JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[bob@las-AA]

I suspect the IAMNPP will be a choice for those of us on the property but it may be the default plan for any new hires.

Forcing people into that Plan will only increase the likelihood of a "no" vote and they will need to stay away from issues that would cause large numbers to vote against ratification.

Agreed

 

[robbedagain]

NYer if its what you suspect do u think LUS folks would get a choice w that or the 401K That would be interesting to see if it plays out as you suspect

 

[bob@las-AA]

NYer if its what you suspect do u think LUS folks would get a choice w that or the 401K That would be interesting to see if it plays out as you suspect

How I think is will play out is that all currently enrolled LUS will stay with the IAMPF, and LAA will stay with the 401k, then a true-up for the LUS side to equal our 401 match. Any subsequent future new hires will have to decide between the two after a JCBA.

 

[NYer]

NYer if its what you suspect do u think LUS folks would get a choice w that or the 401K That would be interesting to see if it plays out as you suspect

I would suppose so, but I don't forsee too many opting out.

 

[robbedagain]

NYer I don't see very many opting out either but would they offer an option for the LUS to do a match 401K rather than the IAMPF?

Bob I can see it being played out the way you wrote it it does make sense but if those LUS wanted a 401K with match would there be an option for those LUS to switch out of IAMPF to go to 401K

Regardless itll be interesting to see what happens

 

[bob@las-AA]

NYer I don't see very many opting out either but would they offer an option for the LUS to do a match 401K rather than the IAMPF?

Bob I can see it being played out the way you wrote it it does make sense but if those LUS wanted a 401K with match would there be an option for those LUS to switch out of IAMPF to go to 401K

Regardless itll be interesting to see what happens

I think you might have had a light-bulb moment, that would be up to your union, and truthfully, in order to keep that pension money flowing, the IAM might not offer its members that option. The answers to your question is hard to speculate on, and I don't know how to even approach it.

 

[bob@las-AA]

NYer I don't see very many opting out either but would they offer an option for the LUS to do a match 401K rather than the IAMPF?

Bob I can see it being played out the way you wrote it it does make sense but if those LUS wanted a 401K with match would there be an option for those LUS to switch out of IAMPF to go to 401K

Regardless itll be interesting to see what happens

It will be more than interesting, our futures and livelihood hinges on a "YES" or "NO"

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Why does it sound scripted?

Because.... it sounds scripted. How am I supposed to answer that?

I know people don't look at that but I said they "should"

Why? When I applied to American Airlines I had no knowledge of the average pay of a baggage handler. My only consideration is what can THIS job offer ME? What are the prospects of THIS job. I can tell you a 9 year plus top out is a deterrent to a prospective employee when they can do something else that pays just as well and far sooner. At the risk of repeating myself I surpassed what I made at American Airlines in less than 3 years.

All I have to show for 12 years at American Airlines is loss of mobility in my neck and shoulder problems. I suppose I have a small pension as well (maybe)

A Baggage Handlers (average) yearly salary according to BLS (don't think I am publishing something AA isn't fully aware of) is $24,000 per year. Now if a person chose to "live" his daily expenses within that guidance he would have almost $40,000 a year in wiggle room. (Tough though to live comfortably on $24,000 IMO)

That is because the TWU has turned an entry level non skilled job into a career. Not trying to be rude or confrontational but, that is the truth.

People get pissed though because they always want to live up to and beyond their means and that's how they dig their own holes.

I agree.

The problem with working as a FSC is nothing you do is marketable outside of the Airline industry. If you should happen to get displaced good luck finding anything matching the pay and benefits with no education and no marketable skill. It is a trap you see, for those previously mentioned that live up to and beyond their means.

In my opinion the best thing to do as a FSC is use the money you make to go to school for something that pays well and is in demand. A job where one can procure employment where they want (as opposed to what their seniority can hold) and an ability to earn like pay from a variety of employers instead of being tied to one because of a seniority based and prohibitive payscale.

Let me ask you something WeAAsles. If your job were to disappear tomorrow what would you do? How would you make a living?

I mean going to another airline is not really an option because they would start you at the bottom of the pay scale. You would not make enough to live on starting over at another airline (at least not for a while).

What would you do?

 

[john john]

From the website Al.

What is a Multiemployer Benefit Trust Fund?
Unlike benefit programs that are sponsored and controlled by one employer for their own employees, a multiemployer benefit trust fund is a health fund that is created solely for the benefit of collectively bargained employees working for many employers. The fund is maintained pursuant to a trust agreement and one or more collective bargaining agreements. Employers negotiate the fund into the applicable collective bargaining agreement and agree to contribute to the fund at certain specified rates for the benefit plans that are negotiated (medical, dental, vision, etc.).

Multiemployer benefit trust funds are typically sponsored and administered by joint boards of both labor and management trustees representing participants from many organizations, usually within the same or related industries, and a labor union. These funds are often referred to as "Taft-Hartley funds."

The Taft-Hartley name refers to the Taft-Hartley Act of 1947, also known as the Labor-Management Relations Act. The Act was passed by Congress to regulate organized labor practices and define standards for union pension and benefit funds. Taft-Hartley funds are often the only way a small employer can provide comprehensive health coverage to their employees in a cost effective manner, since such funds create cost-savings due to centralized administration and pooling of resources.

Because multiple employers contribute to the fund for their employees, the costs are shared and the risks are pooled. As a result, multiemployer plans can provide a competitive benefit for the same or better rate when compared to a single employer health plan. And since multiple employers participate in the same fund, employees can move among participating employers without losing coverage, although their benefit plans may differ based on each employer's collective bargaining agreement.

The Teamsters TeamCare healthcare plan provides insurance to close to 500,000 people and has 21.5 months of funding in reserve. Multiemployer benefit Plan has always been a heavy negotiated item for UPS Teamsters.

This type of healthcare plan was supposed to be negotiated by IBT/CWA and promise for the CWA/IBT agents. but he left the building

 

[john john]

It's actually just scope. Our healthcare could be better, throw out the iam's plan for now, the company plan for all us is fine. .

And this why LUS will lose their premium hot property healthcare

To many LAA

 

[NYer]

NYer if its what you suspect do u think LUS folks would get a choice w that or the 401K That would be interesting to see if it plays out as you suspect

I suspect they would. It wouldn't be much of a gamble for the IAM as few would defect.

And to be clear, when I mention an option it's meant as a one-time choice at the point of the JCBA ratification and initial implementation. Can't see it being an open-ended option.

 

[NYer]

It will be more than interesting, our futures and livelihood hinges on a "YES" or "NO"

Doesn't it always.

 

[robbedagain]

thanks for explanation its definitely a well worth topic of discussion itll all be interesting

 

[WeAAsles]

Because.... it sounds scripted. How am I supposed to answer that?

Why? When I applied to American Airlines I had no knowledge of the average pay of a baggage handler. My only consideration is what can THIS job offer ME? What are the prospects of THIS job. I can tell you a 9 year plus top out is a deterrent to a prospective employee when they can do something else that pays just as well and far sooner. At the risk of repeating myself I surpassed what I made at American Airlines in less than 3 years.

All I have to show for 12 years at American Airlines is loss of mobility in my neck and shoulder problems. I suppose I have a small pension as well (maybe)

That is because the TWU has turned an entry level non skilled job into a career. Not trying to be rude or confrontational but, that is the truth.

I agree.

The problem with working as a FSC is nothing you do is marketable outside of the Airline industry. If you should happen to get displaced good luck finding anything matching the pay and benefits with no education and no marketable skill. It is a trap you see, for those previously mentioned that live up to and beyond their means.

In my opinion the best thing to do as a FSC is use the money you make to go to school for something that pays well and is in demand. A job where one can procure employment where they want (as opposed to what their seniority can hold) and an ability to earn like pay from a variety of employers instead of being tied to one because of a seniority based and prohibitive payscale.

Let me ask you something WeAAsles. If your job were to disappear tomorrow what would you do? How would you make a living?

I mean going to another airline is not really an option because they would start you at the bottom of the pay scale. You would not make enough to live on starting over at another airline (at least not for a while).

What would you do?

You and I have discussed this before many times if you remember. Sure I can agree 100% that going to school to gain a marketable trade is a smart move but not everyone "will" do that or "wants" to do that. And if you think about it what would happen if every low skilled, well paid worker actually did what you suggested? The market for many jobs would become oversaturated in time and natural supply and demand would bring down the wages in those fields. Ironic that you would eventually run into a situation where the unskilled trades would have to compensate more to prevent costly turnover. Even Parker himself said in the first MIA roadshow to an older gentleman that we pay you more and should for your experience.

There are a lot of unskilled professions where they're on the job learned. Factories, warehouses, oil fields, security, doormen, elevator operators, Police and Firemen just to name a few off the top of my head. All of those jobs are honorable learned trades. What would happen do you think if all of those jobs were entry level jobs that you should abandon over time? Should Flight Attendants all move on at say 25?

And I'm not being rude either but I don't think you have much respect for my chosen (stuck, whatever) career? It really is no different than any of those other jobs I mentioned or the job of a guy who lays down tar roads or picks up garbage in a big city. Actually Union wages and contracts probably aren't a bad thing for society. They keep the experience in the job not trap them (Unless they hate the job so much) and it winds up keeping the now skilled in the trades which makes it cheaper for you through their better productivity.

And what would I do? I'd survive and take advantage of whatever opportunity I could if the job simply evaporated into thin air. I admittedly wouldn't be as comfortable I'm sure to start but "I'M" also not trapped by the absolute lure of seeking more and more money and living beyond my means. Money is where I see the REAL trap.

This article is from 2013 but it still has relevancy today especially if oil prices remain stable between $50 and $60 a barrel. Many non skilled jobs.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aol.com/amp/2013/04/25/boomtown-oil-jobs/

 

[WeAAsles]

It will be more than interesting, our futures and livelihood hinges on a "YES" or "NO"

I wouldn't say the livelihood does Bob because if we did vote no they just go back in and start from square one or try to modify whatever was the issue we had the problem with if possible.

But we'll all still go to work the next day as usual.