Larry Pike of 567 FIRED ?

TWU informer said:
And unlike the TWU, we could fire Seham also if need be if we were represented by AMFA.
Under the TWU, we have to live with the attorney that belongs to the DNC, and all politically correct affiliations.

As you have now seen, the Union Member at American Airlines wants the attorney that gets results and the "affiliations" are meaningless.

Now I know the Kool-Aid you drink makes affiliations top priority, but get outside your little circle and you will see what really matters, and that is what the member wants.
Click to expand...
And why has every other craft union Seham has been employed by fired him? Because the members voted for it? No because he did not act on behalf of the membership and the leadership fired him. USAPA questioned his billing and what did Seham do? Hire a law firm that specializes in protecting him from disbarment. Nice.
 
Overspeed said:
And why has every other craft union Seham has been employed by fired him? Because the members voted for it? No because he did not act on behalf of the membership and the leadership fired him. USAPA questioned his billing and what did Seham do? Hire a law firm that specializes in protecting him from disbarment. Nice.
Click to expand...

If you bothered to look a little deeper you might find its not as clear cut as you'd like to make it out to be.

The rest of the story...

http://compasscorrectioncoalition.com/2011/10/25/romance-at-the-usapa-headquarters/
 
ThirdSeatHero said:
If you bothered to look a little deeper you might find its not as clear cut as you'd like to make it out to be.

The rest of the story...

http://compasscorrectioncoalition.com/2011/10/25/romance-at-the-usapa-headquarters/
Click to expand...
Then again. Why did Seham not explain his billing statement and hire a firm that specializes in disbarment? He knows he is guilty.

The post you filed is written by who? People like you with blind faith in people that promise a fantasy. The reality is terrifying. Again. SWAPA, APA, and USAPA all fired Seham. Why? APA leaders even wrote about the Seham firms history of anti labor practices years ago but you still love them.

http://www.unbiasedfacts.org/APAonseeham.pdf
 
Overspeed said:
Then again. Why did Seham not explain his billing statement and hire a firm that specializes in disbarment? He knows he is guilty.

How do know that he didn't? Is this your opinion again? I'm sure it was the same reason Pike brought an attorney. You have people like yourself on the other side of the table with questionable intentions.

The post you filed is written by who? People like you with blind faith in people that promise a fantasy. The reality is terrifying. Again. SWAPA, APA, and USAPA all fired Seham. Why? APA leaders even wrote about the Seham firms history of anti labor practices years ago but you still love them

Promise a fantasy? Are you talking about the twu? The letter seems to say something different than your delusional rants. The firm was hired for one case and one case only,but I guess you are still being the usual OVERSPIN.



http://www.unbiasedf...APAonseeham.pdf
Click to expand...
 
Compared to ANY scumbag in the TWU International Seham is a saint!!! And has done 100 times more for betterment of the aircraft mechanic.
 
Overspeed said:
Then again. Why did Seham not explain his billing statement and hire a firm that specializes in disbarment? He knows he is guilty.

The post you filed is written by who? People like you with blind faith in people that promise a fantasy. The reality is terrifying. Again. SWAPA, APA, and USAPA all fired Seham. Why? APA leaders even wrote about the Seham firms history of anti labor practices years ago but you still love them.

http://www.unbiasedfacts.org/APAonseeham.pdf
Click to expand...

Give it up Overspeed, nobody cares if some unions didn't like Sehamm. Seems that your shyte doesn't stick to anything anymore, What next are you going to start calling him Teflon Sehamm? That probably wont stick either. Besides the letter you cite was wriiten in 1992, twenty years ago, about Lee Sehamms father, as it cites that the Sehamm they are talking about is "well into his 60s and in failing health". If not Lee looks really good for someone who is well into his 80s.
 
furp said:
Compared to ANY scumbag in the TWU International Seham is a saint!!! And has done 100 times more for betterment of the aircraft mechanic.
Click to expand...


Where did I hear that name before?


Cleared for Takeoff: Airline Labor Relations Since Deregulation


As general counsel to the Allied Pilots Association (APA), the independent certified representative of the American Airlines pilots, I was close to the negotiations that resulted, in 1983, in one of the earliest realization of the two-tier system. APA was not faced with an insolvent or failing carrier; it was, however, forced to deal with an economic environment that had changed dramatically because of the effects of deregulation and was, by virtue of its independence, mandated to reach an agreement consistent with the needs and objectives of its constituency.

—Martin C. Seham
 
"You guys need to learn to expect less!!!

Bobby "expect less" Gless

TWU INTERNATIONAL SELLOUT
A4 FIRST CLASS FLYING
SIX FIGURE INCOME
FREE CAR YEARLY
HIGH SCHOOL DROP OUT!!!
 
The only union to negotiate more for them self than they do for there members. Dont forget the raise they got in union dues. Im sure there raise wont get ate up by thier increase in medical like ours.
 
Bob Owens said:
Give it up Overspeed, nobody cares if some unions didn't like Sehamm. Seems that your shyte doesn't stick to anything anymore, What next are you going to start calling him Teflon Sehamm? That probably wont stick either. Besides the letter you cite was wriiten in 1992, twenty years ago, about Lee Sehamms father, as it cites that the Sehamm they are talking about is "well into his 60s and in failing health". If not Lee looks really good for someone who is well into his 80s.
Click to expand...



Seham’s firm was fired by the APA in the early 1990s at a time when Seham worked there and was actively involved in pilot representation. The APA leadership has changed many times, but has never seen fit to rehire Seham. Seham helped form USAPA and traveled the country urging USAirways pilots to leave ALPA , but during his three year tenure as counsel he was unable to secure a new collective bargaining agreement. Seham was fired by the President of USAPA in 2011. There has since been a change in leadership, but Seham has not been rehired. He helped set up the PFAA at NWA, but they fired him too.

As someone else stated, he has been around this industry for many years representing management and labor with very mixed results. He has represented, at different times, AA pilots, flight attendants, ramp, and mechanics in terminations and his record is very mixed. Frankly, some of the cases he lost were tough, just as some of the ones he won were difficult for management to prove. However, there are a number of union officers as well as other outside lawyers who have compiled much better records against American. Elsewhere in the industry the record is even more mixed. He was responsible for two of the worst RLA decisions of the last twenty years in the 1990s and, as I well remember, after AMFA promised Tulsa mechanics that he would win both force majeure arbitrations at Northwest, they in fact were lost and virtually none of the affected mechanics were returned to work.

Lawyers come and go and AMFA can have whatever lawyer it wants. However, the idea that Seham is highly respected, much less feared, by American or any other carrier is ridiculous, and that is the claim that started this basically irrelevant debate. AMFA has declined from over 18,000 members to 3,000 over the last decade and, during these years, has suffered many setbacks in court and in arbitration. If you feel that in the process it has advanced the interests of mechanics, join the AMFA circus, but few objective observers in the industry are as easily fooled.
 
Bob Owens said:
Give it up Overspeed, nobody cares if some unions didn't like Sehamm. Seems that your shyte doesn't stick to anything anymore, What next are you going to start calling him Teflon Sehamm? That probably wont stick either. Besides the letter you cite was wriiten in 1992, twenty years ago, about Lee Sehamms father, as it cites that the Sehamm they are talking about is "well into his 60s and in failing health". If not Lee looks really good for someone who is well into his 80s.
Click to expand...
Bob, Lee Seham learned from the best. Like father like son. Lee Seham was the "professional" legal counsel for AMFA during the period they lost 80% of their membership. Bob face it. The Seham law firm has done nothing but harm to labor. SWAPA, USAPA, and the APA know that and you think they are awesome. Your judgement is horrible and luckily enough smart AMTs woke up and vote yes this time. Too bad they didn't wake up and call BS when you recommended we vote down the May 2010 TA. Now we are still working through the after effects of the killer judgement of your dream team of Pike, Ruiz, Rojas, and Peterson.

The facts are there but hey, you are out for yourself Bob and those pesky overhaul members in TUL...you could give a damn about them as long as you get your geo-pay.



From: Dave Bates
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 18:05:17 -0600
To: 'DPA Mail'
Subject: RE: Introduction to the Delta Pilots Association



Mr. Caplinger,

Sorry for the delay in responding to you.

I want to be perfectly clear. In my opinion, a breakaway from ALPA would likely prove highly disadvantageous for the pilots at Delta and destructive to our profession. When APA broke away from ALPA in 1963 the labor environment for airline pilots in the United States was far different than it is today. JFK was the President at the time and had recently come out strongly in favor of organized pilots in the Southern Airways dispute of 1962. American’s pilots prospered during the benign days of regulation which ended abruptly with the onset of deregulation.

I have always thought it is better to work within the existing political framework to achieve reform than by wreaking havoc upon one’s organization. After I was hired at American, I led the battle against the two tier pay system – not by trying to tear things apart, but by working within the system. Ultimately, with patience and perseverance, we prevailed.

I view the Seham law firm as an organization which has done significant harm for a very long time to American organized labor. Over the years they have tried to raid nearly every union in the airline industry and succeeded in decertifying AFA/IBT/IAM and ALPA. Their predecessor firm, Seham, Klien & Zelman, represented management at a number of airlines and steamship companies and helped break unions at El Al and indirectly assisted Frank Lorenzo at Eastern Airlines.

Shortly after the Sehams were dismissed at APA, they began coordinating with a pro-management dissident group at American called the AICA which has been trying to destabilize and decertify APA. They are also involved on American’s property in a decertification effort with the TWU and were heavily involved with the disaster which occurred with the mechanics at Northwest.

I hope that you will carefully evaluate your present course of action. I know that institutional inertia is a difficult thing to overcome, however I think that a Delta breakaway from ALPA would further fracture and destabilize our profession and play right into the hands of management. I am working in exactly the opposite direction – trying to move pilot unions closer together. It might interest you to know that APA has recently signed a services agreement with ALPA to help APA in its efforts to negotiate a new collective bargaining agreement.

Please do not continue to misrepresent my position. I stand strongly behind the leadership at ALPA and have been working diligently to forge closer cooperation and coordination between APA and ALPA. To be clear, I will yield my veto power at CAPA to defeat any attempts by the DPA to make any sort of overtures to CAPA.

Sincerely,


Captain Dave Bates
President
 
Overspeed said:
Bob, Lee Seham learned from the best. Like father like son. Lee Seham was the "professional" legal counsel for AMFA during the period they lost 80% of their membership. Bob face it. The Seham law firm has done nothing but harm to labor. SWAPA, USAPA, and the APA know that and you think they are awesome. Your judgement is horrible and luckily enough smart AMTs woke up and vote yes this time. Too bad they didn't wake up and call BS when you recommended we vote down the May 2010 TA. Now we are still working through the after effects of the killer judgement of your dream team of Pike, Ruiz, Rojas, and Peterson.

The facts are there but hey, you are out for yourself Bob and those pesky overhaul members in TUL...you could give a damn about them as long as you get your geo-pay.



From: Dave Bates
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 18:05:17 -0600
To: 'DPA Mail'
Subject: RE: Introduction to the Delta Pilots Association



Mr. Caplinger,

Sorry for the delay in responding to you.

I want to be perfectly clear. In my opinion, a breakaway from ALPA would likely prove highly disadvantageous for the pilots at Delta and destructive to our profession. When APA broke away from ALPA in 1963 the labor environment for airline pilots in the United States was far different than it is today. JFK was the President at the time and had recently come out strongly in favor of organized pilots in the Southern Airways dispute of 1962. American’s pilots prospered during the benign days of regulation which ended abruptly with the onset of deregulation.

I have always thought it is better to work within the existing political framework to achieve reform than by wreaking havoc upon one’s organization. After I was hired at American, I led the battle against the two tier pay system – not by trying to tear things apart, but by working within the system. Ultimately, with patience and perseverance, we prevailed.

I view the Seham law firm as an organization which has done significant harm for a very long time to American organized labor. Over the years they have tried to raid nearly every union in the airline industry and succeeded in decertifying AFA/IBT/IAM and ALPA. Their predecessor firm, Seham, Klien & Zelman, represented management at a number of airlines and steamship companies and helped break unions at El Al and indirectly assisted Frank Lorenzo at Eastern Airlines.

Shortly after the Sehams were dismissed at APA, they began coordinating with a pro-management dissident group at American called the AICA which has been trying to destabilize and decertify APA. They are also involved on American’s property in a decertification effort with the TWU and were heavily involved with the disaster which occurred with the mechanics at Northwest.

I hope that you will carefully evaluate your present course of action. I know that institutional inertia is a difficult thing to overcome, however I think that a Delta breakaway from ALPA would further fracture and destabilize our profession and play right into the hands of management. I am working in exactly the opposite direction – trying to move pilot unions closer together. It might interest you to know that APA has recently signed a services agreement with ALPA to help APA in its efforts to negotiate a new collective bargaining agreement.

Please do not continue to misrepresent my position. I stand strongly behind the leadership at ALPA and have been working diligently to forge closer cooperation and coordination between APA and ALPA. To be clear, I will yield my veto power at CAPA to defeat any attempts by the DPA to make any sort of overtures to CAPA.

Sincerely,


Captain Dave Bates
President
Click to expand...

Overspin you say father like son. Does that mean that all apples don't fall far from the tree. Don Vs son must not fall far from the tree either B&E and possesion. WOW I wonder what he is going to teach the kid that he had with the local 565 secretary. Oh thats right he is a man of moral fiber right,while he was having bible study meetings at the 565 union hall he was also fathering a child with the local secretary. You said before that you did not father a child with the local secretary. This would be a lie if you were Don V,so I guess you are not Don V. I see that Don's buddy Van der loo is back on the boards again.
 
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