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Update on Flight 718/June 16, 2011 (PHL‐FCO)

Iclubbabyseals said:
Rather than accuse me of ignoring something, a process that demands fore-knowledge, you could have made your post truly knowledgeable, rather than some pathetic half-arsed pontification, much like the west posters here.
Click to expand...

I guess you want me to cure blindness next...

I quoted the part of Pi's post that I was replying to, making the context clear enough for a blind man to see (now that I've cured blindness, any other miracles you want accomplished?). If you choose to ignore it, that's your problem so maybe you should seek help for your lack of comprehension skills. I may have some Dick and Jane books left from when the kids were 4 or 5 years old if you want to borrow them.

Jim
 
luvn737s said:
I don't know why anyone bothers to respond to you with your childish insults.

The fact is that the APU started when maintenance tried to start it. Capt Wells chose to shut down the only available source of conditioned air for the passengers and put their health in danger.

If I were the maintenance personnel assigned to this aircraft, I might have responded as angrily as she depicted those who were tasked with putting a working APU on MEL.

We are not privy to 99.99% of the back-room deals that USAPA cuts with the company, but I would not be surprised to see the NAC be told to accept concessionary proposals from the company as payment for returning her to flying status.
Click to expand...

Again since you ignored the first one, from the FAA report:


The FAA manager assigned to the US Airways certificate reviewed the June 16, 2011 incident. The APU shutdown the aircraft experienced is a failure that pilots are well aware can happen and that they are trained to recognize. The battery apparently was depleted by attempts to restart the APU. Flying an aircraft with an inoperative APU is not an unusual event and normally poses no safety issues when proper limitations are applied. The Captain simply chose to exercise her pilot-in-command authority of not accepting an aircraft.

And from Captain Wells’ sworn Federal Court Testimony:
Q. Okay.
22 A. At pushback when we had briefed the crew and the cabin
23 was ready, we were about ready to put call for pushback
24 clearance when the APU auto failed.
25 Q. And what is the APU?
DIRECT - WELLS
183
1 A. The APU is the auxillary power unit.
2 Q. And when that occurred, did anything else occur in the
3 cockpit?
4 A. Yes, sir. Unexpectedly, our screens -- we have what we
5 call a glass cockpit. All our screens went black. All the
6 lights, our emergency lights went out and -- yes. Yes,
7 that's what happened.
8 Q. Now, did you try at that point to alert the mechanics or
9 ground crew as to what had occurred?
10 A. Well, our first attempt was to re-establish the power
11 through our auxillary power unit. And that attempt was
12 unsuccessful. And so after that attempt, I went to try to
13 use our number one radio. Which is the radio that should be
14 available in the configuration in which the batteries are
15 only supplying power to the aircraft, the main batteries.
16 And I was unable to use the number one radio.
17 Q. So how were you able to contact the ground crew or the
18 mechanics?
19 A. Since we had no radios, we opened our sliding windows,
20 the side windows. And because maintenance personnel and ramp
21 personnel were down for the pushback, they were nearby and we
22 yelled for help.
23 In -- specifically to re-establish the power. And
24 secondly, to get maintenance up to the aircraft.
25 Q. Now, you had flown this aircraft on a number of
DIRECT - WELLS
184
1 occasions before this flight?
2 A. I have over 5,000 hours in the A-330.
3 Q. To you and to your crew, did it appear that the only
4 issue at this point was that the auxillary power unit had
5 failed?
6 A. That was immediately recognizable that it was a much
7 larger failure than the auxillary power unit.
8 Q. Now at the time that you had this failure, did you have
9 any discussion with your crew about any conversations they
10 had had regarding this particular aircraft prior to the
11 cockpit going dark?
12 A. During my IRO's walk around, when he returned, he told
13 us, the cockpit crew, that the ground crew, the ramp
14 personnel, had told him or asked him an unusual question. Be
15 sure -- something about, is the APU on, or to be sure it was
16 on, because they had had electrical problems with that
17 airplane all day.
18 Q. And when the person who makes the inspection obtains
19 information like that, is that a part of the information that
20 is then shared in the crew briefing?
21 A. Yes it is. Whenever they do a walk around, they share
22 what they find, correct.
23 Q. So after you had opened the window and called down, what
24 occurred next?
25 A. The ground personnel, ramp personnel, re-established
DIRECT - WELLS
185
1 ground power from the ground, and they returned the jetway to
2 the aircraft and maintenance came on board.
3 Q. And what did maintenance do once they had come on board?
4 A. When maintenance came on board, they came in, they
5 listened to what we said had happened. That the APU auto
6 failed, that the cockpit had gone black, that we did not have
7 our radios, that we had not had the expected overhead light.
8 And that they listened.
9 And one mechanic sat down in the first officer's seat
10 and attempted a restart of the APU.
11 And the second mechanic that was in the cockpit ran what
12 we call a bite test for the systems on the airplane. And he
13 said that the bite check had not shown an auto fail of the
14 APU or any other electrical failures. And -- go ahead -- you
15 look --
16 Q. Are you finished?
17 A. Well -- and I was gonna say that the first mechanic that
18 attempted the restart, was able to restart the APU.

So, if you can read, two out of three reports have the APU failing and not immediately restarting. On being the person that was actually there!

Can you read? My childish response? You have to be the stupidest of the stupid west posters.
 
luvn737s said:
5th grade called. It wants its insult back.
Click to expand...


I have finally had the time to read the transcripts from Cpt Wells' testimony. It is obvious to me that yourself and Clear, through his little comments, are in as much of a witch hunt as CP Yarko is.

Obviously, this happened at the time when the company was claiming that USAPA was creating problems, so it is my belief that management was on a witch hunt, especially Yarko, who had just got caught in a lie with another crew about the ETOPS operation.

Any reason that this particular Cpt would catch hell when she had a miantanence problem? Especially since she was on 2 committees for the union? Why would Yarko ask her several times if she was refusing to take the aircraft instead of discussing what type of problem she was having? Sounds like Yarko already had his mind made up as to just how this was going to go down.

Honest question......who is corporate security that shows up at the gate when things aren't going right for the agents, CP's office, or ramp tower? I had these goons show up to escort an AA pilot off the jumpseat at the call of an agent when nothing at all had gone wrong with the flight, she just got the goons in place in case things got out of hand after she screwed us about my keeping my positive space seat instead of bumping the AA pilot off, which she and I had agreed to.. Other than that incident, I had not heard of these guys through any training, FOM, or any other form of company communication. These guys are intimidating when they show up in their suits and you have never heard of them.

I DO NOT believe that Cpt Wells made a mistake, but was the subject of intimidation from the company and Yarko in particular. She did her job and I hope that none of us, as pilots ever get caught up in this kind of BS.

For you guys to continue your witch hunt is a disgrace to the profession....trying to second guess it all. You guys suck as Monday morning quarterbacks.

breeze
 
mrbreeze said:
I have finally had the time to read the transcripts from Cpt Wells' testimony. It is obvious to me that yourself and Clear, through his little comments, are in as much of a witch hunt as CP Yarko is.

Obviously, this happened at the time when the company was claiming that USAPA was creating problems, so it is my belief that management was on a witch hunt, especially Yarko, who had just got caught in a lie with another crew about the ETOPS operation.

Any reason that this particular Cpt would catch hell when she had a miantanence problem? Especially since she was on 2 committees for the union? Why would Yarko ask her several times if she was refusing to take the aircraft instead of discussing what type of problem she was having? Sounds like Yarko already had his mind made up as to just how this was going to go down.

Honest question......who is corporate security that shows up at the gate when things aren't going right for the agents, CP's office, or ramp tower? I had these goons show up to escort an AA pilot off the jumpseat at the call of an agent when nothing at all had gone wrong with the flight, she just got the goons in place in case things got out of hand after she screwed us about my keeping my positive space seat instead of bumping the AA pilot off, which she and I had agreed to.. Other than that incident, I had not heard of these guys through any training, FOM, or any other form of company communication. These guys are intimidating when they show up in their suits and you have never heard of them.

I DO NOT believe that Cpt Wells made a mistake, but was the subject of intimidation from the company and Yarko in particular. She did her job and I hope that none of us, as pilots ever get caught up in this kind of BS.

For you guys to continue your witch hunt is a disgrace to the profession....trying to second guess it all. You guys suck as Monday morning quarterbacks.

breeze
Click to expand...


well said Breeze, next time it will be a Westie... in this matter I hope we support them against this commuter airline ...
 
Do you really think that a west pilot hasn't had a mechanical discrepancy in the almost 30 years that AWA has been in operation? Next time??

How about next time the captain takes the time to deal with the issue rationally and professionally and discreetly with mutual respect.
 
luvn737s said:
I don't know why anyone bothers to respond to you with your childish insults.

The fact is that the APU started when maintenance tried to start it. Capt Wells chose to shut down the only available source of conditioned air for the passengers and put their health in danger.

If I were the maintenance personnel assigned to this aircraft, I might have responded as angrily as she depicted those who were tasked with putting a working APU on MEL.

We are not privy to 99.99% of the back-room deals that USAPA cuts with the company, but I would not be surprised to see the NAC be told to accept concessionary proposals from the company as payment for returning her to flying status.
Click to expand...

Western, did you take time to read her testimony, because you are apparently not comprehending the fact she tried to start it. And the ground hose didn't reach. Honestly. Your lack of grasp of basic writing is an embarrassment .she did not choose to shut down. It auto shut down. Go fly a trip if you actually are a pilot.
 
Claxon said:
Western, did you take time to read her testimony, because you are apparently not comprehending the fact she tried to start it. And the ground hose didn't reach. Honestly. Your lack of grasp of basic writing is an embarrassment .she did not choose to shut down. It auto shut down. Go fly a trip if you actually are a pilot.
Click to expand...
She is the only one I've read that said it auto shutdown. The maint folks said it didn't. And they easily started it, something that likely wouldn't have happened if the APU had a serious fault.

The transcript is her side of the story with hand selected questions designed to exonerate her with no cross examination. What's that worth?
 
Pi brat said:
Again Moron, read! The FAA, in a letter published by the company, said the APU shutdown, if not "auto shutdown". Really, can't you read?
Click to expand...

Do you want to re-post that as a logical sentence?

And the company didn't cross examine her with the hard questions. Why?
Click to expand...
Pity?
 
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