Northwest Maintenance

[Ken MacTiernan]

PTO wrote: "You are a unionist for life Hackman and that is worse than being a Scab any day."

You must be kidding. Please volunteer for a drug test. Being a UNIONIST is how a person protects their craft & profession.

Being a coward behind an alias while attacking people willing to better their craft & profession is simply an example of a spineless person full of fear.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

You must be kidding. Please volunteer for a drug test. Being a UNIONIST is how a person protects their craft & profession.

You are wrong Ken. Had you made that statement thirty years or so ago I would agree but that is not the case here. Today’s unions are mere glorified babysitters. Hackman is but a child in the real world. I have read some of the pre-strike AMFA contract and some of it is unbelievable. The fact that Northwest actually agreed to it is ignorance on their part. The old school unions fought for realistic issues as to where you guys cry over having your birthdays and anniversary dates for holidays. The old school unions fought over poor working conditions you guys fight for TV’s in the breakrooms. The old school unions fought for forty-hour work weeks where you guys fight for short hours. Being a unionist is merely away to be lazy on the job and get away with it. I might be the odd ball on this forum but in the real world I am the majority of how people feel about unions. Your own declining numbers tells the tale on that story. As you can see it is never good enough for you guys.

 

[peaches]

PTO wrote: "You are a unionist for life Hackman and that is worse than being a Scab any day."

You must be kidding. Please volunteer for a drug test. Being a UNIONIST is how a person protects their craft & profession.

Being a coward behind an alias while attacking people willing to better their craft & profession is simply an example of a spineless person full of fear.

I hate to say this but the truth is the airline unions today fail at protecting "class and craft". Why? Because they are set up on the flawed seniority system and the philosophy of absolutes. For those of you who wonder what camp I'm (Union or Scab) it's neither. The ONLY winners under the current system are the criminals in the suits who are walking off with all the money. They win because of all the in-fighting between Unions, employee groups and airlines. As long as they have everyone fighting, they win.
God help them if ALL the Pilots, Flight Engineers, Dispatchers, Mechanics, Rampers, Flight Attendents, Customer Service agents etc. really did put their differences aside and stood together. But that won't happen because everyone is too busy maintaining their inflated egos. Everyone is so wrapped up in proving how THEIR union, job, or employer is better than anyone else. Remember, your Karma is going to run over your Dogma. In other words, the airline or job you knock today will be the one you crawl to tomorrow for a paycheck.

 

[Kev3188]

The old school unions fought for realistic issues as to where you guys cry over having your birthdays and anniversary dates for holidays.

The anniversary holiday was instituted as an exchange for (I believe) Easter not being a holiday. Maybe NWA/AMT or Chasbatl can correct me if I'm wrong.

The old school unions fought over poor working conditions you guys fight for TV’s in the breakrooms.

Nobody's fighting for "TV in every breakroom" contract language. Get real.

The old school unions fought for forty-hour work weeks where you guys fight for short hours. Being a unionist is merely away to be lazy on the job and get away with it.

Well, that's not your problem, anymore is it? Your book specifically eliminated the short hour and states that you'll be "expected to work a reasonable amount of overtime" wether you want to or not. By the way, have you read it yet? There's some pretty good stuff in there....

It's not about being lazy. It's about wanting a better tomorrow for everyone.

I might be the odd ball on this forum but in the real world I am the majority of how people feel about unions. Your own declining numbers tells the tale on that story. As you can see it is never good enough for you guys.

Now you claim to be a spokesman for society?! Give me a break.

 

[robbedagain]

You are wrong Ken. Had you made that statement thirty years or so ago I would agree but that is not the case here. Today’s unions are mere glorified babysitters. Hackman is but a child in the real world. I have read some of the pre-strike AMFA contract and some of it is unbelievable. The fact that Northwest actually agreed to it is ignorance on their part. The old school unions fought for realistic issues as to where you guys cry over having your birthdays and anniversary dates for holidays. The old school unions fought over poor working conditions you guys fight for TV’s in the breakrooms. The old school unions fought for forty-hour work weeks where you guys fight for short hours. Being a unionist is merely away to be lazy on the job and get away with it. I might be the odd ball on this forum but in the real world I am the majority of how people feel about unions. Your own declining numbers tells the tale on that story. As you can see it is never good enough for you guys.

Actually PTO, you are the child in the real world. AMFA was not, is not and will never be a glorified babysitter. They are a union that does fight for their members even when a crooked a** mgmt like NWA's goes out on the limb to hire POS scum bum scumbag scabs such as yourself for dirt cheap wages only to have the safety of the plane, crew, and the passengers in jeporady. I would think by now you would understand it but I gues since you are a pathetic scum bum scum bag scab that you wont ever know how these AMFA folks worked to get where they are/were until the crooks running NWA (into a cemetery to add)decided they didnt need the experience. Those that crossed the line are also scabs. Do not stop to think for a moment that MGMT WILL come after you and IT WILL HAPPEN. They wont even need to tell you until it is over. IT is AMFA that should of never accepted NWA's terms and I am very happy that they didnt. As for you, you had to take the bribes from mgmt to get the job you got.

 

[local 12 proud]

Now you claim to be a spokesman for society?! Give me a break.

Well after all PTO does dine in the terminal cafeteria and talks to thousands of travelling souls...has a direct phone line to the Pope...and he has slept in a Holiday Inn!

 

[robbedagain]

Well after all PTO does dine in the terminal cafeteria and talks to thousands of travelling souls...has a direct phone line to the Pope...and he has slept in a Holiday Inn!

all the while he is wearing his beloved NWA uniform!!!

I couldnt resist saying this!

 

[Hackman]

More high quality Scab Air maintenance.....

"They cancelled a fully loaded Northworst flight out of San Diego because the FAA could not get the Emergency lights to work on a 757. I guess contract maintenance was not able to fix the problem( maybe it just need a new battery pack) and LAX contract maint and or LAX Mgrs could not fix the problem either. Just wondering if Northworst has a department that actually looks at this types of cancellations and figure out the rev lost from such flights.I truly hope some bean counter is looking at all this and coming up with the actual rev lost because some 3rd party "SCABS" maint company and or Northwest managers who dont know how to fix a simple problems. I guess in the end you get what you pay for."

If the emergency lights are out, I wonder what else is broken? Another set of 4 main tires again?

 

[USAir757]

I truly hope some bean counter is looking at all this and coming up with the actual rev lost because some 3rd party "SCABS" maint company and or Northwest managers who dont know how to fix a simple problems. I guess in the end you get what you pay for.

You could have standard poodles maintaining the NW fleet and the bean counter would still be grinning ear to ear that he doesn't have to pay all of the unionized workers.

 

[Kev3188]

Just wondering if Northworst has a department that actually looks at this types of cancellations and figure out the rev lost from such flights.

Not sure about revenue (and goodwill) lost, but any NW employee can look up the number of passengers lost for any given day at any time. This same screen lists aircraft out of service, MEL counts, and on time arrivals & departures, and is updated in real time.

 

[finman]

Not sure about revenue (and goodwill) lost, but any NW employee can look up the number of passengers lost for any given day at any time. This same screen lists aircraft out of service, MEL counts, and on time arrivals & departures, and is updated in real time.

There is a very comprehensive model that I've worked on in the past that estimates the cost of a cancellation and delay based for various circumstances (fleet type, load factor, market served, length of delay, rebooking rate, time of day, advance notice of cancellation, etc) It compiles all of the hard and soft costs related to a cancellation or delay, and is used as a tool to measure the impact of an incremental occurrence, as well as support for business justifications that would reduce/increase delays or cancellations.

The big wildcard in the product is the majority of the costs are derived from "ill will", which although is a very important cost factor, is very difficult to verify in back-testing of the modelled results. (I.E., how many people of the 100 that were on the cancelled flight decided not to ever fly NWA again, vs how many flew only half as much as otherwise, vs how many were unimpacted by the event). It's virtually impossible to get meaningful feedback from customers as to how their purchasing decisions were impacted, hence there is a lot of speculation in this area, and the margin of error on the true "ill will" cost is naturally very wide.

If memory serves me correctly, a cancelled 747-400 flight would produce a cancelation cost of nearly $200k, where a narrowbody cancellation might only cost $20k, depending on the market.

 

[Kev3188]

There is a very comprehensive model that I've worked on in the past that estimates the cost of a cancellation and delay based for various circumstances (fleet type, load factor, market served, length of delay, rebooking rate, time of day, advance notice of cancellation, etc) It compiles all of the hard and soft costs related to a cancellation or delay, and is used as a tool to measure the impact of an incremental occurrence, as well as support for business justifications that would reduce/increase delays or cancellations.

The big wildcard in the product is the majority of the costs are derived from "ill will", which although is a very important cost factor, is very difficult to verify in back-testing of the modelled results. (I.E., how many people of the 100 that were on the cancelled flight decided not to ever fly NWA again, vs how many flew only half as much as otherwise, vs how many were unimpacted by the event). It's virtually impossible to get meaningful feedback from customers as to how their purchasing decisions were impacted, hence there is a lot of speculation in this area, and the margin of error on the true "ill will" cost is naturally very wide.

If memory serves me correctly, a cancelled 747-400 flight would produce a cancelation cost of nearly $200k, where a narrowbody cancellation might only cost $20k, depending on the market.

Very interesting. Is this data available to "the masses," at NW, or is it an internal program only accessible in the Finance dept.?

 

[finman]

Very interesting. Is this data available to "the masses," at NW, or is it an internal program only accessible in the Finance dept.?

I think at this point is it just an internal tool. I believe FP&A (Financial Planning and Analysis) is working on putting more science behind the "ill will" assumptions and inputs so that they can have more confidence in the results, and eventually deploy it for usage in various operational areas. I think the SOC (Systems Operations Control) already has a variation of this tool that they use to optimize their current decision making.

 

[peaches]

I think at this point is it just an internal tool. I believe FP&A (Financial Planning and Analysis) is working on putting more science behind the "ill will" assumptions and inputs so that they can have more confidence in the results, and eventually deploy it for usage in various operational areas. I think the SOC (Systems Operations Control) already has a variation of this tool that they use to optimize their current decision making.

Hey "Beanman", I got one to run through your abacus:
An announcement was made (at UAL) that all spare parts had to be accounted for. Henceforth any AMT caught with parts in his toolbox would be fired for stealing. So we all put all the hardware, lightbulbs, minitel headsets, 500MPH tape etc, loose into garbage bags and sent them back to stores. I wouldn't be surprized if, to this day, UAL storekeepers at ORD are still sorting through it all. Not to mention all the delays caused by having to order each and every screw, nut, bolt and lightbulbs from stores. The cost of ill-will had to be steep there. All because some beancounter needed something to do.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

I went through this very scenario a few years ago. There was so much turned in that no one wanted to sort through it all. It sat in a pile for months. Then the FAA came in and fined the company for co-mingled hardware. Also right afterwards the lines tripled in length and time for the AN crib and tool cribs, thousands of man-hours were lost. The pile of goods the company so desperately wanted back were boxed up and donated to a state run A&P School. Then the company paid through the nose as mechanics restocked their toolboxes. It was an absolute disaster.