Leaked: US and UA in merger talks for over a month

[Travelpro72]

Back when US tried to merge with UA the whole DCA/IAD/BWI area was an issue. With US since shedding BWI would it be as big an issue as before? We're nowhere NEAR as dominate in the area as we were. Sure we have a big operation in DCA for the airports size but....

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Now the Three-way Theory

UA/CO/US:

All lose something:

Biggest Loser: US.... withdraws its hub from PHL in favor of EWR, loses some slots in DCA and LGA (basically equivalent to the shuttle. but focusing in up-gauging equipment) in favor of a EWR-based east cost shuttle and hub. The new operation would fit all mainline in the US Airways terminal (which is still owned by CAL?)

Middle Loser: UA.... withdraws somewhat from IAD, eliminates rjs at LAX, consolidating a bit there.

Littlest Loser: CO.... reduces CLE, or not.... at least enough to remove small jets from congested airports and airspace, including some up-gauging of equipment at EWR to mainline, with a marginal reduction in frequency.

Remains in Star

 

[767jetz]

Every single link is an article that references the same source, Reuters.

My bad. I was in a bit of a rush.

But your logic also holds true with the start of this whole thread. Among all the news articles in the last few days about DL/NW and UA/CO, there is one single article that mentioned US and UA and everyone is quoting it like gospel. For cryin' out loud... the link to the article doesn't even work anymore. This is another case of wishful thinking on the part of US.

As Art points out, no one is interested in the mess called US/AWA.

 

[Travelpro72]

US can't even roll out a uniform, fix their reservation system or join the biggest contracts. WHO in their right mind would find success in another merger with us? Those that say we have been "turnin profits", "turnin profits" since this merger need realize that it wasn't anything PROFOUND that this new management did. The stage was pretty much set considering we all get paid peanuts. We are a total mess and it gets better every day.

 

[sharktooth]

My bad. I was in a bit of a rush.

But your logic also holds true with the start of this whole thread. Among all the news articles in the last few days about DL/NW and UA/CO, there is one single article that mentioned US and UA and everyone is quoting it like gospel. For cryin' out loud... the link to the article doesn't even work anymore. This is another case of wishful thinking on the part of US.

As Art points out, no one is interested in the mess called US/AWA.

Agreed. Totally.

Unfortunately, the UA/CO scenario is in a similar situation, one, maybe two, independent sources. It is like one person tosses an idea out and it becomes "real" from an echo-chamber effect. I only thought to "research" the links when I noticed that three were written in the same style, almost word for word.

and I agree with Art. I think at least one party of any future merger will avoid ALPA arbitration, thereby avoiding an inevitable future mess. Unfortunately, US pilots have seemed to have been the beta testers for ALPA for at least ten years.

 

[USA320Pilot]

The Financial Times indicated yesterday afternoon that “US Airways and United are in merger discussions. United in turn is considering its own options in consolidation, including a combination with US Airways,†the people said.

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There has been a lot of buzz within CHQ the past two week’s and some indication to ALPA that the Tempe-based company was in advanced M&A talks, although the airline US Airways’ “executive suite†was in talks with was not disclosed.

Six major points surrounding a potential US Airways-United merger:

- Both companies are members of the Star Alliance, whereas Continental is not. This could permit US Airways, United, and its alliance partners to receive antitrust alliance immunity like Delta and Northwest have with their alliance partners in their merger.

- US Airways and United’s fleets would largely be compatible with US Airways moving towards virtually an all Airbus operation. According to a report released yesterday by Fitch Ratings, “compared with the other network carriers, US Airways' near-term cash obligations tied to debt maturities are relatively low. Debt maturities do not rise above $145 million in any year prior to 2014, when the company's secured term loan comes due. Debt levels will likely rise over the next several years, however, as the airline continues to overhaul its fleet and take delivery of new Embraer and Airbus aircraft. US Airways currently has 148 aircraft on firm order, more than any other legacy carrier, with 19 deliveries (14 Embraer E190s and five Airbus A320-family aircraft) scheduled in 2008. US Airways plans to use the new aircraft largely to replace retiring aircraft, primarily Boeing 737s and 767s, although it could also use new aircraft to grow capacity somewhat, if needed. Deliveries stretch out to 2017 and include 22 of Airbus's future A350-XWB wide body aircraft. Cash capital spending (net of financings) is forecast to be $385 million in 2008.â€

- In 2000 Stephan Wolf held a meeting with US Airways’ PIT-based pilots. At that meeting Wolf told attendees that United’s E&FA Department’s merger review indicated a US Airways-United merger would generate an additional $1.9 billion in revenue, which could be why the WSJ indicated “the (US Airways-United) synergies would also be "meaningfully higher" than the $1 billion-plus in annual revenue and cost savings number that Northwest and Delta have said they expect to generate in a merger.â€

- There has been some urgency surrounding labor talks with the IAM Mechanics ratifying their new joint contract and the IAM Fleet Service and IAM Maintenance Trainers recently agreeing to a TA. US Airways already has joint contracts with the CWA, TWU-Dispatchers, TWU-Simulator Engineers, and the TWU Ground School Instructors.

- The only labor groups without a new labor agreement or TA are the pilots and flight attendants. I believe tomorrow’s pilot representational vote result will determine how the company will proceed with the pilots and probably the flight attendants to reach new agreements.

- After discussion with a US Airways ALPA MEC member a US Airways – United merger would end the representational dispute between ALPA and USAPA. Why? The NMB will be required to hold another election if United and US Airways merge and USAPA wins the election because you cannot have two unions representing same class and craft. ALPA would win the new election, if it does not win the election tomorrow, because the United and America West pilots would hold the voting majority. This would probably cause the Nicolau Award to be implemented, but the parties would still need to deal with pilot seniority integration issues, but now the US Airways East pilots would be afforded the opportunity to deal with fences and restrictions because the Transition Agreement would remain in place.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[JetMonkey]

Here's how to make things easier for everybody. Break up US Airways and sell off each side. Sell the east to UA, the west to CO. United gets the east network their looking for, Co gets a much needed west network. Parker gets millions more from selling off parts instead of the whole so everyone's happy. Problem solved.

 

[sharktooth]

... Co gets a much needed west network.

I don't how Co could benefit that much, CO domestic route map.

 

[whatkindoffreshhell]

- In 2000 Stephan Wolf held a meeting with US Airways’ PIT-based pilots. At that meeting Wolf told attendees that United’s E&FA Department’s merger review indicated a US Airways-United merger would generate an additional $1.9 billion in revenue, which could be why the WSJ indicated “the (US Airways-United) synergies would also be "meaningfully higher" than the $1 billion-plus in annual revenue and cost savings number that Northwest and Delta have said they expect to generate in a merger.â€￾

Astounding that you would us a meeting from 2000 as justification for your UCT that you've been spouting for years.

US will hobble along alone. CO does not need to merge with UA. Those CO managers are very very smart.

 

[USA320Pilot]

American Airlines could pair off with US Airways or cut in on Northwest, Delta

See Story

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[back2CLT]

Here's how to make things easier for everybody. Break up US Airways and sell off each side. Sell the east to UA, the west to CO. United gets the east network their looking for, Co gets a much needed west network. Parker gets millions more from selling off parts instead of the whole so everyone's happy. Problem solved.

Agreed...I was having the same thoughts....

 

[cageyjames]

My worst nightmare might come true. I ran away from US to UA and now I might have to deal with all this nightmare again?

US should stay were it is that way I can avoid it. If they merge I'll never be sure that I'm not flying on a POS aircraft with horrible management that creates unhappy employees.

 

[Black Magic]

Sorry guys as much as I know you would like to break US east/west in half its not going to happen. Mergers dont work like that.

 

[robbedagain]

somehow i dont see us as being broken up given that they have the 2nd healthiest finanical sheet behind swa but i have to wonder what swa must be thinking

 

[CubsFanJohn]

This is sure a surprise. But I could see UA making PHL a Focus City, but this would help UA in the Northeast.