Jane Allen goes to UAL!

[Senor Pelon]

How many millions of $$ did she take?

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

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On 5/29/2003 3:43:19 PM AAObserver wrote:

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On 5/29/2003 1:25:06 PM eolesen wrote:

This is the second VP to leave AMR for UAL in the past three weeks.

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That''s what happens to executives when there are no retention bonuses in place.

Not having the bonuses also pretty much guarantees that AA will not be able to hire any top notch executives anytime soon.

That''s what the unions wanted though.

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AA does''nt have to worry about hiring any top notch exec''s, anytime soon.
Why,

BECAUSE THEY HAVE,

JIM LITTLE
JOHN WARD
and
JOHN DARRAH.

(Like the song goes)
"Who could ask for anything more, who could ask for anything more" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

GOD help us.

NH/BB''s

 

[buzzkill]

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On 5/29/2003 6:05:13 PM FA Mikey wrote:

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On 5/29/2003 4:00:52 PM buzzkill wrote:


I don''t believe Jane Allen received a retention bonus.


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No Executive did. But she was on the list of 45 to get just that.

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No, she was on the list of 45 with the SERP. The SERP has existed for over a decade, and was funded to about 60% last fall. The retention bonuses were for the top 5 or 6 people.

 

[coldplay]

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On 5/29/2003 7:28:01 PM NewHampshire Black Bears wrote:

<

AA does''nt have to worry about hiring any top notch exec''s, anytime soon.
Why,

BECAUSE THEY HAVE,

JIM LITTLE
JOHN WARD
and
JOHN DARRAH.

(Like the song goes)
"Who could ask for anything more, who could ask for anything more" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

GOD help us.

NH/BB''s

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You''re right! Arpey could have any trained monkey taught to say 3 words over and over: "Concessions or Bankruptcy" and these 3 would cave in faster than an igloo in the Sahara Desert

 

[AC AA LA FA]

If this trend continues..it can only be good news and that Mr. Arpey is cleaning house..Janes record with labor..starting with the 93 strike-then the mind blowing promotion to VP flt svc..has to be leaving Mr Arpey with dozens of better choices out there while making a huge statement to his commitment to leading this company...
buzz around the water cooler is Debbie Carvata-ORD base mgr may be up the position..I sure hope so..she is well respected, fair, and trusted by flight attendants...in these days there are few and far between we can say that about around here...I am keepimg my fingers crossed..it would be the best thing that could happen for us these days....

 

[pooksmom]

...and so how did the KOOL AID taste, Buzzkill?

 

[buzzkill]

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On 5/30/2003 234 AM pooksmom wrote:

...and so how did the KOOL AID taste, Buzzkill?

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All I have stated are facts. So are you saying that if you speak the facts instead of making up stories about people you don''t even know, you are drinking "Kool Aid"? Please tell me what I have said that is not purely the truth. Did Allen receive a "retention bonus"? No. Do any of you know that Arpey was "cleaning house"? No. It seems that many on this board are speaking on this subject with absolutely no factual information.

So if trying to keep the discussion on what is known versus pure speculation is drinking Kool Aid, then it tastes pretty good.

 

[AAObserver]

Cleaning house might be needed, but what good does it do when AA can''t provide competitive compensation for any new execs it hires?

No one in their right mind would leave an executive position to come to AA right now -- especially the best executives -- since there are no retention bonuses to persuade them over.

 

[FA Mikey]

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On 5/30/2003 159 AM AC AA LA FA wrote:

If this trend continues..it can only be good news and that Mr. Arpey is cleaning house..Janes record with labor..starting with the 93 strike-then the mind blowing promotion to VP flt svc..has to be leaving Mr Arpey with dozens of better choices out there while making a huge statement to his commitment to leading this company...
buzz around the water cooler is Debbie Carvata-ORD base mgr may be up the position..I sure hope so..she is well respected, fair, and trusted by flight attendants...in these days there are few and far between we can say that about around here...I am keepimg my fingers crossed..it would be the best thing that could happen for us these days....

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Debbie Carvatta has passed on many opportunities for further advancement. She likes where she is and her loyalty to that base is unquestionable.

 

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

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On 5/30/2003 8:07:46 AM AAObserver wrote:

No one in their right mind would leave an executive position to come to AA right now -- especially the best executives -- since there are no retention bonuses to persuade them over.

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AA has a history of promoting from within as far as VP ranks go, so my guess is someone internal will replace Jane. Since getting promoted (or leaving the company!) has been the only way for management employees to get a raise during the past three years, there are probably a lot of people who are more than qualified and willing to take on the job. Not everyone in management is incompetent, you know...

 

[FA Mikey]

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On 5/30/2003 8:07:46 AM AAObserver wrote:

Cleaning house might be needed, but what good does it do when AA can''t provide competitive compensation for any new execs it hires?

No one in their right mind would leave an executive position to come to AA right now -- especially the best executives -- since there are no retention bonuses to persuade them over.

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Could be said for all employees. Pilots, flight attendants Mechanics rampers and agents have all taken hits and cuts. Poor SR execs, who cant get a bonus for staying at a job for five years.

 

[pooksmom]

You are correct Buzzkill. We can''t be certain WHY Jane Allen left AA for UA, but I find the timing more than coincidental. And no she didn''t receive the retention bonus. Execs have to stay till Jan 2005 to receive the bonus. However, according to SEC records, she did agree to accept it, along with SERP, while at the same time,under threat of bankruptcy, asked for billions in employee concession. The deliberate delay of this SEC disclosure is again more than coincidental! Jane Allen is as culpable as Carty in deceiving the employees of AA. So if you''re quoting Mgmt''s "spin" from Jetnet, my friend, you''re drinking the KOOL AID.

 

[buzzkill]

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On 5/30/2003 12:43:24 PM pooksmom wrote:

You are correct Buzzkill. We can't be certain WHY Jane Allen left AA for UA, but I find the timing more than coincidental. And no she didn't receive the retention bonus. Execs have to stay till Jan 2005 to receive the bonus. However, according to SEC records, she did agree to accept it, along with SERP, while at the same time,under threat of bankruptcy, asked for billions in employee concession. The deliberate delay of this SEC disclosure is again more than coincidental! Jane Allen is as culpable as Carty in deceiving the employees of AA. So if you're quoting Mgmt's "spin" from Jetnet, my friend, you're drinking the KOOL AID.

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It seems that you are the only one between the two us who is drinking Kool Aid. But you are drinking the US Aviation Board Kool Aid of misinformation.

1. You and FA Mikey are wrong about the retention bonus. Jane Allen was not on the list of those to receive a retention bonus. The list included Carty, Arpey, Garton, Campbell, Kennedy, Ris, and Marlett. Please don't claim to quote the SEC filing that you obviously have not read.

2. The SERP has existed since 1985. The fact that the BOD funded it to about 60% last fall does not mean that Jane Allen deceived anybody. The BOD also funded the other pensions as well to about the same level.

3. The quote from Jetnet was to show the background of O'Keeffe, and had nothing to do with the reason Jane Allen went to UA.

4. The discussion on this topic seems to indicate that many people think that Jane Allen was higher on the ladder than she really was. She was not a Sr. VP (but she will be at UA). She was a VP who reported to Garton, not Arpey (or Carty). She did not sit on the 6th floor of HDQ1, and was not part of the Executive Committee.

It may make many people feel better to pretend that there is some big house cleaning going on, but you have no real proof. Also, I'm not defending Jane Allen, I just want the discussion on the board to be based on facts rather than purely contrived rumors.

 

[LaBradford22]

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On 5/30/2003 12:43:24 PM pooksmom wrote:

I just want the discussion on the board to be based on facts rather than purely contrived rumors.

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Wow. You''re asking WAAAAAAAAY too much. Oh well. I guess a guy can dream.

 

[Oliver Stone''s Apprentice]

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On 5/30/2003 941 AM FA Mikey wrote:

Could be said for all employees. Pilots, flight attendants Mechanics rampers and agents have all taken hits and cuts. Poor SR execs, who cant get a bonus for staying at a job for five years.

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Would you leave AA for UA if you could keep your relative seniority at UA?

What keeps pilots, flight attendants, etc. from leaving is the seniority system, plain and simple. In those professions, you can''t change jobs and still maintain the same quality of life or even pay, because you usually end up at step zero.

The only way out of that is to go to a non-union carrier who lets you negotiate your starting pay. It''s the same for management, except that management doesn''t get the job protection benefit from a seniority system, so they''re also not a prisoner to it.

This is the second officer we''ve lost in a month. Cheer about how VP''s are being tossed off the side, but the last thing we should be doing right now is spending time (and money) bringing their replacements up to speed.