Reality

[PITbull]

The members decide if it is the end of talks...

Obviously, not for you according to all your posts. If AFA does not go to the table, I fear you may have a "breakdown" or emotional collapse. You said for mangement just to take what they need from all contracts and the hell with any talks, to make the business plan work, and ignore the contracts...did you not?

You piss me off more than anyone I've seen on these boards with your cowardly retorhic, and then you are the first to complain that AFA didn't fight hard enough.....

 

[TransatlanticFlyGuy]

You piss me off more than anyone I've seen on these boards with your cowardly retorhic, and then you are the first to complain that AFA didn't fight hard enough.....

OK, folks! I think we need to simmer down here a bit. We are entitled to our opinions, even if we dont agree with them. Some of you folks need to step back from the computer and take a deep breath.

 

[AOG-N-IT]

You piss me off more than anyone I've seen on these boards with your cowardly retorhic, and then you are the first to complain that AFA didn't fight hard enough.....

OK, folks! I think we need to simmer down here a bit. We are entitled to our opinions, even if we dont agree with them. Some of you folks need to step back from the computer and take a deep breath.

Trans,

What the hell dude? Let'em rip into one another here , here is better than doing it on the job and really raising a ruckuss.

The "On the job" tension level is already high enough...this at least affords people a chance to vent or de-compress before heading back to where the best efforts count. Just my opinion

Be safe everyone....even with divided views and opinions , We all are on the same team in the end. The enemy only has 18 months senority here...focus on whom the real enemy is.

 

[ktflyhome]

AOG -you have said it best

 

[usfliboi]

The members decide if it is the end of talks...

Obviously, not for you according to all your posts. If AFA does not go to the table, I fear you may have a "breakdown" or emotional collapse. You said for mangement just to take what they need from all contracts and the hell with any talks, to make the business plan work, and ignore the contracts...did you not?

You piss me off more than anyone I've seen on these boards with your cowardly retorhic, and then you are the first to complain that AFA didn't fight hard enough.....

LOL Sorry youre so upset Im not the one who is having a fit..... Im stating the obvious. You cant have it both ways. Youre laying the blame at 100% at daves door and afa must take responsibility for its own actions as well. Maybe it upsets you that i do the same job you do and i see things from a different perspective?The members didnt have a choice when talks ended. We were told to vote for the contract and talks ended and were threatned the same way you say Dave threatens us. We were told if we didnt vote for the contract that "danger" was not far behind. Now that things afa agreed to and the company has taken certain aspects of the contract and used to their benefit, ( due t oafa not reading the fine lines)you wanna call foul. The fact is we have what we have , we are where we are. The topic of this thread is reality. Reality is what were dealing with here my friend and all the talk of anger and "concession stand is closed" crap isnt gonna work here . Reality is were gonna have to give more , Plain and simple. I dont like it no more than you but im not in denial.Thats the difference here Im dealing in reality, which is what this topic is about. Please try not to insult me and throw stones. I havent done that to you because you feel the way you do , lets be adults here.

 

[michael707767]

Reality is were gonna have to give more , Plain and simple. I dont like it no more than you but im not in denial.

Sorry, but that is not reality. Reality is there are still a lot of things management could do to fix this company. Absent pay cuts from the employees, nothing has fundementally changed in the way USAirways is operated. If the pay cuts we have given them have not made a difference yet, further cuts won't change that. Our labor costs as a percentage of revenue are already the same or lower than Southwest, so we are not the problem.

I can make the same or more money outside of USAirways. If USAirways cannot make it without further cuts, so be it. But I will not subsidize management incompetence.

 

[usfliboi]

Sorry, but that is not reality. Reality is there are still a lot of things management could do to fix this company. Absent pay cuts from the employees, nothing has fundementally changed in the way USAirways is operated. If the pay cuts we have given them have not made a difference yet, further cuts won't change that. Our labor costs as a percentage of revenue are already the same or lower than Southwest, so we are not the problem.

I can make the same or more money outside of USAirways. If USAirways cannot make it without further cuts, so be it. But I will not subsidize management incompetence.

LOL It isnt the "pay" that is the problem look at their contract vs ours and others compare apples with apples. We still have alot of freedom compared to south west f/As.... My friend it is indeed reality no matter whos fault it is....

 

[PITbull]

USFliboi,

Freedom????????????????????????

Ooohh, you must be pretending your a block holder...


THERE IS NO FREEDOM AT THIS JOB AND NO MORE FLEXIBILITY. When pref bid comes in, the choices of building your block will become diminshed as you move down the seniority list. For the reserves, THER IS NO FLEXIBILTY and they are finacially stressed to poverty.

Go back into your cubicle, and stop pretending to be one of us.

 

[700UW]

The topic of this thread is reality. Reality is what were dealing with here my friend and all the talk of anger and "concession stand is closed" crap isnt gonna work here . Reality is were gonna have to give more , Plain and simple.

Reality is the topic, well here is some reality

Eastern
Pan Am
National (two times)
Midway (three times)
Braniff (twice)
TWA
Western Pacific
And countless others.

More airlines have started and failed since deregulation in 1978, and not one of the afore mentioned carriers were saved by employee concessions.

That is REALITY

 

[usfliboi]

USFliboi,

Freedom????????????????????????

Ooohh, you must be pretending your a block holder...


THERE IS NO FREEDOM AT THIS JOB AND NO MORE FLEXIBILITY. When pref bid comes in, the choices of building your block will become diminshed as you move down the seniority list. For the reserves, THER IS NO FLEXIBILTY and they are finacially stressed to improvishement.

Go back into your cubicle, and stop pretending to be one of us.

Hi Pitt as offered before ill be happy to give you my place of employment as well as my payroll number and supervisors name if youll do the same. I do the job you do and am not in denial. From your comments it is obvious now more than ever that you cant believ some one who does the same job you do has a different opinion...... This concerns me if your representing me because your not representing my views. PS Since you compare us to South West....... Please explain to the group what "flexablity that luvs f/as have both reserve and blockholdrs have that we do not ? I think when the truth comes out ( and again your used south west as an example) so ill stick with that, folks will understand why its not a pay issue.......

 

[USAirBoyA330]

Cubical on the 1st floor of Crystal Palace I think......

 

[PITbull]

USfliboi,

Obviously you think you know who I am, so furnish me your base and payroll.

Secondly, it is YOU that states that 99% of SW contract allows more productivity than ours. SO YOU CITE THE SYSTEMS OF PRODUCTIVITY. You offer the "apples to apples" equation that you mentioned in YOUR previous post.

 

[UseYourHead]

Reality is the topic, well here is some reality

Eastern
Pan Am
National (two times)
Midway (three times)
Braniff (twice)
TWA
Western Pacific
And countless others.

More airlines have started and failed since deregulation in 1978, and not one of the afore mentioned carriers were saved by employee concessions.

That is REALITY

700UW,

While it is true that most airlines in financial trouble were not saved by employee sacrifice, a few in fact were. Continental and TWA limped along for quite awhile, TWA being aquired by AMR, and of course, look at Continental today.

Now an airline like Eastern, boy they really showed Lorenzo, didn't they? Who made out better, EAL or CAL employees.

That is the kind of choice we have...Think about it! It is a no-brainer. I just returned from a 330 trip today, guess what the entire crew thought we should do?

I will give you a hint, it is NOT what most of the posters here subscribe to....

 

[700UW]

Continental Employees were screwed in Bankruptcy by Lorenzo, that is why Section 1114 was enacted to prevent the company having a judge wipe out a contract, that is poor example of concessions, CO's employees suffered for years and are still not in the top tier of pay.

And as for TWA you will not see many TWA employees left at AA, they were stapled to the bottom of the seniority list unless you worked at STL or MCI, the rest got screwed and were all laid off.

That my fellow poster is reality.

 

[USAirBoyA330]

If you were on an A330 then I bet the most JR F/A had to have at least 25 years! Of course they are going to sacrifice "lowly reserves" (as they call us) so they can keep their all holy "BLOCK".....
Who cares if more people loose their job right?