Why not condemn? Everyone else is quick to condemn we that are anti-union, that particular knife doesnt cut both ways?
OK AMT's Hit me with the new rumors...
- Thread starter bored30over
- Start date
Why not condemn? Everyone else is quick to condemn we that are anti-union, that particular knife doesnt cut both ways?
Kev3188
Veteran
it's definitely convenient for them, isn't it?
As a father, "putting my family first" means more than providing a roof over their head, and food on the table. It also means teaching them things like honor and doing the right thing, even when doing so may be uncomfortable.
Im definitely not doing such thing dal mech. Just like no one will hold you to the fire if you do not put insurance on your brand new computer or buy a warranty on your new stove for your house. Something may or may not happen! Its insurance/warranty on your job, no, your career as a mechanic. Right now you are driving a million dollar car with no insurance. World's biggest airline and no insurance on your behalf. Ask someone from nwa about the cash amount union workers got after bankruptcy, then ask a delta employee what happen to there stock before bankruptcy and if they ever got compensated for the loss. I can see you take your job serious, now take your career serious.
So being non-union means we dont take our jobs seriously now? :blink:
Of course no one got reimbursed for their stock, just like the Enron and Global Crossing people didnt get reimbursed. If you own any airline stock you are begging for a loss.
As I stated DAL Mech, you do take your job seriously, but not your career. Enron and Global Crossing compensated there "working family" with stock not raises in pay. They did not have a voice so they either had a choice to stay with the unbalance company or leave. Keep in mind there retirement was within the stock Enron issued out. Also, you state "If you own airline stock you are begging for loss". So why is your company compensating you with stock when you feel that way towards airline stock? If Im not mistaking, its part of getting you to industry standard. Just do a little history on "stock for the worker" or just look at the history at your company. Prior to you getting a 8% raise before 2000, your company said it will start a profit sharing program based off the profit for that prior year and they will base that off your prior year-end gross. When the number came in prior to publication, your company came back and did away with the profit sharing program stating profit sharing is not as "insuring" than "giving" you a 8% raise into your take home pay. When the number came back, your company posted a billion dollar profit. Base off the formula your company had set up to see what amount you will take home was to much for them. Some (based off there gross income) could have took home $30,000 to $50,000 before taxes. But they "gave" you 8% and then turned around and took it back and more in 2005. If my statements are wrong, please correct me.
I actually started in 2000, so I dont know all the details of the profit sharing deal. I do know that there was a stock disbursement and the people that did not sell the stock lost their shirts on it. We did get a stock dispersion when we emerged from bankruptcy, that was fairly lucrative as well as a nice chunk of stock after our acquisition of NWA.
I did however take that lovely paycut in '05, as well as a layoff. Considering the state of the industry at the time I was one of the lucky ones, I actually kept working longer than most in other airlines with my kind of seniority level. While laid off, I ran into many, many others with 15-20 year seniority, from other airlines, that had been laid off. there was more than one former United guy, that was pro-union, that was more than disgusted with how he was treated, by his union and company. It was certainly a dark time in our industry.
Quite frankly I take my career as a professional aircraft mechanic very seriously. To say I dont simply because I dont want to be part of a union is insulting.
Kev3188
Veteran
I have no doubt that you take what you do seriously. It's a shame that the company doesn't return the respect.
For the work that I do, I feel well compensated. The dream of working for the same employer for a whole career just doesn't fit into today's America. When I got hired into Delta I got the "This is the last job you will ever have" speech. Yeah maybe if I was hired 15 years prior, but no longer.
Thanks to the last few presidential administrations, this one included, I feel the "Made in America" idea is going to the wayside in the hopes of making money. The days of huge unions protecting the jobs of the blue collar man are numbered. Proof will be in the pudding here in a few months when GM snakes out of all the promises they have with the UAW, and guess what, the judicial system will support GM. Our market of vehicles has been out priced and better produced by foreigners. To think that getting into a contract and having a you union brothers standing next to you at the gate when the "replacement workers" drive by makes a difference is naive. They are no loner forced to "respect" us, we are simply replaceable.
I had the misfortune of working contract work for TIMCO while laid off, for a very short while(but thats another story), you could tell the laid off major mechanics, they were the guys that didnt go to MN to cross the NWA picket lines. Not because we were supporting the union, but simply because it was wrong. The worst thing was, most of the mechanics that went were here on work visas. Thats where the problem lies.
What Im basically saying is that we are in deep dippy and a union isnt what we need to get out of it. Send your dues to a PAC group trying to save American jobs. It would do more good.
For the work that I do, I feel well compensated. The dream of working for the same employer for a whole career just doesn't fit into today's America. When I got hired into Delta I got the "This is the last job you will ever have" speech. Yeah maybe if I was hired 15 years prior, but no longer.
Thanks to the last few presidential administrations, this one included, I feel the "Made in America" idea is going to the wayside in the hopes of making money. The days of huge unions protecting the jobs of the blue collar man are numbered. Proof will be in the pudding here in a few months when GM snakes out of all the promises they have with the UAW, and guess what, the judicial system will support GM. Our market of vehicles has been out priced and better produced by foreigners. To think that getting into a contract and having a you union brothers standing next to you at the gate when the "replacement workers" drive by makes a difference is naive. They are no loner forced to "respect" us, we are simply replaceable.
I had the misfortune of working contract work for TIMCO while laid off, for a very short while(but thats another story), you could tell the laid off major mechanics, they were the guys that didnt go to MN to cross the NWA picket lines. Not because we were supporting the union, but simply because it was wrong. The worst thing was, most of the mechanics that went were here on work visas. Thats where the problem lies.
What Im basically saying is that we are in deep dippy and a union isnt what we need to get out of it. Send your dues to a PAC group trying to save American jobs. It would do more good.
That mentality is why its the way it is now. This is not towards you personally DAL Mech, but thats how the Corp America would love for you and many others who drive Companies to profits and gains to think and feel. If you feel that you can be replaced, then it will be a whole lot easier for you too get replaced. The comment on "Made in America" is true. Our currency has fallen in other countries banks, with that our jobs. So with that said don't give up, hold on to what you take serious, your career. Its not to late.
Ok, enough with the pro anti/union fight for now. This thread was about rumors...So, over on the AA board there is a hot one about us. The AA mechs have heard DL is looking into leasing a couple of bays in DFW Hangar 5 for contract work. Yes that is the hangar we gave up when we closed DFW mtc.
Wouldnt surprise me, real estate is at a premium here in ATL and they are talking about escalating the Wi-Fi mod line.
I see it happening. if there is money to be made, it will go threw. Sad that they would use DFW location for leasing.
Delta Technician
Advanced
- Apr 9, 2008
- 149
- 0
Working,
Just as I and others don't understand the thinking of unionized work forces, unionized work forces don't understand the thinking of those of us who are dedicated to our company and choose to not be union. I started out in my young life working for my dad roofing houses in Houston TX. I got paid nothing and was happy to have food on the table every day. This instilled the work ethic I have to this day. I don't agree with every decision made by Delta management but I am not privvy to all the information that goes into making those decisions. My company employs me to do a job just as my dad did. I not only worked on those hot roofs but I also cleaned up the yards we messed up...union people call this out of scope work. I don't believe in out of scope work, if I see it needs to be done, I do it. I work in skilled labor but I am never too good to empty trash or sweep a floor. If my company says we have to give up pay or benefits, I have to weigh the benefits of staying or going. I can make just as much money going but I choose to stay because of my longevity with my company and I also have a dedication to try to help my company succeed in this trying industry. Hopefully this statement will help youj understand my thinking on this subject and I hope you will read it befor someone like Kev tries to tear it up line by line or word by word.
Kev3188
Veteran
For once, you actually make a good point. The way each of us "grew up" at our respective companies is wildly different, and getting one side to understand where the other is coming from (on a collective scale) is a huge hurdle to overcome. The fact that DL mgmt. is all too happy to perpetuate negative stereotypes while driving a wedge between the pre-merger groups doesn't make it any easier
I did this as well (construction, but not roofing). It is something very valuable to me, and like you I wouldn't have traded it for anything. As I grew older, it became a "paid" position, but the work ethic was something that stuck with me. And yes, we did everything.
The difference is that along the way, I also learned the value of having a collective voice in the workplace. Just because I'm pro-labor doesn't mean I don't believe in hard work.
I also learned the concept of honor, and of always doing what's right, even when it takes you out of your comfort zone. As mentioned in other threads, that is a lesson I will be sure to impart on my sons as they get older.
I think you'd be very surprised at just how many people at NW feel the same way.
I understand your not wanting a union especially the iam. But just remember that unions need to be out there whether you want them in your life or not. Most if not all companies would be paying third world wages if they could get away with it. I am living proof that employers will take a bad situation like the economy and squeeze what they can out of a worker. I work Maint Control at FedEx and took a 5 percent cut (permanent) as well as no merit raise this yr and no 401k match this yr and no bonus as did all salary employees did. While the hourly AMT's only took a hit on the 401K match. Why is that you say? Because FedEx is scared that the AMT's will vote in a union (teamsters) and any thing they take away from the hourly mechanics will only fuel that effect so basically they leave them alone. I was dead set against being in another union but now that I see how this company is unfairly targeting salaried for cuts I am now considering signing a union card since if the mechanics vote in a union, Maint Control will be included. ..Maybe this is what it will take for parity. Even though I am not happy about it. Here is an article for you to chew on to maybe help support my arguement/
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30154965/
