Official: AMR Bankrupt

[787nightmare]

The judge will give the company all of the things they could not obtain at the bargaining table, and the company will ask for even more than they ever did at the table. It is a horrible process for labor and you will be slammed.

The judge has no duty of "fairness" to the employees.

The judge is there to protect the interests of the creditors.

Your head will spin when you see what the company requests be done to your contract, they will ask for so much that the union will never agree to it, and then the company will request that the judge abrogate your contract.

Throw out all of your preconceptions of fairness, or reasonable give and take. This is an entirely new ballgame and you (labor) are playing with both hands tied behind your back. Every line of your contract and things you took for granted for years is in play, and it will really piss you off all the little things they take away along with the biggies like pay, scope,
vacation, pensions, medical, etc.

I'm not trying to beat you guys up, just sharing the facts of life with you so you can prepare yourself mentally and financially if possible.

Basically, all you can do is ride it out. I've been down this road before and it sucks royally. Good luck to you all.
Respectfully,

D

X2
Truth spoken here

 

[strikeforce]

The judge will give the company all of the things they could not obtain at the bargaining table, and the company will ask for even more than they ever did at the table. It is a horrible process for labor and you will be slammed.

The judge has no duty of "fairness" to the employees.

The judge is there to protect the interests of the creditors.

Your head will spin when you see what the company requests be done to your contract, they will ask for so much that the union will never agree to it, and then the company will request that the judge abrogate your contract.

Throw out all of your preconceptions of fairness, or reasonable give and take. This is an entirely new ballgame and you (labor) are playing with both hands tied behind your back. Every line of your contract and things you took for granted for years is in play, and it will really piss you off all the little things they take away along with the biggies like pay, scope, vacation, pensions, medical, etc.

I'm not trying to beat you guys up, just sharing the facts of life with you so you can prepare yourself mentally and financially if possible.

Basically, all you can do is ride it out. I've been down this road before and it sucks royally. Good luck to you all.

Respectfully,

D

the company can wipe out whatever they feel necessary to survive, but one thing they can't do is take my license away, and with that, the days of making judgement calls are OVER!!!!!! I will let my PEN do all the talking for me, and there's no judge, lawyer, creditor, shareholder, executive or passenger that can tell me how to do my job! that's the facts of life as an avionics mechanic!

 

[TWU informer]

The judge will give the company all of the things they could not obtain at the bargaining table, and the company will ask for even more than they ever did at the table. It is a horrible process for labor and you will be slammed.

The judge has no duty of "fairness" to the employees.

The judge is there to protect the interests of the creditors.

Your head will spin when you see what the company requests be done to your contract, they will ask for so much that the union will never agree to it, and then the company will request that the judge abrogate your contract.

Throw out all of your preconceptions of fairness, or reasonable give and take. This is an entirely new ballgame and you (labor) are playing with both hands tied behind your back. Every line of your contract and things you took for granted for years is in play, and it will really piss you off all the little things they take away along with the biggies like pay, scope, vacation, pensions, medical, etc.

I'm not trying to beat you guys up, just sharing the facts of life with you so you can prepare yourself mentally and financially if possible.

Basically, all you can do is ride it out. I've been down this road before and it sucks royally. Good luck to you all.

Respectfully,

D

I honestly do not think the plan is an all out war and destruction of American Airlines.

That would be a mistake.

 

[MCI transplant]

Um, that is the "STRATEGY"

And they have all the marbles.

<_< ------- I wouldn't be too sure about that! If they're not careful, it just might bite them in the tail feathers!!! In BK things have as strange way of getting out of hand!!!

 

[Buck]

Since bankruptcy is now a fact, what company programs are now on the block? Are there any programs that do not have to do with airplanes that could go?

 

[Kev3188]

The judge will give the company all of the things they could not obtain at the bargaining table, and the company will ask for even more than they ever did at the table. It is a horrible process for labor and you will be slammed.

The judge has no duty of "fairness" to the employees.

The judge is there to protect the interests of the creditors.

Your head will spin when you see what the company requests be done to your contract, they will ask for so much that the union will never agree to it, and then the company will request that the judge abrogate your contract.

Throw out all of your preconceptions of fairness, or reasonable give and take. This is an entirely new ballgame and you (labor) are playing with both hands tied behind your back. Every line of your contract and things you took for granted for years is in play, and it will really piss you off all the little things they take away along with the biggies like pay, scope, vacation, pensions, medical, etc.

I'm not trying to beat you guys up, just sharing the facts of life with you so you can prepare yourself mentally and financially if possible.

Basically, all you can do is ride it out. I've been down this road before and it sucks royally. Good luck to you all.

Respectfully,

D

I rarely quote entire posts, but I can't emphasize enough how dead on Dilligas is, and how much it bears repeating. It's a helluva ride, and I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy.

 

[Dilligas]

I honestly do not think the plan is an all out war and destruction of American Airlines.

That would be a mistake.

They see it as a restructuring and saving, not destruction. Workers see it as a radical lowering of their lifestyle and a destruction of what they have grown accustomed to and thought they had. And both views are factually correct.

Believe me, I am a strong and consistent supporter of the working class and I abhor what you are going to go through. I am not advocating they gut your CBA, I'm just sharing my experience and warning you what to expect.

Ask any member of any union (not union officers) of an airline that has gone through BK and they will tell you what I share is correct. It is merciless. I believe my first paycut was around 21%.... that hurts.

It is a bitter, painful moment when one realizes that the employees have ZERO voice in the process. And I PROMISE you, you will read about execs getting bonus payments during the BK process, "in order to retain their talent and expertise while we undergo this difficult process". You WILL see this happen, and it is infuriating.

 

[strikeforce]

They see it as a restructuring and saving, not destruction. Workers see it as a radical lowering of their lifestyle and a destruction of what they have grown accustomed to and thought they had. And both views are factually correct.

Believe me, I am a strong and consistent supporter of the working class and I abhor what you are going to go through. I am not advocating they gut your CBA, I'm just sharing my experience and warning you what to expect.

Ask any member of any union (not union officers) of an airline that has gone through BK and they will tell you what I share is correct. It is merciless. I believe my first paycut was around 21%.... that hurts.

It is a bitter, painful moment when one realizes that the employees have ZERO voice in the process. And I PROMISE you, you will read about execs getting bonus payments during the BK process, "in order to retain their talent and expertise while we undergo this difficult process". You WILL see this happen, and it is infuriating.

what's the difference...Arpey and co. got bonuses every year and we took it in the shorts....BTW, the guys at UA probably got pissed at US for taking such a beating that UA went after them a second time in BK. You're wrong that the employees don't have a voice because WE have the almighty TWU and Grand Puba Jim Little that's going to fight like hell to screw US even more!!!!!

 

[swamt]

what's the difference...Arpey and co. got bonuses every year and we took it in the shorts....BTW, the guys at UA probably got pissed at US for taking such a beating that UA went after them a second time in BK. You're wrong that the employees don't have a voice because WE have the almighty TWU and Grand Puba Jim Little that's going to fight like hell to screw US even more!!!!!

You are 100% correct. The show boating performance we all saw or read in the news of Jim Little's quote to fight like hell was just a media performance. behind closed doors he will give away the farm to AA. You watch.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I honestly do not think the plan is an all out war and destruction of American Airlines.

That would be a mistake.

It is not in AA's plan... if labor decides they want to fight the power that is given to the company in BK, history is replete of examples where the company does indeed end up on the scrap heap. Yes, labor has a voice.. I'm not telling you to roll over and play dead. I and a whole lot of other people are saying that the reality is that the company through the BK laws have so much power to change employee life it shouldn't be legal - but it is.
.
Fighting the company and advocating a campaign of "we will show them" will lead to almost certain death for the company... and an invitation for competitors to come in and clean up in AA markets, as if they needed that invitation to begin with.

 

[Birdman]

Your head will spin when you see what the company requests be done to your contract, they will ask for so much that the union will never agree to it, and then the company will request that the judge abrogate your contract.

By all the bragging we've heard about the TWU's bargaining prowess over the years and their rock solid contract language, surely they will not be subjected to the same harassment that AMFA and the other inferior unions withstood. We were lead to believe they're invincible.

 

[strikeforce]

You are 100% correct. The show boating performance we all saw or read in the news of Jim Little's quote to fight like hell was just a media performance. behind closed doors he will give away the farm to AA. You watch.

Let the horse-trading begin...........

Little, "I will give you the pension, retiree medical, 3 weeks vacation, 5 holidays, eliminate system protection, increase group health as much as you want, no scope....our mechanics will surely clean the lavs by hand, 30% pay cuts indefinitely, and BTW Tommy Boy, you can have a one-time do whatever you want with the slugs event with no union interference, and I won't let the membership know about this deal or let them vote on it.......as long as our dues machine continues to operate". Deal????

Horton, "deal"!

Who needs BK?????? If the TWU only had a chance.

 

[TWU informer]

By all the bragging we've heard about the TWU's bargaining prowess over the years and their rock solid contract language, surely they will not be subjected to the same harassment that AMFA and the other inferior unions withstood. We were lead to believe they're invincible.

The incredible truth is that nearly every fear based campaign tactic that the TWU used during the AMFA drive has now come to pass with the TWU as our bargaining agent.

I mean every member was told that what is currently taking place with the TWU representation is what would happen if the cards were signed and AMFA elected.

Amazing how what one sows becomes what one too does reap.
May take time, but this will also apply to AA Management.

 

[Birdman]

Amazing how what one sows becomes what one too does reap.
May take time, but this will also apply to AA Management.

The problem is we are now the one's who will reap what they have sown. This is a cut-throat business that requires more that the Caspar Milquetoast types we seem to have had at the helm since Crandall left. If there's any cream in the corporAAte milk I sure hope it rises to the top quickly.

 

[wrencher]

The incredible truth is that nearly every fear based campaign tactic that the TWU used during the AMFA drive has now come to pass with the TWU as our bargaining agent.

I mean every member was told that what is currently taking place with the TWU representation is what would happen if the cards were signed and AMFA elected.

Amazing how what one sows becomes what one too does reap.
May take time, but this will also apply to AA Management.

JUST ASK GORDAN CLARK WHAT HE'S DOING FOR YOU, NOW THAT HE'S AN INTERNATIONAL PLAYER.