JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

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WeAAsles
Let's be honest. In comparison of the two policies, the LAA insurance is crappy. This is what I was referring to. Don't really care what everybody else out there has. I care that in a time of making record profit that the largest airline in the world is offering a bankrupt insurance policy to all its members. They could do much better, but they choose not to.


Well CB I stand with you on this issue that no WE should not accept crappy insurance when YES absolutely the Company has more than the ability to offer better.

If those discussions have now begun and that's their current position, their "choice" is wrong.
 
I agree with PRez on everything except the last sentence. I think we have a really good shot at getting it done this summer. But just like Prez, that's just my opinion. On the IAM side, insurance is a huge issue. We can't expect our members to go down to the LAA insurance. Things would have to be pretty awesome in all the rest of the contract to get us to agree to that crappy insurance.

We'd assume, for the good of your Members and possible benefit to the TWU members, once you reach the medical piece of the JCBA it could very well be a methodical process.

The hope would be to have a deal done sometime in the summer but that would be contingent on cooperation by the Company. Correct?

Being that they've placed everyone else in the current LAA medical insurance it seems unlikely they'd be willing to allow one group to go a different route. So it seems there is a likelihood we could reach a stalemate in that subject?
 
SCOPE, Medical benefits, Retirement options and contributions, and Wages.
Wasn't directed to you, but now that your on the subject, ......,, how is it that I had been harping SCOPE all this time and I get so much grief, even as far as to make one of my fancy charts too, but I do get it, LUS is shaking in their boots because a lot is on the line. And yes LUS will be coming over to our ins. When we enroll next, will suffer from giving up scope, BUT if this soon to be TA is voted down, we all know the consequences, a trip to mediation witch always favors the company.



Read what NYer said^^^^^^^^^^^
 
We'd assume, for the good of your Members and possible benefit to the TWU members, once you reach the medical piece of the JCBA it could very well be a methodical process.

The hope would be to have a deal done sometime in the summer but that would be contingent on cooperation by the Company. Correct?

Being that they've placed everyone else in the current LAA medical insurance it seems unlikely they'd be willing to allow one group to go a different route. So it seems there is a likelihood we could reach a stalemate in that subject?


I guess you continue to ignore the FACT that the IAM has continually been able to hang on to their medical plans even since it was first enacted during the US Bankruptcy.

They held it on their last CBA and their was no placemat language like the Station Staffing "Until a JCBA is reached" (Or something to that effect)

Why did they NOT put in that piece of language there too?
 
Wasn't directed to you, but now that your on the subject, ......,, how is it that I had been harping SCOPE all this time and I get so much grief, even as far as to make one of my fancy charts too, but I do get it, LUS is shaking in their boots because a lot is on the line. And yes LUS will be coming over to our ins. When we enroll next, will suffer from giving up scope, BUT if this soon to be TA is voted down, we all know the consequences, a trip to mediation witch always favors the company.



Read what NYer said^^^^^^^^^^^


Many of my TWU AA peers have their opinions here on this IAM Medical issue and I seem to have mine which are apparently different.

Let's see who winds up eating the Crow on this one?
 
Update

Several articles were a paragraph, sentence, word(s) or number away from getting a T/A. The focus early on from the Executive NC has been to T/A these articles that are close before getting into the really big money issues. IMO, I expect that we will be in the big money issues soon and believe that having a T/A for the entire CBA is a slight possibility this summer.

P. Rez

Or next fall, if not by spring. Without a doubt maybe next summer.
Bull ****.

Perhaps just adding another layer

Listen I'm in no hurry, but what he says is in the process of getting done I thought was done already.

I agree with PRez on everything except the last sentence. I think we have a really good shot at getting it done this summer. But just like Prez, that's just my opinion. On the IAM side, insurance is a huge issue. We can't expect our members to go down to the LAA insurance. Things would have to be pretty awesome in all the rest of the contract to get us to agree to that crappy insurance.

And I agree with 1AA. It will not be until at least 2018 until you guys get a contract, and I am sure it will be mid to late 2018.
 
And I agree with 1AA. It will not be until at least 2018 until you guys get a contract, and I am sure it will be mid to late 2018.


Oh why don't you get your Ass back to your own freakin airline and worry about your own 5 wasted years so far you schmuck?

Sorry I was just enjoying a few pints with a bud, checked in and there you are. Schmuck.
 
Update

Several articles were a paragraph, sentence, word(s) or number away from getting a T/A. The focus early on from the Executive NC has been to T/A these articles that are close before getting into the really big money issues. IMO, I expect that we will be in the big money issues soon and believe that having a T/A for the entire CBA is a slight possibility this summer.

P. Rez
So why are you afraid to post the info of the Ta articles as members we should be informed. I'm sick and tired of no info from the ass . We have the right to know it's our contract and we should be told.
 
Wasn't directed to you, but now that your on the subject, ......,, how is it that I had been harping SCOPE all this time and I get so much grief, even as far as to make one of my fancy charts too, but I do get it, LUS is shaking in their boots because a lot is on the line. And yes LUS will be coming over to our ins. When we enroll next, will suffer from giving up scope, BUT if this soon to be TA is voted down, we all know the consequences, a trip to mediation witch always favors the company.



Read what NYer said^^^^^^^^^^^
bob,

How would we enter into mediation with the company if a TA is voted down? Neither side is in section 6 negotiations, the NMB has no authority in these JCBA talks. The mediator that is present was requested by the company, but can be asked to leave by either side at any time. She is there to offer her opinion and suggestions, that is all. The Association could have said no to JCBA talks, let each sides CBA become ammendable, and the enter section 6 talks for bothe sides seperately. These talks were voluntary on the Associations side to get a JCBA, so mediation is not even a possibility. You do understand this right? How do you make this stuff up? Are you really that ignorant? And just out of my own morbid curioaity, what SCOPE will LUS be giving up? Anything that is more flights per week than we have now is a concession, so what is your piont here exactly? As far as the insurance goes, we will see when we have a JCBA to look at and actually vote on, until then, its just rumor and speculation on everybody's part. Nobody knows for certain what we will end up with as far as that subject goes.
 
IMO, I expect that we will be in the big money issues soon and believe that having a T/A for the entire CBA is a slight possibility this summer.

P. Rez

I think we have a really good shot at getting it done this summer.


You both have to know, that timeline Sucks.

I'm still trying to figure out why it only took the Pilots and Flight Attendants 4 months to both of their contracts essentially at the same time, AND they both have since gotten really nice enhancements outside of the contract before we have our Contract, and Sito was A-ok with that too.

Every day that goes by on our current bankruptcy contract is gut punch to all of us, yet you both seem to couch it as everything is going really well.

When the company needed to take our money away, it was 24-7 negotiations (done in 56 days), now? It's whenever, couple days a month is cool, maybe end of summer, this sucks.

Just so you know, anything that puts LAA into the IAMPF is a total waste of time, no matter how much you try to dress it up, it aint flying.
 
bob,

How would we enter into mediation with the company if a TA is voted down? Neither side is in section 6 negotiations, the NMB has no authority in these JCBA talks. The mediator that is present was requested by the company, but can be asked to leave by either side at any time. She is there to offer her opinion and suggestions, that is all. The Association could have said no to JCBA talks, let each sides CBA become ammendable, and the enter section 6 talks for bothe sides seperately. These talks were voluntary on the Associations side to get a JCBA, so mediation is not even a possibility. You do understand this right? How do you make this stuff up? Are you really that ignorant? And just out of my own morbid curioaity, what SCOPE will LUS be giving up? Anything that is more flights per week than we have now is a concession, so what is your piont here exactly? As far as the insurance goes, we will see when we have a JCBA to look at and actually vote on, until then, its just rumor and speculation on everybody's part. Nobody knows for certain what we will end up with as far as that subject goes.

We can take several educated guesses by knowing what's happening in other airlines and the fact our begitiations needed a Mediator to break the deadlocks.

The probability is high that we will have a JCBA to vote on that will include a change in Scope, especially the current IAM flight threshold. It will also include a change in the IAM medical as the rest of the airline and most of the industry moved into a higher employee contribution model.

The fact there is a Mediator means the talks will be going in a direction the negotiators wouldn't naturally agree to go to. The positions the Company will take and the counter position by the Association would dictate a longer trajectory into these negotiations.

There is a rumor that this will be done by July, when that doesn't happen there will be many upset members. If the process was better understood and explained by the Association, then the anxiety level wouldn't be as high as it is now.
 
You both have to know, that timeline Sucks.

I'm still trying to figure out why it only took the Pilots and Flight Attendants 4 months to both of their contracts essentially at the same time, AND they both have since gotten really nice enhancements outside of the contract before we have our Contract.

The APA and APFA, had agreements with the Company to expedite their JCBA negotiations. I believe they set a 150 day timeline. They also agreed if they didn't get a deal within that window, they would settle their differences in an arbitration. That would be devastating for us.

Yes, they received nice enhancements but so did we and although it is great to have, it probably also contributed to a slow down in the current talks.
 
We can take several educated guesses by knowing what's happening in other airlines and the fact our begitiations needed a Mediator to break the deadlocks.

The probability is high that we will have a JCBA to vote on that will include a change in Scope, especially the current IAM flight threshold. It will also include a change in the IAM medical as the rest of the airline and most of the industry moved into a higher employee contribution model.

The fact there is a Mediator means the talks will be going in a direction the negotiators wouldn't naturally agree to go to. The positions the Company will take and the counter position by the Association would dictate a longer trajectory into these negotiations.

There is a rumor that this will be done by July, when that doesn't happen there will be many upset members. If the process was better understood and explained by the Association, then the anxiety level wouldn't be as high as it is now.
There are a few things that have showed signs of shifting within the industry regarding medical insurance. The 40% excise tax was the main culprit of what caused the other unions to have to give up their medical. It was a cultural thing where the company simply wasn't wanting to absorb millions of dollars from a 2020 excise tax. And it isn't going to absorb that with ours since our contract has a letter that allows the company that space. What has changed, and I think it is significant in this context, is that it's likely that Obamacare will morph or change prior to 2020. What we have seen from Uncle Donnie is that he appears to be very unwilling to tax companies. With Trumpcare, he rolled back the 40% excise tax, as introduced in the House. Not sure what version of the Trumpcare will pass, but the company can't keep stomping its feet about the excise tax because, now, it isn't necessarily immanent. Leverage to the union. And there is nothing wrong with a cultural event shifting a health care paradigm for union people and for us being positioned in a timely way because negotiations have been delayed. Other unions will follow the pattern in the next round of their negotiations. It makes no sense for us to follow the pattern set by the excise tax when the excise tax isn't necessarily immanent. Cultural events shift negotiations. Happens a lot. Not just 911 but federal laws. In this case, a delay in negotiations seems to have benefited all of us. I mean, I would think that the LAA health insurance will be tweaked better as opposed to LUS being tossed into your current cost version. And I base that on the possible elimination of the excise tax. I think that is reasonable. What would be unfounded is if LUS gave up health insurance cost when the excise tax isn't immanent. To say that all other unions and all other groups took on more cost, so we do to, is also unfounded, since that great shift was due almost exclusively to the excise tax. Unions negotiated ahead of it and they did so with less leverage, due to the 2020 drop dead date. That's my opinion on the matter and I hope AGC's stand up against any action by Sito which TA's more cost for us on health care. Our AGC's are personally responsible for this. And we also need some TWU southwest protections on that power stow. I got a bad feeling about that belt loader. It's great and saves backs and knees but after a JCBA all hell may break loose on jobs. In ORD, the company told our TWU here that it didn't believe more than 1 person was needed in the bin with the power stow [according to TWU local update]. I was disappointed in the union's response. It compromised already and said that it agreed with the company that only one person was needed if the person could be clearly seen (in front of the bin I guess). That's a slippery slope it just yielded to. I work with the power stow and things get caught in that belt and there should always be manning to make sure 2 persons are allowed in the bin.
 
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