Outsider's look at AA labor issues

[1AA]

You would have to ask the iam why they sat out the protests to help educate the public. While your at it can you ask them why the didnt stand shoulder to shoulder at the quarterly aa meetings? Might have a little to do with us being in the position we are today.

This is another reason why the association is dysfunctional. It only preserves union dues and continued contributions to the IAMPF and the AFL-CIO. The membership is the big loser.

 

[dfw gen]

Very doubtful. Our position today is related to the Railway Labor Act and the handcuffs that places on the parties. If the IAM failed to exist tomorrow it would actually make this process take longer.

The fact is, the airline prefers IAM language and that's their baseline. If it was a standalone TWU there is zero chance we'd after to most of the IAM language. That being the case, many of the current TA's would still be open items leaving us further behind than our current position.

We always seem to focus on the wrong things. In this case the delays are supposedly because of the Association. It isn't.

Maybe maybe not. Personally i feel if there was an inkling of mutual support and solidarity the delaying tactics of the RLA would have not been so attractive to exploit.

 

[Art at ISP]

I believe outsiders just care about price and scheduling. Labor issues are always internal and field related.
The only time the outsiders are concerned about internal labor issues is when they see us at the airport terminals picketing and handing out literature. They ask the same questions. Are you on strike? When are you going on strike? I need to know so I can change my travel plans. Unless it directly affects them they don't care much. How many know about the upcoming strike by British Airways? Watch what happens tomorrow or the next day.
Oh, I didn't know. Why are they on strike? Will I miss my flight today? And so on. We insider's know what's happening. The public doesn't unless it hits them head on.

Actually, we are also concerned with reliability and on time performance, as well as customer service. While I realize that customer service is not within your purview, reliability is--for example, why does an aircraft RON at a location and mechanical issues are found during preparation for the first flight of the day? The fact is that AA loses money flying passengers--it's profit is ONLY from ancillary revenue, such as selling of miles to credit card issuers. That unto itself is sad.

Your members are not the only ones calling for management change--We who pay the bills are doing so also!

I do hope you can come to some agreement in the very near future, with our without D0uggie....I still maintain he is the root of much that is wrong with AA today.

My BEST to you all.

 

[NYer]

Maybe maybe not. Personally i feel if there was an inkling of mutual support and solidarity the delaying tactics of the RLA would have not been so attractive to exploit.

The NMB and the RLA were used in the same exact manner in 2010.

That's the point, we always look at who point a finger to and not realize the built in disadvantage we have and find a way to work around it to achieve the best possible outcome.

We continue to ignore the reality and just blame people and things that don't really have an affect on the outcome.

 

[dfw gen]

The NMB and the RLA were used in the same exact manner in 2010.

That's the point, we always look at who point a finger to and not realize the built in disadvantage we have and find a way to work around it to achieve the best possible outcome.

We continue to ignore the reality and just blame people and things that don't really have an affect on the outcome.

Circumstances were a little different then. But thatcis true

 

[NYer]

Circumstances were a little different then. But thatcis true

Same circumstances. Overplayed the hand.

 

[Talos]

You would have to ask the iam why they sat out the protests to help educate the public. While your at it can you ask them why the didnt stand shoulder to shoulder at the quarterly aa meetings? Might have a little to do with us being in the position we are today.

Those would be good questions to ask Samuelson.

 

[Talos]

Actually, we are also concerned with reliability and on time performance, as well as customer service. While I realize that customer service is not within your purview, reliability is--for example, why does an aircraft RON at a location and mechanical issues are found during preparation for the first flight of the day? The fact is that AA loses money flying passengers--it's profit is ONLY from ancillary revenue, such as selling of miles to credit card issuers. That unto itself is sad.

Your members are not the only ones calling for management change--We who pay the bills are doing so also!

I do hope you can come to some agreement in the very near future, with our without D0uggie....I still maintain he is the root of much that is wrong with AA today.

My BEST to you all.

Customer service is as bad as I've ever seen it. It's really a shame when you consider the profits they have. Years ago profits were harder to come by, yet the concern for customer service was much greater. You see stuff now that would have had resulted in a board of inquiry years ago, but now nothing because the company knows it's their fault. Really puts morale at a super low level.

 

[bigjets]

Unfortunately, instead of taking an outside perspective and use it to try and modify our position to try and gain support, we just tell ourselves EVERYONE around us is wrong.

That's why we don't progress. We actually push away trying to get support by alienating the very people we should be courting, like the public.

Why don't all the airline unions get together and really their Members to push for changes to the RLA, Which is the true hindrance. Instead we spend 30 years trying to get rid of the CEO's.

You’re out of order brother,

the AFL CIO is a group of unions and what they did was form the association without .........we all know.

 

[bigjets]

The Members and Locals gravitated to the tough guys believing it's what was needed to get what they want.

If these actions are what Members look towards it is what potential leaders will give them, whether it is effective or not.

We, as a membership, do not value the truth or the facts. We scapegoat and blame looking for those that will echo what we want to hear. Therefore we're not lead, we're patronized.

Think bob owens and the other basement airline CFOs telling us what the airline can afford......send them back restore and more....during the Great Recession!!!!!

 

[NYer]

Think bob owens and the other basement airline CFOs telling us what the airline can afford......send them back restore and more....during the Great Recession!!!!!

Correct.

During the BK it was Peterson saying to vote no, the Company would never abrogate. (note: they did with the pilots until they snapped into action)

 

[bigjets]

Correct.

During the BK it was Peterson saying to vote no, the Company would never abrogate. (note: they did with the pilots until they snapped into action)

As always I’m referring to the 2008 2010 negotiating where we got nothing and with the expert Analysis of our basement CFOs saying AA will give more if we say no. We said no, AA got what they wanted for free, and 9 years later still nothing, at least AA isn’t asking for us to give more stuff back, our union would be all over that.

The BK was rammed down our throat with OH voting in that contract.

 

[NYer]

As always I’m referring to the 2008 2010 negotiating where we got nothing and with the expert Analysis of our basement CFOs saying AA will give more if we say no. We said no, AA got what they wanted for free, and 9 years later still nothing, at least AA isn’t asking for us to give more stuff back, our union would be all over that.

The BK was rammed down our throat with OH voting in that contract.

The same people that told the maintenance group to vote no to get more are at the controls this time around. (btw-- it's the same people that said the airline wouldn't file BK. It was just a scare tactic.)

Using the same tactics and expecting different results... Here we are.

 

[Rogallo]

The same people that told the maintenance group to vote no to get more are at the controls this time around. (btw-- it's the same people that said the airline wouldn't file BK. It was just a scare tactic.)

Using the same tactics and expecting different results... Here we are.

Insane ain't it?

 

[1986Mekanic]

You guys voted those bozos in...