IBT Fresh Start Committee

[TWU informer]

So we are clear, I agree with you on two points. There is a need for greater coordinated action among working people and unions to fight our continuing loss of rights. I also agree that the IBT with its long history of corruption, raiding, and miserable relations with other unions is a poor vehicle for solidarity. This shows up in their representation because they are probably the most decertified union in the history of the industry. And we would probably also agree that it is just ludicrous for the IBT to claim that its “strength” prevents outsourcing when there isn’t a single carrier where it represents mechanics where a majority of the work or the majority of heavy overhaul is required to be done in house or is actually done in house. However, I just disagree with you that there is any reason to believe Amfa is a better vehicle for the mass movement you are seeking.

I don’t have the time or space to go into the list of Amfa bargaining failures. However, it’s quite obvious that in dealing with the unfair restrictions of bankruptcy they have not done any better or made any different decisions than the TWU or anyone else. But, take a look at this board. On the one hand you make a reasonable point about the need for solidarity among transportation workers, yet roughly one out of every three posts is about how mechanics are being dragged down by lesser skilled workers (even though the mechanic and related craft has workers of just about all skill levels). Do you think that this mentality – or the mentality of your various co-hoards’ who compare President Obama to Hitler and Stalin—is a basis for building solidarity among the very workers who you will need support from?

I’ll give you another example of something that bothered me from a friend on the railroad. Back in 2005 or so Amfa picketed a rail hub in the Midwest asking the workers to shut it down in solidarity with the NWA strike. There was no coordination with the union that represented the workers, or even advance warning. It was unlawful for the rail workers to honor the picket line, but they did and a number were disciplined and lost pay as a result. It was a result that could have been avoided if AMFA had displayed the normal respect that is due to another union and its workers.

Look, the labor movement is in a bad way and we face massive political and economic opposition, but Amfa is not a new solution to any of this. It is an old solution which has been tried numerous times over the last fifty years with very mixed results in general and horrible results for heavy overhaul. If you are saying that we need more solidarity between workers at all skill levels and in all facets of transportation I would agree. I disagree that Amfa is capable of producing this result or even helping reach it.

In Solidarity
CIO

Pretty typical anti-AMFA post. I have asked more than once and here we go again. What exactly is your plan or solution? It appears to be stick with what has failed us to this point. There is proof this idea is failing, there is NO proof the AMFA idea will fail because it has not been tried yet, because members like yourself fear change. Until ALL AMT's unite into one CRAFT Union then the AMFA idea has not been tried in full force. On the other hand, the AFL-CIO Leaders have not felt the concessions like we have, the TWU leaders have not felt the concessions like we have, do you honestly think a damn one of them is the type lf leader that will risk everything they have to lead a revolt? I don't. They live comfortable, are under no threat of being voted out, and they actually believe that getting to testify before Congress, or create some report for them is adequate representation, you can see this in their own writings produced on a regular basis. Every flier, newsletter, or BS internet update reads the same way. No action, No results, just same old tired game. When all that really amounts is a simple self serving ego boost and a big lie. There is plenty of evidence that any perceived power of strength in numbers is false and will not be used. In other words, those rich appointed Bastards don't have the balls to take the necessary risk, and never will. You are dead wrong on the main point and therefore everything you posted in pretty well flawed. The AMFA idea is ALL AMT's into one Union and then action instead politics for relief. Exactly when in the last 50 years has that been tried as you claim? Answer: NEVER And that because the political institution of dues collection is far more important to the other unions than allowing the AMFA idea to succeed, grow, or flourish. In other words, the industrial unions along with Airline management have done everything possible to prevent and defeat the idea as it moves forward And here you are today in this forum, claiming the idea has been tried numerous times in the last 50 years. I call BS on that claim...period

 

[enough already]

Pretty typical anti-AMFA post. I have asked more than once and here we go again. What exactly is your plan or solution? The AFL-CIO Leaders have not felt the concessions like we have, the TWU leaders have not felt the concessions like we have, do you honestly think a damn one of them is the type lf leader that will risk everything they have to lead a revolt? I don't. They live comfortable, are under no threat of being voted out, and they actually believe that getting to testify before Congress, or create some report for them is adequate. When all that is a simple self serving ego boost and a big lie. There is plenty of evidence that any perceived power of strength in numbers is false and will not be used. In other words, those rich appointed Bastards don't have the balls to take the necessary risk, and never will.

Are you saying "Enough is Enough"?

 

[Real tired]

Can you name one Union that has not allowed outsourced????? They have all allowed outsourced maintenance and it's time for a change...And if we can't stop it at least keep it in the UNITED STATES with union or non-union American workers.

The letter I received seems to contradict what you posted.

Oh, decisions......decisions. Who to believe?

View attachment 9727

View attachment 9726

Note: Turn computer sideways to read.

 

[Bob Owens]

CIO has no plan other than rolling over whenever AA tells him to. He says he wants unity but only under his terms. You can have majority rules, or you can have Unity. You cant have Unity if the majority simply says "I'm the majority so I win, every time, and you have to support us. If you want Unity you have to have a consensus, that means that the majority has to be fair and make sure that the needs of the minority are met as well. No consensus, no unity.

 

[1AA]

If they need a fresh start then it is obvious they failed the first time around. I guess all their claims about opening contracts and so on were lies after all. So now they will start fresh. Fresh with what? New lies and false claims? What do the Teamsters know about American Airlines AMT's? Nothing!! They are out of touch like management at AA.

 

[Bob Owens]

If they need a fresh start then it is obvious they failed the first time around. I guess all their claims about opening contracts and so on were lies after all. So now they will start fresh. Fresh with what? New lies and false claims? What do the Teamsters know about American Airlines AMT's? Nothing!! They are out of touch like management at AA.

They know all our addresses though!

 

[CIO]

Bob, maybe you can give us some insight on representing the membership in your new role. Don't give us your typical its not my fault senerio.

Dave, the new local 591 officers have an oppurtunity to be proactive in making positive change. I hope they will take the oppurtunity to actually help the membership going forward . They are now responsible for the members from coast to coast.

In Solidarity,
CIO

 

[TWU informer]

Bob, maybe you can give us some insight on representing the membership in your new role. Don't give us your typical its not my fault senerio.

Dave, the new local 591 officers have an oppurtunity to be proactive in making positive change. I hope they will take the oppurtunity to actually help the membership going forward . They are now responsible for the members from coast to coast.

In Solidarity,
CIO

What? The Line Locals were NOT the problem, and Local 591 damn sure isn't the solution? You've got to be kidding that you even believe that crap.

 

[scorpion 2]

So we are clear, I agree with you on two points. There is a need for greater coordinated action among working people and unions to fight our continuing loss of rights. I also agree that the IBT with its long history of corruption, raiding, and miserable relations with other unions is a poor vehicle for solidarity. This shows up in their representation because they are probably the most decertified union in the history of the industry. And we would probably also agree that it is just ludicrous for the IBT to claim that its “strength” prevents outsourcing when there isn’t a single carrier where it represents mechanics where a majority of the work or the majority of heavy overhaul is required to be done in house or is actually done in house. However, I just disagree with you that there is any reason to believe Amfa is a better vehicle for the mass movement you are seeking.

I don’t have the time or space to go into the list of Amfa bargaining failures. However, it’s quite obvious that in dealing with the unfair restrictions of bankruptcy they have not done any better or made any different decisions than the TWU or anyone else. But, take a look at this board. On the one hand you make a reasonable point about the need for solidarity among transportation workers, yet roughly one out of every three posts is about how mechanics are being dragged down by lesser skilled workers (even though the mechanic and related craft has workers of just about all skill levels). Do you think that this mentality – or the mentality of your various co-hoards’ who compare President Obama to Hitler and Stalin—is a basis for building solidarity among the very workers who you will need support from?

I’ll give you another example of something that bothered me from a friend on the railroad. Back in 2005 or so Amfa picketed a rail hub in the Midwest asking the workers to shut it down in solidarity with the NWA strike. There was no coordination with the union that represented the workers, or even advance warning. It was unlawful for the rail workers to honor the picket line, but they did and a number were disciplined and lost pay as a result. It was a result that could have been avoided if AMFA had displayed the normal respect that is due to another union and its workers.

Look, the labor movement is in a bad way and we face massive political and economic opposition, but Amfa is not a new solution to any of this. It is an old solution which has been tried numerous times over the last fifty years with very mixed results in general and horrible results for heavy overhaul. If you are saying that we need more solidarity between workers at all skill levels and in all facets of transportation I would agree. I disagree that Amfa is capable of producing this result or even helping reach it.

In Solidarity
CIO

One simple question.
Has the twu ever tried or even mentioned bringing all mechanics under one organization? The AMFA has never had the oportunity to fully put their philosophy to the test but the twu,ibt,and iam have had years to get their game plans in place. The truth is that they have no game plan but to collect dues and talk #### after the fact. jim little gets an A for soap box rhetoric after the event happens. All his piss and vinegar show up well after the event has played out! I hope you and these other blind faith industrial union drones keep posting your twisted logic because it helps remind us all just how screwed up this situation is.
In solidarity
Scorpion

 

[blue collar]

Not gonna hit quote to repost the whole first quote, but Bob, you nailed it with that one.

 

[swamt]

Bob, maybe you can give us some insight on representing the membership in your new role. Don't give us your typical its not my fault senerio.

Dave, the new local 591 officers have an oppurtunity to be proactive in making positive change. I hope they will take the oppurtunity to actually help the membership going forward . They are now responsible for the members from coast to coast.

In Solidarity,
CIO

Maybe he will answer your question after you answer all your questions.