JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[WeAAsles]

Where have you been man? Don't you realize yet that this cluster f*#k merger was all to make sure the 25%ers dreams came true? Huge raises, 1 flt a day scope, almost free insurance, prbly free massages between flts, and whatever else their minds can conjure up. But they'll throw your cs's, CC rules and OT language down the drain in 5 minutes. Wake up man it's all about them. Maybe they'll afford us a McDonald's gift card when it's all said and done and W will get his gig. Smh still till 2021!

Dude with the CS let’s just use a tiny drop of common sense on it instead of trying to land our Rocket Ship on Venus.

CS on the TWU side was never a contractual item. Apparently no morons in the past ever had the foresight to make it an issue worth fighting for to get it into our contract. Probably so many different locations had so many scams and setups running with it that they just didn’t want to take the chance of F’ing that up? Again shortsighted morons.

So now we don’t have it in the contract and both IAM and CWA do and it’s a uniform program in Workbrain. How did you expect our guys to win a fight for it to be more lax from what it is currently for thousands of upstairs and downstairs people?

You just read also a former TWU Negotiator tell you in the BK that Management wanted to weaken it even further than it has been since I hired on. That’s all I’ve ever seen with our CS (Policy) in my career. Chop, chop, chop.

BTW you didn’t do your training = CS Restricted
You didn’t report to lost time in a timely manner = CS Restricted
You didn’t kiss the right ass = CS Restricted
What’s next?

F that!!!! Get it in the contract and lock it up.

 

[WeAAsles]

- thanks. no patronizing here, but, like i said...you keep everyone on their toes. keep posting contractual facts, along with opinions and musings. always good stuff.

- no need to stand down for this issue. if you think it's lame or those at LAA with 2 seniorities are out of line comparing the seniority end result to LUS at the 'new AA'..so be it. if you're friends with mayes and looking to defend the seniority status quo, like i said; i understand completely.

i felt it very unfair. truth be told, there are a few dozen angry FSCs that constantly harp on this. i would not consider myself one of them. i let it go. i like to use sarcasm and cynicism to make my point(s), unfortunately, most people hate other peoples' sarcasm and cynicism.

keep posting.

I talk to a lot of people Crema. I met Mayes once, occasionally talk to him on the phone. Send him a goofball text off of here now and then. Talk to others in the TWU occasionally (Gotten a few shirts) Talk to CB and Rez occasionally and even a few other IAM guys (They’re giving me a lead organizer job at 300k per year, LMAO) Hell I’ve even talked to that maniac Tim a few times.

To many here on Forums it seems to be a crime to get to know people and hear and listen to other points of views?

And with me it’s not about any issue being lame. It’s about winning the argument, debate or point of view. And sometimes it’s against Legal language that there is no winning on. Especially when it’s a Legal issue I just don’t get the point on wasting time in arguing those things. Most times they just are what they are.

 

[charlie Brown]

a question for charlie brown:

in regards to the seniority issue, those at LAA that use their company time to bid VC...will they lose this?

what will be the criteria for bidding VC when the 2 seniorities are fully combined? will a twu member once again stand behind the psa or piedmont guy?

The vacation article, while almost, is not completely done. The seniority is complete. But what date you use for the bidding of vacation is still subject to change since it’s not complete. Sorry, I know that’s a frustrating answer.

 

[charlie Brown]

That I actually believe. You proven it over and over again...sad

I don’t think I even know you, or you know me. So can’t do much if you choose to believe or not, or draw conclusions. Anyway,
Happy New Year to ya.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

The vacation article, while almost, is not completely done. The seniority is complete. But what date you use for the bidding of vacation is still subject to change since it’s not complete. Sorry, I know that’s a frustrating answer.

i understand, it's not settled yet.

my advice to you is to deal with this issue with a particular twu guy. i know that you are keen on protecting your LUS membership's seniority...i see a friendly FDR-Churchill seniority VC agreement very soon.

 

[WeAAsles]

Oh and readers when the Conversation or Debate begins to get redundant or even badgering yes I start to mock people or try to ignore them.

There’s a point where you’re not going to convince me or you haven’t proven your argument or you’re being emotionally speculative where my mind for interacting with you just shuts down and I just have to make fun of you because I really want you to STFU now.

I was diagnosed a long time ago with extreme Sarcasmitis. There isn’t a cure.

 

[NYer]

when the contract conversation gets off-topic, that is irritating.

i imagine you and others are talking about weaasles. when i first started posting, i posted about the LAA X LUS seniority issue that has gone away. weaasles, even as a LAA poster, wasn't impressed. a non-issue for him and as it turns out, a devotee of twu big-shooter, mike mayes.

i've been told that the twu seniority issue is mayes' baby, as in - it's done, don't ***** and moan about it, while someone like charlie brown proudly stated that his mission is to protect his membership's LUS seniority.

good for charlie brown and LUS, i have no comment on the TWU allowing a former psa propeller cleaner or piedmont lav guy cementing seniority in the tree roots of the 'new AA', while fuelers who wore AA patches and paid dues to the TWU...stand in a seniority line behind them - apparently, they have no roots at all in 'AA'.

so, i understand why weaasles tried to get me to see the error of my ways, but, it's only business. nothing personal.

all in all, i think weaasles is good for the forum, he'll keep you on your toes. if you believe he's out of line, then show him the error of his ways.

Conversations and debates are always welcomed. Unfortunately some seem to believe a debate entails ridiculing others, calling them names, disparaging their perceived intellectual placement. None of that is beneficial or goes towards the purpose of debate which is to try and understand different points of view.

Unfortunately, these pages are dwindling in substantive conversations, it went from the New York Times to Mad magazine.

 

[WeAAsles]

The vacation article, while almost, is not completely done. The seniority is complete. But what date you use for the bidding of vacation is still subject to change since it’s not complete. Sorry, I know that’s a frustrating answer.

Speculate:

Can vacation bidding remain status quo depending on the Union Represented Station that an Association Member works in or transfers to?

If that issue hasn’t been resolved wouldn’t that create the least amount of controversy?

 

[charlie Brown]

Speculate:

Can vacation bidding remain status quo depending on the Union Represented Station that an Association Member works in or transfers to?

If that issue hasn’t been resolved wouldn’t that create the least amount of controversy?

No. Vacation will be set for everyone the same through the whole system. What date we will use to bid with is still not final.

 

[swamt]

PT language is not finalized yet. And that’s all ill say on that. Remember part of what I said about TIm fishing. He post those issues only to bait people that know what’s going on to say he is wrong.
And Swamt I cant answer your question on when this will be done. I know this month is going to be very intense on scope. And I do know that once scope is done, you will see all the remaining issues wrapped up pretty quickly. There is also much talk going to be done this coming week even though we aren’t in negotiations until the following week. If the company wants to get this done as they stated last time we met, It could get done in the early parts of this coming year. Or it could all fall apart because of scope. While Im only one member of the team. I will be against bringing out any agreement that gives up the LUS insurance for our members, or gives up any jobs. Our members made it very clear to Sito at our committee conference how important our insurance and scope is to our members. I think that was a very important meeting, for Sito to hear the voices across the whole system. And I’m glad to say he stayed as long as it took for all questions and comments were done. And I know our committee people left there feeling confident. So it’s up to the company how soon this gets done. All I can say, is it’s going to get hot and heavy these next few weeks.

Ok. Thx for answering. I wish you and the other nego's much luck in the up coming nego's. Our scope discussions were very heated as well, so I do know what you mean. I fully support your efforts in saving the LUS insurance and the scope. You have told me in the past that you are against any lost of the LUS insurance and I really do applaud that stance I just hope all nego's can get on that same page.

 

[WeAAsles]

Conversations and debates are always welcomed. Unfortunately some seem to believe a debate entails ridiculing others, calling them names, disparaging their perceived intellectual placement. None of that is beneficial or goes towards the purpose of debate which is to try and understand different points of view.

Unfortunately, these pages are dwindling in substantive conversations, it went from the New York Times to Mad magazine.

You’re correct. And I guess your consistent OCD badgering had nothing to do with contributing to that?

Annoying and badgering people is not a redeeming quality.

But I really don’t think you’re able to control yourself. Dead serious.

 

[WeAAsles]

No. Vacation will be set for everyone the same through the whole system. What date we will use to bid with is still not final.

Well if it goes to occupational over Company I’m just going to keep my head down and stay out of the line of fire.

Coin flip?

 

[swamt]

And thanks!
HAPPY NEW YEAR to all of you.
Let’s look forward to 2018 being a great year for all of us with a leading industry contract.

And the same to you CB. Do the best you can and we will all have a great new year. I wish you very good luck to get an ILC for your members and all groups within the contract in 2018.

 

[swamt]

Also keep in mind. The language and flight activity for the staffing of stations, is only one issue in the scope article. Many important issues make up the scope article. Also remember protecting our jobs isn’t necessarily protecting our work. Protecting our work, is how we want to protect our jobs.

CB, this, I believe is where the education is gonna have to get clarified big time. There is way more involved with scope than just jobs or positions. Scope goes much deeper than that. Most rules affect jobs, positions as well as head counts more than just the number of each at hand.
Your also right about getting back what was lost in scope during the two BK's at LUS and the threat of and the actual BK at LAA.

I've if the biggest issues that will change with the CS's/Swaps being migrated into contractual language is the ability to make up your CS'd off hours in order to maintain your minimum hours.

As it stands, in LAA, we can CSO as much as we want as long as you maintain 50% of your scheduled hours. We have a certain slice of Members that work most of their hours in small windows. They do it because of another job, school, or they have a life event that keeps them away for long stretches. (Hurricane Maria in SJU is an example)

During the BK, the airline wanted to make our current 50% threshold into an 80% threshold.

If it wasn't for the JCBA negotiations, I wouldn't be surprised if the CS Policy wouldn't have been changed by now and reflect more of what we'll end up with rather than what we currently have.

NYer, are you saying or maybe thinking that this is what the company is wanting to go to in the new JCBA? Are you thinking they want to get it put at 80% instead of the 50%?? That would be a big QOL issue, is it not???

 

[Kev3188]

Well if it goes to occupational over Company I’m just going to keep my head down and stay out of the line of fire.

Coin flip?

Why would it be anything other than DOH? What do you guys currently use?