JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[WeAAsles]

********As a matter of fact, the Association put out a message that the only official message on negotiations would come from them and that creates a contradictory point********.

 

[charlie Brown]

Good for your Members, but why hasn't the Association done this systemwide and in that way create a consistent message. As it stands, and no offense to you, we seem to just get individual opinion. You and PRez in this forum, then we sometimes get a different perspective from a TWU Local President

As a matter of fact, the Association put out a message that the only official message on negotiations would come from them and that creates a contradictory point.

Doesn’t create a contradictory point unless you want to make it one. If someone from the negotiating team would come to your station and explain things and answer questions, the info given out is obviously going to be relative to the questions being asked. Of course it would be different from the official association briefing. But what does that matter as long as it’s legit info and questions are being answered. And I can tell you that as far as I know, most of the IAM stations of the association has been and are being briefed as things go. But we are only half of the association. I don’t even mind going to a twu station to brief, but if a twu negotiating member for some reason or another hasn’t briefed that station, I can’t or shouldn’t be stepping on his toes. Again could be the different structures in the unions. Most of the IAM guys at the table have numerous cities we are over. Not just the city we come from. For instance, I’m from Clt, but besides Clt I’m also responsible for DC, Dfw,( ramp, Tower and load control) and mci. We have multiple stations that it is our job to get to. This is how most of our stations are briefed about the issues. So the IAM side of the association does know that most of our stations are getting briefed as this process goes.

 

[NYer]

Doesn’t create a contradictory point unless you want to make it one. If someone from the negotiating team would come to your station and explain things and answer questions, the info given out is obviously going to be relative to the questions being asked. Of course it would be different from the official association briefing. But what does that matter as long as it’s legit info and questions are being answered. And I can tell you that as far as I know, most of the IAM stations of the association has been and are being briefed as things go. But we are only half of the association. I don’t even mind going to a twu station to brief, but if a twu negotiating member for some reason or another hasn’t briefed that station, I can’t or shouldn’t be stepping on his toes. Again could be the different structures in the unions. Most of the IAM guys at the table have numerous cities we are over. Not just the city we come from. For instance, I’m from Clt, but besides Clt I’m also responsible for DC, Dfw,( ramp, Tower and load control) and mci. We have multiple stations that it is our job to get to. This is how most of our stations are briefed about the issues. So the IAM side of the association does know that most of our stations are getting briefed as this process goes.

We'll see how it ends up, but there are concerns and frustrations on the the lack of substantive information. Hopefully it doesn't become a deciding factor when it's time to vote.

 

[charlie Brown]

We'll see how it ends up, but there are concerns and frustrations on the the lack of substantive information. Hopefully it doesn't become a deciding factor when it's time to vote.

Look, I agree when your not getting info, that’s very frustrating. I guess I would have to ask you, when you get info, do you share it with your members in MIA since there doesn’t seem to be anyone coming down there. Or is it so frustrating, you just say, why should you do all the work? However if you do share and get out the info, your welcome to call me anytime, and I’ll answer as much and as many questions as you may have, so you can have the info to share. PM me if you want, and I’ll send you my cell number. Or if you want to get it from your favorite friend WeAAsles he has it. But I agree, not getting any info is very frustrating. That’s why I try to get as much out as I can, and tell people to call whenever they want. But I would assume you in your position would be pretty educated on the differences of contracts.

 

[NYer]

Look, I agree when your not getting info, that’s very frustrating. I guess I would have to ask you, when you get info, do you share it with your members in MIA since there doesn’t seem to be anyone coming down there. Or is it so frustrating, you just say, why should you do all the work? However if you do share and get out the info, your welcome to call me anytime, and I’ll answer as much and as many questions as you may have, so you can have the info to share. PM me if you want, and I’ll send you my cell number. Or if you want to get it from your favorite friend WeAAsles he has it. But I agree, not getting any info is very frustrating. That’s why I try to get as much out as I can, and tell people to call whenever they want. But I would assume you in your position would be pretty educated on the differences of contracts.

Most of the info we can get has to do with generalities and we've shared the differences in each CBA as each topic arises. Tried to share the perspective of the IAM and the challenges you'll face with the Medical and Scope. We've tried to share the differences in the CS's and OT language between the CBA's, plus some of the nuances in the difference in cultures that may make those differences attractive to each side. We've shared how this process takes time to go through the CBA's and agree to new language between three parties. In short, we've tried to bring a realistic picture of the process and why its taken the time its taken.

However, and as you know because of the protests, that information is taking a back seat to the rhetoric of the Company stalling and breaching their promise. Those stories have raised the frustration levels and it doesn't seem the message is getting through. It feels as if the expectations aren't being tempered to expect the inevitable changes that are coming.

That's why we have concerns of the information being accepted once it's released and there not being enough time to reset the expectation. It seems the IAM is facing a different reality.

Let's hope for the best and thanks for the offer of reaching out to you.

 

[charlie Brown]

Most of the info we can get has to do with generalities and we've shared the differences in each CBA as each topic arises. Tried to share the perspective of the IAM and the challenges you'll face with the Medical and Scope. We've tried to share the differences in the CS's and OT language between the CBA's, plus some of the nuances in the difference in cultures that may make those differences attractive to each side. We've shared how this process takes time to go through the CBA's and agree to new language between three parties. In short, we've tried to bring a realistic picture of the process and why its taken the time its taken.

However, and as you know because of the protests, that information is taking a back seat to the rhetoric of the Company stalling and breaching their promise. Those stories have raised the frustration levels and it doesn't seem the message is getting through. It feels as if the expectations aren't being tempered to expect the inevitable changes that are coming.

That's why we have concerns of the information being accepted once it's released and there not being enough time to reset the expectation. It seems the IAM is facing a different reality.

Let's hope for the best and thanks for the offer of reaching out to you.

Your welcome. And I do understand the frustrations and concerns. And again, if I can help with the Info, in any way, let me know.

 

[WeAAsles]

Your welcome. And I do understand the frustrations and concerns. And again, if I can help with the Info, in any way, let me know.

Very nice of you to offer again but no way in hell is that happening.

 

[AANOTOK]

Mind boggling, mind boggling mind boggling mind boggling!

 

[swamt]

Mind boggling, mind boggling mind boggling mind boggling!

That's exactly where they want you, the membership.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Good track.



None here, either. Let’s keep it that way!



AA uses Type II?

i don't think so, types 1 and 4, maybe?

 

[CremaDiLimone]

I have had a few people in Dfw and DC( those are 2 of my stations) from the twu side tell me how important the cs policy is, and it’s a no vote if it changes.

it's usually the scammers trying to ingratiate themselves to higher-ups in management and the union. subconsciously, they know they may need both one day.

some fsc is looking to get chummy with you to figure out if he can work 3 CSs a week for a P/Ter with his favorite crew chief...oops, lead? this is a deal-breaker? not for me and many others i know who will vote.

bring back money and other compensation, scope/no outsourcing and it's a winner.

 

[gulfcoast1]

Look, I agree when your not getting info, that’s very frustrating. I guess I would have to ask you, when you get info, do you share it with your members in MIA since there doesn’t seem to be anyone coming down there. Or is it so frustrating, you just say, why should you do all the work? However if you do share and get out the info, your welcome to call me anytime, and I’ll answer as much and as many questions as you may have, so you can have the info to share. PM me if you want, and I’ll send you my cell number. Or if you want to get it from your favorite friend WeAAsles he has it. But I agree, not getting any info is very frustrating. That’s why I try to get as much out as I can, and tell people to call whenever they want. But I would assume you in your position would be pretty educated on the differences of contracts.

In my TWU Station there is very little if any general information being given out about the T/A's and no specific information at all. It is my understanding that this is the same in all TWU stations. If I am incorrect, please let me know, but there is almost no information being given out at all. We are under the impression at my station that information cannot be released until all articles have T/A's.

Yes it would be good to have more (any) information. None of the TWU negotiators post on here to my knowledge. Charlie Brown please let the TWU negotiators know that most of us would like some (any) information.

Thank you.

 

[pjirish317]

I don’t anticipate seeing something like that but it would be interesting.

We already know that we have at least 400Mil in improvements standing by out there for us since Parker said it at a recent Roadshow.

The improvements coming within the JCBA’s will far outweigh any “perceived” items lost due to harmonizing language from each other’s contracts.

And Kev trying to head this off at the pass the reason I said “perceived” items lost is because if economically as part of an overall CBA I went up in wages by $1000.00 per month but something else wound up costing me $200.00, I still come out with a net gain of $800.00 per month. (I can’t stand the ridiculous arguments this item tends to draw out)

Weez,

ANY increase to the insurance cost is a LOSS to the LUS folks. It doesn't matter that everybody, that includes LAA, received a raise last August or not. If we are forced into the crappy medical that AA wants us in, it is a $550 a month loss for me. Where as if we keep the LUS medical it is a $550 gain for LAA folks that have family coverage on the LUS 80% plan. Yes in August of 2016, everybody received a raise that equated to roughly $480 a paycheck. Those at LAA got the same raise. With the LAA medical, that raise is gone. My cost would be roughly with ALL insurances, dental and vision included, close to $400 a check. So after taxes, maybe I get around $35-$40 from that raise. Suddenly that raise isn't a raise at all now is it. While those of you at LAA that already had the higher cost health care enjoy ALL of that raise. Do you see the difference now? Why wouldn't anybody at LAA want an extra $550 a month? I'll say it again, most LAA have Stockholm Symdrome when it comes to the medical issue. I know you are not advocating for or even suggesting that the LUS folks be forced into the higher cost medical. I am just trying to point out that with that raise if all of Fleet Service are forced into the higher medical in a JCBA, that raise was a smoke screen.

 

[Traymark]

If we are forced into the crappy medical that AA wants us in, it is a $550 a month loss for me. Where as if we keep the LUS medical it is a $550 gain for LAA folks that have family coverage on the LUS 80% plan. Yes in August of 2016, everybody received a raise that equated to roughly $480 a paycheck. Those at LAA got the same raise.

Again with the mischaracterization.
AA's medical is far from crappy.
When I compare the AA medical to other friends of mine that work for Fortune 500 companies, our medical is good, better than most.

LUS medical is not a $550 gain for me. The difference, as I've pointed out many times before , is less than a dollar a day as a single parent.
You're going to have to come to realize everyone is not married with kids, in fact , there may actually be a majority without a spouse and kids that are still eligible for medical coverage, given the demographic of the work group, but you keep spouting how it will affect one demographic of the workgroup as if it is all of us, it is not.

I noticed you made no mention of how the Holidays , Holiday pay, overtime, sick time, vacation is not equal as you pointed out how everyone got the same raise. The benefits are not equal.
So lets talk about how LAA will be made whole for the loss of revenue they've had in those areas I just mentioned, or will going to LAA medical be called a wash because you will then take a $550 a month cut, others, many others, will take much less of cut, at the end of the day, we will then, finally, all be on equal footing on every level, we currently are not.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

Equity and two billion dollars into your frozen pension, seems you always forget that.

It’s not our fault we were in bankruptcy last in 2005 and have had a JCBA in 2008 and a Section 6 CBA in 2014 (Which our talks were put on hold by our management, so they could negotiate with all the AA unions, which you all didn’t work for US and Parker).

We were in bankruptcy twice in two years and took three rounds of concessions and we received no equity or anything for our losses and our pensions were terminated.

You filed bankruptcy in 2012, not our fault for those of us at LUS.

So still throwing stones at us because we earned gains over the past two post bankruptcy contracts.

You at LAA have your first bite of the apple since your bankruptcy.

Throw the blame on management, not us.

Glad to see that you are an IGM person Traymark and only worry about yourself and no one else.

I support you should get equal holidays and overtime. But you need to talk to Doug and stop blaming us in the IAM at LUS.

But yet you don’t support us keeping our insurance, which is crappy compared to what we have.

Remember it’s a two way street.