Mechanics Have Reason To Be Upset

[Buck]

Lets see 2680 views. There seems to be many who consider this thread worth reading. Now we eolesen,WXGuesser and j7915 who are against Freedom of Speech. They have the right not to participate in any given thread, yet they continue to come back for more. I believe this is an open, but moderated forum. Every individual has the right to participate or not.


Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

 

[WXGuesser]

Me? Against freedom of Speech? HA! You REALLY don''t know me that well, do you?

Yes, I keep checking back onto this thread to see if there might be something said that is of use or interest. Unfortunately it keeps being the same whine-and-cheese and the same self-serving pap.

All I did after all, was answer RV4''s question.

TANSTAAFL

 

[Buck]

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On 5/21/2003 1238 AM WXGuesser wrote:

Me? Against freedom of Speech? HA! You REALLY don''t know me that well, do you?

Yes, I keep checking back onto this thread to see if there might be something said that is of use or interest. Unfortunately it keeps being the same whine-and-cheese and the same self-serving pap.

All I did after all, was answer RV4''s question.

TANSTAAFL

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Thats just fine, answer all the questions you want. But if you do not like the content of a given thread, you also have the right not to return. I would suggest that when you see those users in a thread that offend you, that you avoid returning. This would prevent you from becoming hypocritical

 

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

I love it when people wrap themself up in the flag of "freedom of speech" but have no clue as to what the Constitution really protects...

 

[KCFlyer]

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On 5/20/2003 4:56:59 PM Buck wrote:


Lets see 2680 views. There seems to be many who consider this thread worth reading. Now we eolesen,WXGuesser and j7915 who are against Freedom of Speech. They have the right not to participate in any given thread, yet they continue to come back for more. I believe this is an open, but moderated forum. Every individual has the right to participate or not.


Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.


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I was not aware that Congress had any say over a private message board, nor was I aware that eolesen, WXGuesser, and j7915 were members of Congress. Welcome aboard Congressmen.

 

[Buck]

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On 5/21/2003 8:58:18 AM eolesen wrote:

I love it when people wrap themself up in the flag of "freedom of speech" but have no clue as to what the Constitution really protects...

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Oh Eric the exalted one, may we have your permission to think?

 

[RV4]

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On 5/21/2003 8:58:18 AM eolesen wrote:

I love it when people wrap themself up in the flag of "freedom of speech" but have no clue as to what the Constitution really protects...

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I don't have as much love for those that use company time and company equipment while advocating wage and benefit reductions for those that actaully work instead of attending meetings all day and claim productivty.

Please educate me on the protections of the Constitution?

 

[KCFlyer]

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On 5/21/2003 7:38:20 PM RV4 wrote:

Please educate me on the protections of the Constitution?​

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Well, it doesn''t cover public message boards. Eolesen wasn''t telling you guys that you don''t have the right to express your opinions, it''s just that 6 pages of "TWU sucks" gets a little tiresome, even I would imagine, for many AMFA supporters.

 

[Buck]

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On 5/21/2003 9:18:05 PM KCFlyer wrote:

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On 5/21/2003 7:38:20 PM RV4 wrote:

Please educate me on the protections of the Constitution?​

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Well, it doesn''t cover public message boards. Eolesen wasn''t telling you guys that you don''t have the right to express your opinions, it''s just that 6 pages of "TWU sucks" gets a little tiresome, even I would imagine, for many AMFA supporters.

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again you have the right not to participate in any thread. If you find that it does not apply to you or concern you then exercise that right. Also understand that many of us are attempting to rid ourselves of the type of unionism that the TWU is built upon. I have been attempting this removal since 1989. Year after year and contract after contract more of the mechanics work is given away or the benefits of our profession are degraded. We enjoy aviation and would like to remain in this profession.

 

[KCFlyer]

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On 5/21/2003 9:38:47 PM Buck wrote:




again you have the right not to participate in any thread. If you find that it does not apply to you or concern you then exercise that right. Also understand that many of us are attempting to rid ourselves of the type of unionism that the TWU is built upon. I have been attempting this removal since 1989. Year after year and contract after contract more of the mechanics work is given away or the benefits of our profession are degraded. We enjoy aviation and would like to remain in this profession.

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But this is what I don''t get...I appreciate that you enjoy aviation and would like to remain in the profession, but doesn''t a union that strictly fights for wages and benefits, and puts job security on the back burner, tend to put more mechanics OUT of the industry?

 

[Buck]

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On 5/21/2003 9:57:50 PM KCFlyer wrote:

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On 5/21/2003 9:38:47 PM Buck wrote:




again you have the right not to participate in any thread. If you find that it does not apply to you or concern you then exercise that right. Also understand that many of us are attempting to rid ourselves of the type of unionism that the TWU is built upon. I have been attempting this removal since 1989. Year after year and contract after contract more of the mechanics work is given away or the benefits of our profession are degraded. We enjoy aviation and would like to remain in this profession.

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But this is what I don''t get...I appreciate that you enjoy aviation and would like to remain in the profession, but doesn''t a union that strictly fights for wages and benefits, and puts job security on the back burner, tend to put more mechanics OUT of the industry?

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Do you not strive to improve your general financial position?

If by your nickname, you are of TWA, either as an employee or a passenger, you need to understand that the wages and benefit packages have been degraded since 1983 at AA. In 1983 the "B-scale" was created and mechanics began to start their careers at approximatley half of the wage of the senior mechanics. The progression built into the payscale, was 5 years to the top for them and 10 years for the newer mechanics. Once the "B-scale" had ran its course, then the process was repeated and again and again. This in itself was a jobs program that allowed for those involved to maintain their jobs even if the economy struggled. AA maintained and has maintained a labor cost advantage over its competitors. Yes the top pay was comparable but AA maintained the lowest average wage for the mechanics in the industry. This newly approved T/A has made this situation even worse. Prior to 1983 or more specific 1978, the airline industry was cyclical. There were layoffs and rehires as the economy fluctuated. This was the way the industry worked. AA mechanics have been taking concessions for many years. There has to be a point where you ask yourself when will it end. At what point do we acheive to compete with inflation. It has been somewhat difficult to even maintain the cost of living in TUL, let alone a place like New York. Do we keep so many employeed even when they are not required?

 

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

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On 5/21/2003 4:22:40 PM Buck wrote:

Oh Eric the exalted one, may we have your permission to think?

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No. Someone told me yesterday that thinking was given up by the TWU as well.


Congress cannot deny someone the right of free expression or peaceful assembly. That doesn't, however, prevent private citizens or organizations from telling someone to shut up. It also doesn't prevent the operators of a bulletin board from shutting you up. I know you're familiar with that.

I, as well as about 70,000 other employees at AA, don't really care about the injustices the TWU has inflicted upon the mechanics. That's between you and your union.

Given the low number of people who have actually contributed to this thread, I'd say that I'm not alone in my opinion.

 

[KCFlyer]

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On 5/21/2003 10:39:26 PM Buck wrote:




Do you not strive to improve your general financial position?

Indeed I do, but not at the expense of my companies or my coworkers survival. I have worked for a bankrupt company before. When things were not going the way I would have liked, I left the company. I got on with a much more financially stable company at a salary that was higher than I had been making. That''s perhaps the single greatest benefit of not belonging to a union - I am not locked into a bad situation because of seniority rules.


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[RV4]

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On 5/21/2003 9:18:05 PM KCFlyer wrote:




Well, it doesn't cover public message boards. Eolesen wasn't telling you guys that you don't have the right to express your opinions, it's just that 6 pages of "TWU sucks" gets a little tiresome, even I would imagine, for many AMFA supporters.
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TWU sucks is not near as tiresome as the management suck asses on the board who are now even informing us what Church the new CEO attends, and how that makes him different. Tell us, what does this Lutheran think about domestic partners, and being the #1 Gay/Lesbian Airline of choice?

You, along with others volunteer to read/post this thread, and then complain about it, are you sure you are not in one of the unions on AA porperty? Because you sure imitate those dastardly union folk with your actions!

 

[Buck]

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On 5/21/2003 11:28:34 PM eolesen wrote:

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On 5/21/2003 4:22:40 PM Buck wrote:

Oh Eric the exalted one, may we have your permission to think?

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No. Someone told me yesterday that thinking was given up by the TWU as well.


Congress cannot deny someone the right of free expression or peaceful assembly. That doesn''t, however, prevent private citizens or organizations from telling someone to shut up. It also doesn''t prevent the operators of a bulletin board from shutting you up. I know you''re familiar with that.

I, as well as about 70,000 other employees at AA, don''t really care about the injustices the TWU has inflicted upon the mechanics. That''s between you and your union.

Given the low number of people who have actually contributed to this thread, I''d say that I''m not alone in my opinion.

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Given that the topic of this thread is Mechanics Have Reason To Be Upset I am not sure why you are even paticipating. You state that you do not care, this appears to be a falsehood. It is more likely that you have grown comfortable with the ease of dealing with the TWU and that they to most likely saved your job. I would fear a change also.

But the good news is that if you were to lose your position, you could certainly gain employment at a major liberal university as a constitutional scholor.