UA-CO Merger Rumors Now Surfacing on Wall Street

[jbguppy]

Actually I think Cosomo should challenge WT to a duel on the grounds of bemsmirching (sorry JB Guppy, I am too lazy to use 10 words when this one fits nicely ) his good name. Ualdriver could second him and, well, not quite sure who could second WT! With phrases such "getting desperate" I have noticed a not-so-subtle shift from speaking to the points to speaking to the person - always a grave error in disputation and debate unless it is meant in a witty manner such as Sir Winston's telling a female dinner guest that no, he did not contest the 'fact' that he was drunk, but that the 'fact' also stood that she was ugly and that in the morning he would be sober.
Sorry WT. I obviously cannot marshall the financial data with the skill of Cosmo to make a purely analytical judgement, but if I were to judge this round on the presentation of the data, I have have to hand the point to him as he has deftly lured you from speaking to the points.
For those keeping tally at home. I would humbly submit:

Round 1: Cosmo 1, WT 0
Cheers

UK,
no offense taken, besmirching fits just fine. WT is so desperate to make DAL's continued buffoonery look good he is making up pure falsehoods and outright BS at this point. He never follows up with actual numbers....


JBG

 

[Fly]

He doesn't even use links to his made up analyst reports. He's a desperation man.

 

[boeing787]

"every US network carrier has been in C11 so that is obviously not a meaningful distinction."

WT, are you sure about that? Last time I checked, AA has yet to visit the courthouse.

Let's all get one thing clear. Glenn Tilton has no desire to run UA for the long haul. He continues to shop UA around as a partner in M & A activity. Doing so would prop up UA's stock price for the short-term, and he and his joke of a management team would stand to make a lot of money cashing in their options. Tilton was hired to get UA through bankruptcy, not to run the company for the long haul.

Not true I was in class a couple of weeks ago. Tilton came in and spoke and we asked him what his plans were. He said he is working on a replacement contract with the board right now. Also he said he will not depart UAL until it is a profitable, sustainable enterprise not poised just for the short term but for the long term. He is a fierce competetor and personally I like the guy. But also he did bring up the European mega carriers and said that in the next few years US carriers must consolidate to compete against them. So I expect an aquisition/merger at some point in the next couple of years.

 

[WorldTraveler]

My apologies to AA as I am fully aware that they have not been in bankruptcy and I failed to mention it. The fingers were going too fast.

Yes, I have been merciless on my assaults on UA for years. What I can't understand is why UA continues to falter after years of deep, deep concessions in bankruptcy and the longest, most expensive bankruptcy in airline history. You should be extraordinarily mad at UA management and the board for failing to turn this once great airline around.

I tell you what. Anyone of you can post just ONE positive thing any nationally known industry analyst has said about UA since the 2nd quarter financials were released. The reason I haven't posted a link is because the analyst's remarks I post are by subscription only. The fact that the analyst's comments are based on publicly available information for each carrier only makes it necessary for us to be able to verify that information and see if there is a perspective that I have not acknowledged.

And, as long-term jousting parnters, Fly knows that I certainly do expect that DL may very well get the opportunity to acquire UA's transpac as well as its LHR and Chicago assets. I don't want to see UA or any other carrier fail but I have yet to see evidence that UA has turned the company around and giving it a sustainable advantage. The fact that the key summer season has now come and gone without a turnaround makes me seriously ask if you has lost its only opportunity to turn things around. In the airline industry, you can never be assured of a second chance before the next downturn.

Of course Tilton wants consolidation. That's been his mantra for years. Problem is he has yet to produce a viable company since 9/11. First it was a US taxpayer bailout he wanted and now he wants a merger. If UA is not a viable independent airline, no other airline is going to be foolish enough to acquire them until they go back into bankruptcy where the acquirer can call the shots and create a restructuring plan that will work. Tilton may be a fierce competitor in words but the minions under him can't seem to come up with a plan that gives UA out of the bottom tier of carriers. Today would be a real good time for him to align his actions with his words.

 

[UnitedChicago]

in the same spirit of my previous post - how about you not respond to wt anymore.

he obviously feels very self important in this industry. your responses actuall fuel his importance. why engage someone that's a michael boyd wanna-be.

it's time for someone to be the bigger person and just not respond...focus energy on debating much more insightful, deserved topics with mature people that have the mental capacity to debate in good faith.

so the next time he comes here to weigh in with his "superior vision", just ignore it. better yet, just put him on ignore.

who's with me?

 

[Bulscu]

. What I can't understand is why UA continues to falter after years of deep, deep concessions

...simple,










alignment...

 

[Fly]

What I can't understand is why UA continues to falter after years of deep, deep concessions

But the UAL f/a's make more than the DL f/a's. Simple, simpleton.

 

[Globetrotter11]

WorldTraveler said:

"Today would be a real good time for him to align his actions with his words."

USA320Pilot says:

"When would now would be a good time to....

Are you one and the same??!!

 

[Nor'Easta]

But the UAL f/a's make more than the DL f/a's. Simple, simpleton.

At least the seniority integration would be easy. No union for the DL f/a's = rock bottom!

 

[Bear96]

What I can't understand is why UA continues to falter after years of deep, deep concessions in bankruptcy and the longest, most expensive bankruptcy in airline history.

Oooh! Oooh! I know!

Is it because it hasn't had the advantage of your brilliance and wisdom to guide it?

so the next time he comes here to weigh in with his "superior vision", just ignore it. better yet, just put him on ignore.

who's with me?

I dunno. I find his "superior vision" to be very amusing to read. He's the most amusing poster on USAviation (well, maybe second only to a certain USAirways captain).

 

[boxer]

I believe that World Traveler lives in a double wide in the backwoods of Kentucky. In addition to Delta he advocates bourbon whiskey and smoking tobacco. His worst fear is that CVG will disappear as a Delta hub, being replaced with RJ's operated by United Express.

 

[WorldTraveler]

But the UAL f/a's make more than the DL f/a's. Simple, simpleton.

evidence? don't forget the value of the DL FA's pensions - you know the ones that only a few FAs will get partial value from the PBGC. All of those younger, not fully 30 year UA employees will see a fraction of what they were promised even with the PBGC guarantee. There's a reason the plan was terminated - because the PBGC won't pay benefits anywhere close to what UA promised,

Boxer,
you have obviously spent too much time chugging beers at the pool this weekend. Your comments are as unsubstantiated as any on this board.


The challenge is still out there to any of you - show me some evidence that someone of some reputation in the industry has to say positive about UA. I'll be happy to put a cork in my ranting but I would far rather than you all get mad enough about how poorly UA has been run that you would fight to get some things changed before it's too late.

DL and UA essentially split Pan Am in the 80s and 90s. DL has been slowly regainging parts that it didn't get in 91 (a daily flights worth of frequencies to Brazil and now the NYC-London route). There will be more if you all don't get off this boad and get mad enough to make some changes at the lazy U.

 

[Borescope]

The challenge is still out there to any of you - show me some evidence that someone of some reputation in the industry has to say positive about UA. I'll be happy to put a cork in my ranting.

WT,
Someone would post the evidence but i'm sure it's by subscription only, so you'll just have to take their word

 

[Fly]

WT,

Are you aware how the PBGC pays out the pension? The only workers that would be significantly affected were pilots and management. My payment from the PBGC and the payment I would have received for the years I worked under the pension were virtually the same $$ amount. My plan froze at the time they took over the pension, so I won't accrue anymore years of value to it (exactly like the frozen plans at DL!) In place of that frozen plan (which I will still receive all my retirement money at age 65) is a 401k plan with a company match (did they help out the Delta folks with one of those? I haven't heard you cock-a-doodle doing it, so I'd guess thats a NO) Considering that the original pension plan was so tiny to begin with, I have had a 25% contribution into my 401k for all the years I can remember....as do a lot of other people I know.

So I'd say they Delta people are making less than our "deep, deep concessions" over here at the lazy U. Hmmm, but how can that be?

 

[whatkindoffreshhell]

Not true I was in class a couple of weeks ago. Tilton came in and spoke and we asked him what his plans were. He said he is working on a replacement contract with the board right now. Also he said he will not depart UAL until it is a profitable, sustainable enterprise not poised just for the short term but for the long term. He is a fierce competetor and personally I like the guy. But also he did bring up the European mega carriers and said that in the next few years US carriers must consolidate to compete against them. So I expect an aquisition/merger at some point in the next couple of years.

You should've asked Tilton why Jake Brace is still drawing a paycheck.

Simply stunning that Jake still has an office.

Tilton is merely a puppet.