bob@las-AA
Veteran
The 502 in LAX
TWU gets 4.8% equity
- Thread starter AAmechanic
- Start date
They are getting 5 million for expenses. If they get one penny more there will be a lawsuit. They forgave our pension and grievances without a vote and then slid it in at the end of our contract filing in bankruptcy. The new company is expected to be valued at 10 to 11 billion dollars if we merge. That’s 480 million to 528 million dollars at 4.8% to be distributed amongst TWU members.
JFK Fleet Service
Veteran
I'd almost bet the farm they are planning on using that stake to fund a VEBA so they can tout "Maintaining retiree medical".Seeing how well VEBA's have gone at Catepillar and other UAW companies, I'd take a pass on that.
The TWU gets a 'cut' every week to 'put money back into the system', it's called dues.
The TWU gets a 'cut' every week to 'put money back into the system', it's called dues.
IIRC the 72% figure is the value given to AA upon merge - somewhere between $7.5 billion & $8.5 billion with the rest going to US Airways. I believe the APA used similar numbers to figure the $100K per pilot payout. The APFA already has a formula in place. The TWU; on the other hand, is up to the usual conniving. Wait for yet another brochure to be sent around with some lame excuses for why the international needs the money more than you do.
The TWU; on the other hand, is up to the usual conniving. Wait for yet another brochure to be sent around with some lame excuses for why the international needs the money more than you do.
More reason to sign a card and fire their sorry arses!
I believe the equity was for the employees in return for concessions. If the TWU decides to keep it for themselves then we can try to take legal action. If and when the time comes and we have the AMFA as our union then we can use AMFA's legal to pursue the money.
But we are jumping the gun here for now. We have to wait and see what the TWU plans on doing with the money. They already are going after our company match so nothing surprises me at this point.
But we are jumping the gun here for now. We have to wait and see what the TWU plans on doing with the money. They already are going after our company match so nothing surprises me at this point.
That's not exactly correct, but there is some dilution, which I'll get to at the end of the post. The equity stakes promised the employees were a fixed percentage of AMR by itself. A combined AA-US should have a higher market cap on the day AMR emerges from Ch 11 than would an independent AMR. Think of it this way: If a standalone AMR would be worth $8 billion (reasonable), then the TWU members would get 4.8% of that $8 billion, or $384 million. If AA and US merge upon AMR's emergence from Ch 11, and the combined entity is worth $11 billion, then you'd still get 4.8% of the $8 billion assumed value.
If that doesn't make intuitive sense, think about it this way: If Microsoft merged with AMR on the day AMR emerges, you don't think you'd get 4.8% of the combined value, do you? Most of the total market cap in that example would belong to the Microsoft shareholders, not AMR creditors.
The dilution I mentioned earlier is this: LCC stock has more than tripled in value since AMR filed for Ch 11 which means that LCC stockholders are going to get some value that rightfully belongs to the AMR creditors (of which the employees are entitled to 21.3%). In effect, LCC stockholders are getting a much bigger percentage of the new AMR than they really deserve, as the value of LCC would probably tank if the merger does not happen and AMR emerges independently. But with the APA and APFA banging the drum that a merger absolutely must happen before AMR emerges independently, it looks like emotions will win out over pocketbook.
I've said it before - when you allow emotions to enter into what should be cold financial decisions, you typically pay more than you should or you get screwed, and this is no exception. If AMR emerges independently, and LCC falls back to $5/sh, a merger in a year or two would probably mean that LCC stockholders settle for 10% or maybe 15% of the new combined company, not the 28% that Parker is stealing.
FWAAA, problem is that with your scenario the unions already said they have zero intentions on holding the stock for us. They plan to sell, and sell quickly. So your theory only gets us roughly the same amount of money and then 2-3 more years of the same a$$es in charge. They can do even more damage in that amount of time!
I do agree that most on here are jumping the gun. It's like filing a grievence when nothing in contract has been violated. However, I will ask this again, what will the TWU do with it?? They have put nothing out to explain this. As I have stated a long time ago when this 4.8% came to reality, not put forth by the union, but was found by mechanics doing their homework. The agreement does state that it will goto the TWU, not TWU membership. The TWU will do anything they can to keep that equity within the TWU and not disperse it amoungst it's members. This was part of the pay-off for the massive concessions, lay-offs, and rifs... Nothing better for the company than a union always willing to work in the companies favor all the time.
I can't believe you guys don't have enough cards already, just by everything that has come to light since BK started. Seems the TWU has caved to everything the company wanted, when the pilots have proven that by holding out and re-nego did improve their agreement alot better.
The bolded part isn't accurate at all. The pilots ended settling for the same contract they rejected before abrogation with just a few minor tweaks, like slightly smaller permitted regional jets. No additional money. The pilots demonstrated the truism that in Ch 11, you either agree to concessions or your contract will be abrograted and concessions imposed upon you.
Only in the airline industry and only because we never truly challenged it.
The pilots ratified their deal in hopes that it would expidite a USAIR takeover and new negotiations. Whether that pans out for them we will see.
AANOTOK
Veteran
- Oct 10, 2009
- 4,627
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Then there is AMR's portion which is split several ways.
-23.6 percent of the common stock in the combined carrier will go to American's labor unions which negotiated equity stakes as part of their new contract agreements
-3.5 percent will be distributed to holders of AMR shares and they may get more if the claims of the AMR creditors are satisfied in full.
-That leaves 44.9 percent for "double-dip" and "single dip creditors" which are described as creditors who hold prepetition unsecured claims for both AMR and American (double-dip) and those with just single prepetition unsecured claims.
Double dip creditors will receive shares of "mandatorily convertible preferred stock equal to the full amount of their claims," which will convert to common stock at 30 day intervals in a 120-day period following the effective date of the merger. The shares will be determined on a formula tied to the marekt price of the common stock.
Read more here: http://startelegram.typepad.com/sky_talk/#storylink=cpy
-23.6 percent of the common stock in the combined carrier will go to American's labor unions which negotiated equity stakes as part of their new contract agreements
-3.5 percent will be distributed to holders of AMR shares and they may get more if the claims of the AMR creditors are satisfied in full.
-That leaves 44.9 percent for "double-dip" and "single dip creditors" which are described as creditors who hold prepetition unsecured claims for both AMR and American (double-dip) and those with just single prepetition unsecured claims.
Double dip creditors will receive shares of "mandatorily convertible preferred stock equal to the full amount of their claims," which will convert to common stock at 30 day intervals in a 120-day period following the effective date of the merger. The shares will be determined on a formula tied to the marekt price of the common stock.
Read more here: http://startelegram.typepad.com/sky_talk/#storylink=cpy
So even though we make up around half the Unionized workers we only got around 20% of what was given to the unions. We paid roughly $2.2 billion for what may be worth $480 million. Once again, the worst deal.
