night to sleep in their own beds? Since that doesn't happen very frequently given the fact that it takes 10-20 years in service to get to a comfortable seniority position, then there is a non-compensation based or emotional reason why FAs choose to remain rather than go to job which makes more since on an objective (mathematical) criteria.

 

[flybynite]

Okay, so the reality according to BB & Newsound is that the "average" FA at the TOS is working six days a week on ten hour shifts in order to earn the "average" 75-80 hours per month of pay, which at $40/hr in order to gross $36k or so per year. So that works out to about $11-12/hr as an effective pay rate. Is that the numbers everyone agrees on? 10hr*6-days*51 weeks to earn ~$36k?

If all of that is true then why aren't the FAs out looking into a job a Home Depot, Red Lobster, or Wal-Mart where they can reach an equivalent paying job that only requires 40 hours a week and gets them home each night to sleep in their own beds? Since that doesn't happen very frequently given the fact that it takes 10-20 years in service to get to a comfortable seniority position, then there is a non-compensation based or emotional reason why FAs choose to remain rather than go to job which makes more since on an objective (mathematical) criteria.

No, that's not quite right.

It's more like working 4 days a week at anywhere between 6 to 14 hrs on duty per day. Flight time & pay on average can be 5 to 8 hrs domestically. And then there is per diem pay which is calculated as time away from base or the elapsed time starting an hour prior to departure ( 1st leg of trip) until 15 minutes after blocking in on the last leg of said trip. On average (guessing) 4... 4 day trips a month would come close to paying $600 just in per diem.

 

[CallawayGolf]

No, that's not quite right.

It's more like working 4 days a week at anywhere between 6 to 14 hrs on duty per day. Flight time & pay on average can be 5 to 8 hrs domestically. And then there is per diem pay which is calculated as time away from base or the elapsed time starting an hour prior to departure ( 1st leg of trip) until 15 minutes after blocking in on the last leg of said trip. On average (guessing) 4... 4 day trips a month would come close to paying $600 just in per diem.

That makes sense. So on the low end full-time FAs would work 24 hours a week or on the high end they work about 56 hours a week on duty, though I'm sure the average is probably closer to 30-35 hours to earn 20-32 hours of flight pay plus per diem. At $40 an hour plus per diem that works out to $72,800/year (20 hrs * $40 + $600 per diem * 52 weeks) on the low end or 97,760 on the extreme high end. So, combined compensation works out to between $30 and $40 per hour as an effective rate when duty time is evaluated with flight pay and per diem. At that level a FT Top of scale FA is compensated well above the national average for household income in the US before the rates are increased in the new JCBA.

Thanks for the clarifications.