Is the TWU really working out a deal with the IAM?

[hack73]

Anyone who is hoping for an election is crazy.Do you realize that anyone who has recall rights is eligible to vote ? There are 14 cities that are farmed out that we don't have anyway to contact these people to vote.Remember that a ballot not returned is a no vote.I have done some work on this issue in case there is an election , an we will need over 80 % of the eligible workers to return a ballot to win.
If there is an election , the odds are against us having a union.Believe me , there are people behind the scenes preparing for an election by making up contact lists and more , but if you were furloughed are you going to update your address and phone number with the company when you move?
Nelson hates the IAM and hopes to get involved with the TWU.Ask him what ever happened to his ramp workers union ?

 

[Tim Nelson]

Anyone who is hoping for an election is crazy.Do you realize that anyone who has recall rights is eligible to vote ? There are 14 cities that are farmed out that we don't have anyway to contact these people to vote.Remember that a ballot not returned is a no vote.I have done some work on this issue in case there is an election , an we will need over 80 % of the eligible workers to return a ballot to win.
If there is an election , the odds are against us having a union.Believe me , there are people behind the scenes preparing for an election by making up contact lists and more , but if you were furloughed are you going to update your address and phone number with the company when you move?
Nelson hates the IAM and hopes to get involved with the TWU.Ask him what ever happened to his ramp workers union ?

OK, me bad IAM hater. I stand accused. You feel better now?
Now tell us exactly how it is better to have the IAM and pay $500 a year than to be non-union? Facts only please.

regards

 

[wings396]

Anyone who is hoping for an election is crazy.Do you realize that anyone who has recall rights is eligible to vote ? There are 14 cities that are farmed out that we don't have anyway to contact these people to vote.Remember that a ballot not returned is a no vote.I have done some work on this issue in case there is an election , an we will need over 80 % of the eligible workers to return a ballot to win.
If there is an election , the odds are against us having a union.Believe me , there are people behind the scenes preparing for an election by making up contact lists and more , but if you were furloughed are you going to update your address and phone number with the company when you move?
Nelson hates the IAM and hopes to get involved with the TWU.Ask him what ever happened to his ramp workers union ?

Your above statement is not correct by a longshot. There were many furloughed employess from the outsourced stations that DID sign cards. Most, if not all will vote AGAINST the IAM just out of spite since they permitted the outsourcing of thier jobs. Just to see the IAM lose it's
"Cash Cow" of dues paying members would be a pleasure for us to see take place....

 

[Tim Nelson]

Your above statement is not correct by a longshot. There were many furloughed employess from the outsourced stations that DID sign cards. Most, if not all will vote AGAINST the IAM just out of spite since they permitted the outsourcing of thier jobs. Just to see the IAM lose it's
"Cash Cow" of dues paying members would be a pleasure for us to see take place....

wings,
my understanding is that Hack is a 'key' IAM person.
Which only means that he will not address the question posed to him and instead personally attack someone. One thing is for sure, if there is an election, I plan on being so far up the IAM's butt that I plan on 'rooting' them out of US AIRWAYS property. To be sure, I agree with Hack only in that if there was an election and the choice was 'only' IAM or non union then non-union would definately win. There really is no doubt about that and most reasonable people agree with that.

Still the question stands for the IAM, exactly what reason should a US AIRWAYS workers decide to contribute $2,000 cash to 'the IAM coffers' over the next 4 years as opposed to going non-union?

Let me start it off by explicitly saying they haven't got a damn thing for workers and that being non-union would offer no less but possibly more. So for the record, I think it makes 'good sense' for workers to be non-union instead of paying the Iamugged union.

And before they avoid the question, yeah, I'm a butthole, jerk, IAM hater, and probably a bunch other things and I admit it, so enough with the personal attacks from IAM loyalist, I stand accused.

regards,

 

[IAM1776PHL]

Anyone who is hoping for an election is crazy.Do you realize that anyone who has recall rights is eligible to vote ? There are 14 cities that are farmed out that we don't have anyway to contact these people to vote.Remember that a ballot not returned is a no vote.I have done some work on this issue in case there is an election , an we will need over 80 % of the eligible workers to return a ballot to win.
If there is an election , the odds are against us having a union.Believe me , there are people behind the scenes preparing for an election by making up contact lists and more , but if you were furloughed are you going to update your address and phone number with the company when you move?
Nelson hates the IAM and hopes to get involved with the TWU.Ask him what ever happened to his ramp workers union ?


maybe the iam should have thought about this when they sold all of us down the river.
would this give the 22 a reason to act as they did ?

 

[Tim Nelson]

Anyone who is hoping for an election is crazy.Do you realize that anyone who has recall rights is eligible to vote ? There are 14 cities that are farmed out that we don't have anyway to contact these people to vote.Remember that a ballot not returned is a no vote.I have done some work on this issue in case there is an election , an we will need over 80 % of the eligible workers to return a ballot to win.
If there is an election , the odds are against us having a union.Believe me , there are people behind the scenes preparing for an election by making up contact lists and more , but if you were furloughed are you going to update your address and phone number with the company when you move?
Nelson hates the IAM and hopes to get involved with the TWU.Ask him what ever happened to his ramp workers union ?

You must be doing Teamster math or figuring out the mechanic numbers. Even if the laid off workers all voted no [mindboggling if this happened] you would still only need 60% to vote yes to win since the active roster makes up over 80% of those eligible.

What seems to be going on is that it now appears the TWU is bowing down to the IAM and being bought off.

regards,

 

[HPMKE]

April 20, 2006



Dear Brothers and Sisters,



I was told by the TWU International late yesterday afternoon that they and the IAM International had agreed to meet with the NMB next week to pursue an internal election. I asked what that entailed and was told that both the TWU and IAM would conduct this election together instead of the NMB. By conducting the election this way, decertification would not be an issue. The Union that lost would then walk away and the Union that won would go back to the NMB to be certified as the representative of the Fleet Service Employees. The Local 580 Executive Board and Officers agree with an internal election unanimously.




This will be posted on the TWU 580 WEBSITE tonight.

 

[Ramp Rogue]

DO NOT, I repeat DO NOT let the iam count the votes! If an infernal vote does take place there has to be an impartial vote counter involved in the tabulations. If it is in the iam's hands we will all really be screwed based on past performances by the iam vote counters.

 

[EricLv2Fish]

April 20, 2006



Dear Brothers and Sisters,



I was told by the TWU International late yesterday afternoon that they and the IAM International had agreed to meet with the NMB next week to pursue an internal election. I asked what that entailed and was told that both the TWU and IAM would conduct this election together instead of the NMB. By conducting the election this way, decertification would not be an issue. The Union that lost would then walk away and the Union that won would go back to the NMB to be certified as the representative of the Fleet Service Employees. The Local 580 Executive Board and Officers agree with an internal election unanimously.
This will be posted on the TWU 580 WEBSITE tonight.

Nice to see the unions finally putting their heads together for the common good of the employees (given the transaction is on the up and up).

 

[Ramp Rogue]

Who approached who with this infernal election idea?

 

[unit4clt]

April 20, 2006



Dear Brothers and Sisters,



I was told by the TWU International late yesterday afternoon that they and the IAM International had agreed to meet with the NMB next week to pursue an internal election. I asked what that entailed and was told that both the TWU and IAM would conduct this election together instead of the NMB.

If this happens it tells just how gullible the TWU is to believe anything that the iam agrees to. Do they believe that the iam will just walk away after they lose the election? Don't they know how the iam have violated their own election policies in 2000, just to be reprimanded by the DOL. You would think they learned how dirty the iam is, by what happened in PHL. THE iam will stoop to any level to keep the dues flowing. :huh:

 

[HPMKE]

Who approached who with this infernal election idea?

I do believe it was the AFL-CIO.

 

[outsourcedphx]

Yeah. IAM helped you guys out in PHX, alright. That's why Uncle Larry and the Servisair boys were doing your job before the merger. You were sold out.
[/quote
No youre right we did get sold out,but dont think that was all the IAM.,,,the company was well aware of what was going on as you know we were outsourced 2 days before the merger announcement,,and now you folks are workin our jobs...right qq while we are on furlough....with recall of entry level pay,,so yeah you cld say we were sold out on a cupla fronts eh qq

 

[Tim Nelson]

I am certainly on the outside looking in as I am not finally privy to key IAM or TWU internal decisions. Thus, although I myself believe my source of the original posting as being 'key', I realize information is still 'secondhand' when it gets to me and the initial post along with the post starting below should be read as second hand hearsay.
Nonetheless, within 24 hours of the posting of this thread, much of its original posting has come true as deadly accurate. I was not surprised.
My post below is to shed any insight I may have along with furthering procedural information that may be useful in furthering this important conversation.

At any rate, don't be too high on an internal vote, without a marriage. I was told the IAM was totally against a marriage [like IBT/CWA]from the beginning because of the TWA debacle and 'hard feelings'.

IMO, an internal vote appears to be an interesting procedural move that may benefit organized labor in future NMB elections, however, in the end, I believe it is the start of the 'smoke and mirrors' that the TWU represented workers will be experiencing since the TWU INTL apparently didn't have the balls to stop listening to the IAM regimes 'deals'.

It is my understanding that the IAM will eventually stare down the TWU and the TWU will withdraw its petition thereby allowing the IAM to retain certification. The IAM has all but convinced the TWU that a complete decert would be in order if the TWU did the right thing and continued with a normal vote. It's still in the TWU's hands from a legal standpoint since they haven't withdrawn yet, but again, my understanding based on my opening post under this thread is that the TWU INTL has already pledged a withdrawal under conditions, and I believe that means money. Not sure if the TWU locals are already aware of this but they might be. Dunno. At any rate, I do not think the TWU INTL really cared or had all the information and thus didn't effectively consider any write-in votes.

FWIW: The Players

1. NMB: The NMB has already notified the eligible workers that a petition was served and that "...workers will have the right to express their desire to be represented or to be nonrepresented."
The NMB has jurisdiction and it is unlikely that the NMB will stray from the above and allow a 'hybrid' run-off election between two unions that effectively violates the rights of workers to be nonrepresented or vote 'other'. Further, I'm sure there would be legal action against the NMB if it strayed and I can't be sure if the DOL would support a favorable ruling for unions yet against workers.

2. Your Company: It is my understanding that your company likes the IAM agreement and wants it to stay right where it is without jeopardy. This means that it is extremely unlikely that any election will have a company sponsored counter organizing drive. Further, if the IAM/TWU was really serious about an internal election then it would have went to the company for voluntary recognition of the winner of an American Arbitration Associations conducted election. This would have cut out the NMB altogether. My spin on this is that the IAM doesn't NO HOW NO WAY want any election because it can't win with the TWU or 'mickey mouse' on the ballot. So that is why I believe the IAM has apparently already come into agreement with the TWU INTL over monetary values in exchange for its members. Kinda like Iran-Contra IMO. It's unlikely that the TWU locals are aware of this but certainly not its members until it comes to pass.

3. IAM: unfortunately, it appears the IAM will end up smelling like a rose. FWIW: I know someone posted that they would be concerned with an internal election that has the IAM counting ballots. To be sure, neither a company or NMB would allow an election to be run by unions, for fear of possible litigation. So in theory if there were any internal election dealing with these matters then I think an officially recognized organization like the American Arbitrator's Association would be used. This isn't for union officers so just running any ole flimsy election would not be allowed.

4. TWU INTL: I'm not surprised.



I suppose it is fair for me to say where I'm coming from.

1. I will do what I can to make sure Normal Board election procedures are followed, provided things fall apart between the IAM/TWU and the TWU doesn't withdraw its petition. My understanding is that some will choose to vote for the TWU, some IAM, some IBT, some no-union. To be sure, I don't believe the IBT will run an official fleet service campaign because of the political reasons dealing with the mechanics, however, it is also my understanding that a write-in campaign for them may be greater than IAM votes.

2. I believe the Continental rampers should be briefed on how the IAM and especially the TWU may be putting the screws to TWU represented workers at America West. I believe I will see to it.

3. For the record, I am not a voter for the TWU or IAM. however I do plan on staying involved in an official NMB election.

regards,

 

[LGA Fleet Service]

I was told the IAM was totally against a marriage [like IBT/CWA]from the beginning because of the TWA debacle and 'hard feelings'.

TWA had threatened to file 1113 to abrogate the CBA's unless all unions on the property signed away the scope protections in their respective contracts.Faced with the prospect of dealing with AMR with no contract, they accepted.

The IAM requested binding arbitration on the seniority issue and got it.They were also brought up to AA pay rates in under a year, there were no 'gradual step increases' and there was no 'double siphon' dual representation horse hockey.