JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[WeAAsles]

WeAAZ, I, like many others, have been around through too many regime changes NOT to be skeptical. I have lived through too many "They can do that" defenses.
As for your comment about the TWU being a collection of people, if this is true, then the TWU needs to start listening to its collection of people and not simply decide what is best or worst for them.
You cannot tell any of us that in your entire tenure at AA you have never been angry or at the least disappointed at the TWU for a bad contract or letter of agreement or any decision that benefited the company.
If you haven't then I guess you are fortunate to have so much faith in them.

http://www.local591.com/index.cfm?zone=/unionactive/officers.cfm

https://twu514.org/2016-to-2019-officers-roster/

https://www.twu.org/new-twu-leadership-a-letter-from-the-iac/

http://iam141.org/contact-us/agc/

http://www.iamdl142.org/us-airways/

Metal one thing if you ever got to know me you'd find out. I have ZERO problem picking up a phone and calling someone. I have ZERO problem tracking down and getting phone numbers. I have ZERO problem asking people for their phone numbers. I even asked Doug Parker for his phone number (I'll leave you guessing if I got it or not?)

Now to answer your question. Angry or disappointed? Absolutely many times in the past and I'm sure many times in the future. Just disagreed with one of the top dog hot shots last week as a matter of fact. And if you and I had a talk I can give you a laundry list of contract items and letters that I didn't or don't agree with. But since May 1995 I'm still only one vote.

And I put up those links so you can start to call some of those "people" and ask them questions. You get to know "people" and after awhile (If you're nice to them and maybe even a little helpful) they start to tell you things. (Or maybe they start to handle you, lol)

Metal get off Social Media and start calling these "people"

 

[NYer]

NYer,

The problem I have is that you are talking about this through the TWU scope and agreement. This concerns EVERYBODY!, LUS and LAA. LUS has by far the best scope in the industry right now at 1 mainline flight a day, which includes LAA metal. You are talking about essentially gutting our scope to go up to 15 a day. That is just ridiculous. LAA should be SCREAMING to get to our scope, not just willing to accept a continuance of the 15 a day. Anything more than 1 flight a day is a concession in my eyes, and depending on where that number fell, it might just be a no vote from me.
Traymark, just curious, where do you think scope will go to? Since you are so very concerned with Fleet issues that is. Why do you think 15 flights a day is dreaming? What is LAA's MTC scope at for remaining at a station?

The one flight language is an LOA and it seems to have been agreed to in order to protect the IAM Members during the interim period between the IAM CBA ratification and the JCBA. Everyone would love to have that.

At the time, the priority was to get a CBA done in order to move into JCBA negotiations. That's another reason these negotiations may be taking longer as the IAM didn't address their issues during their last CBA negotiations, which were stalled for them as their management team was busy with the LAA unions and our MOU's.

Don't believe the one flight language was meant to be anything other than a placemat and protection from layoffs during the JCBA negotiations and transition from LUS to LAA.

 

[WeAAsles]

You can't point to any post I've made that disparages any work group. I have no problem with you posting as long as it's relevant to the thread, sometimes you stray from that and thats where it gets a bit unbearable.

As far as betting against something to happen that I wish would happen, Why on earth would I do that?
If my fears about the IAMPF come to pass and we end up with a much enhanced 401K, then my work here is done.
Peace

My OCD gets the better of me sometimes.

The thing about the IAMPF touching our AA Pension is where I want to make the bet. C'mon I'll bet my Condo against just one month of your pay? I've got a lot of equity in this thing.

Otherwise Peace to you too.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

You DO NOT speak for me or the entire collective membership. I'm more than capable of making up my own mind and decisions without your input thank you very much.

Is this guy serious?

WeAAsles, I see people say that to YOU at least once a week.

I even asked Doug Parker for his phone number (I'll leave you guessing if I got it or not?)

Taking it upon yourself to represent the membership WeAAsles? We don't need the Association we have WeAAsles on the job.

You DO NOT speak for me or the entire collective membership.

Ring any bells?

Why are you attempting to call Doug Parker?

Stop embarrassing yourself.

 

[Tim Nelson]

NYer,

The problem I have is that you are talking about this through the TWU scope and agreement. This concerns EVERYBODY!, LUS and LAA. LUS has by far the best scope in the industry right now at 1 mainline flight a day, which includes LAA metal. You are talking about essentially gutting our scope to go up to 15 a day. That is just ridiculous. LAA should be SCREAMING to get to our scope, not just willing to accept a continuance of the 15 a day. Anything more than 1 flight a day is a concession in my eyes, and depending on where that number fell, it might just be a no vote from me.
Traymark, just curious, where do you think scope will go to? Since you are so very concerned with Fleet issues that is. Why do you think 15 flights a day is dreaming? What is LAA's MTC scope at for remaining at a station?

Rarely do i agree with you but ill have to admit that your post hit the bullseye. I often wonder the same thing but the step child always seems happiest when the daddy takes the ice cream from the favorite instead of demanding the ice cream as well. Ive heard only piss and moaning from twu leaders saying how we have to get rid of our scope and health care. For who...parker? Twu?
We should picket with the twu but im goin to keep eating my ice cream cuz nobpdy has the power to take it away, id have to be an absolute moron to give it away.

 

[WeAAsles]

Is this guy serious?

WeAAsles, I see people say that to YOU at least once a week.

Taking it upon yourself to represent the membership WeAAsles? We don't need the Association we have WeAAsles on the job.

You DO NOT speak for me or the entire collective membership.

Ring any bells?

Why are you attempting to call Doug Parker?

Stop embarrassing yourself.

Hey buddy congratulations. I was very happy to hear you got back on your feet fast and Target hired you. Good for you bro.

After one year you should be able to get off the overnight shift.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

View attachment 11841




Hey buddy congratulations. I was very happy to hear you got back on your feet fast and Target hired you. Good for you bro.

After one year you should be able to get off the overnight shift.

The difference between you and I is I don't try to pass fantasy off as fact.

I don't have one standard for myself and a different standard for everyone else and I don't change those standards on a whim to suit my purposes.

Are you mad because I pointed out your hypocrisy?

I don't know how your ego is so inflated you take it upon yourself to call Doug Parker.

 

[737823]

Anything less than this should be considered unacceptable to the Association.

http://unionhall.cwalocals.org/system/files/ta_article_3_rev_10_30_15.pdf

WeAA are you really saying IF (hypothetically) you were in a class II station you'd happily work at managements behest and perform duties outside those covered in the CBA AND allow management to perform covered work?

NYer, I do wonder if we will see a similar low wage outfit to subsidize the expensive mainline cities that will be staffed mostly full time TOS. Between the new United Ground Services, Delta Global Services, Delta Ready Reserve, and a whole slew of other low cost low wage highly nimble operators the company will likely want to push one. I do not believe Envoy will exist in its current form much longer. The IAM has proven time and time again they're happy to play ball and cater to management to provide low wage flexible operations so long as they get duespayers with dues check off.

Josh

 

[WeAAsles]

The difference between you and I is I don't try to pass fantasy off as fact.

I don't have one standard for myself and a different standard for everyone else and I don't change those standards on a whim to suit my purposes.

Are you mad because I pointed out your hypocrisy?

I don't know how your ego is so inflated you take it upon yourself to call Doug Parker.

Did I say Doug Parker gave me his number? What a putz you are.

No wonder all those senior guys bumped you out never ever to return. And I hear they laugh about it every single day. Never letting you back either.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Hey buddy congratulations. I was very happy to hear you got back on your feet fast and Target hired you. Good for you bro.

After one year you should be able to get off the overnight shift.

That is another difference between you and I. I would never try to shame someone that worked an honest job.

You claim you are pro labor, for the working man, but then you show your true colors by making asinine comments.

If I did work for Target or Walmart I would not be ashamed of it.

 

[WeAAsles]

WeAA are you really saying IF (hypothetically) you were in a class II station you'd happily work at managements behest and perform duties outside those covered in the CBA AND allow management to perform covered work?

NYer, I do wonder if we will see a similar low wage outfit to subsidize the expensive mainline cities that will be staffed mostly full time TOS. Between the new United Ground Services, Delta Global Services, Delta Ready Reserve, and a whole slew of other low cost low wage highly nimble operators the company will likely want to push one. I do not believe Envoy will exist in its current form much longer. The IAM has proven time and time again they're happy to play ball and cater to management to provide low wage flexible operations so long as they get duespayers with dues check off.

Josh

That's where the language for Station Staffing is Josh, Tim, Ringo, George, Gilligan.

 

[WeAAsles]

That is another difference between you and I. I would never try to shame someone that worked an honest job.

You claim you are pro labor, for the working man, but then you show your true colors by making asinine comments.

If I did work for Target or Walmart I would not be ashamed of it.

I'm not trying to shame you at all. Didn't I say I was glad you got back on your feet. I was worried you might wind up dumpster diving for the nightly bakery throwaways.

Hey do you need some hand me down clothing bro?

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Did I say Doug Parker gave me his number?

No. YOU said you attempted to get it.

I even asked Doug Parker for his phone number (I'll leave you guessing if I got it or not?)

I am only speaking to your self proclaimed intent not your accomplishment.

The membership has a UNION they pay to represent their interest to management. They do not need a self appointed representative with an over sized ego calling Doug Parker on their behalf.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

No wonder all those senior guys bumped you out never ever to return. And I hear they laugh about it every single day. Never letting you back either.

I'm not trying to shame you at all. Didn't I say I was glad you got back on your feet. I was worried you might wind up dumpster diving for the nightly bakery throwaways.

Hey do you need some hand me down clothing bro?

You live a rich fantasy life.

 

[NYer]

NYer, I do wonder if we will see a similar low wage outfit to subsidize the expensive mainline cities that will be staffed mostly full time TOS. Between the new United Ground Services, Delta Global Services, Delta Ready Reserve, and a whole slew of other low cost low wage highly nimble operators the company will likely want to push one. I do not believe Envoy will exist in its current form much longer. The IAM has proven time and time again they're happy to play ball and cater to management to provide low wage flexible operations so long as they get duespayers with dues check off.

Josh

In the past, LAA was willing to use low-cost service providers but had been moving away from actually running such an outfit as a subsidiary. They had voiced their preference to pay for the service but have not wanted to manage the service.

The fact that other airlines use those other services and have that cost advantage in the cities where they're used only makes it much more difficult to win out the ability to keep a "one flight a day" scope language. Having the National Mediation Board present during these talks only increases the likelihood they'd tell the NC that scope language in unattainable now and especially in a Section 6 negotiations, in the event, this drags on that long.

The LAA side would love that Scope language and to inherit the medical insurance the IAM enjoys. In reading these pages, it seems many TWU members believe the IAM will not win out in the Scope or the medical and that being the case, let's get a deal.

On the other hand, I understand the LUS perspective in which they see the issue as to why should they give up something until and unless it is absolutely necessary.

If these competing perspectives were better explained by the Association, then I believe there would be a better balance of reality and patience on each side. Unfortunately, that is not happening and the subsequent JCBA will not be well received because there is little work being done to set the proper expectations of what it may contain.