767 AND 777 GONE

[Buck]

I do not believe in the theory of business moving overseas because of the labor cost in itself. My position is that the over taxation is what pushes a business overseas. Fix the tax problem and the labor as a cost problem will fix itself.

 

[TulsaTurd]

FWAAA,

Despite the argument about safety, or the lack thereof, how do you feel about the outsourcing of American jobs (USA) to other countries.
Are you of the Corporate mentality that if I can outsource it to a foreign country for half (if not more) of my current labor cost, that is the right thing to do. And, if you think it is, is it because it is better for the consumer or because it benefits both our shareholders and Corporate heads much much more. Love to here your take and any other who defends the outsourcing of jobs to other countries, including communist China...

If you happen to shop at Walmart or drive a foriegn car, welcome to the world of supporting outsourcing.

 

[Buck]

If you happen to shop at Walmart or drive a foriegn car, welcome to the world of supporting outsourcing.

Curious, what cars have manufacturing facilities in the United States which that have all of their parts made in the United States?

By the way, that GM stock that I bought failed and then the new GM stock after government intervention failed also.

 

[CactUS4Ever]

FWAAA,

Despite the argument about safety, or the lack thereof, how do you feel about the outsourcing of American jobs (USA) to other countries.
Are you of the Corporate mentality that if I can outsource it to a foreign country for half (if not more) of my current labor cost, that is the right thing to do. And, if you think it is, is it because it is better for the consumer or because it benefits both our shareholders and Corporate heads much much more. Love to here your take and any other who defends the outsourcing of jobs to other countries, including communist China...

This outsourcing is nothing new. United,US,Jet Blue, Southwest,Delta all do it. The FAA accomplishes audits at the overseas stations and keep them in check. First of all We as Aircraft Mechanics need to find away to unite and step up. All of us need to bring in 1 union to represent all of us no matter what airline is imprinted on our shirts and bring these jobs back to the USA. Second we need to protest the companies we work for on the same day at the same time. We need to be heard,it's the only way. Us talking about it over and over on this forum is not doing anything but aggravating us more. When everyone is ready to unite and organize a demonstration I'm in. With Facebook and other social networks it's not too hard to do. Just matters how much effort we put in. Now it's up to us.

 

[eolesen]

If you happen to shop at Walmart or drive a foriegn car, welcome to the world of supporting outsourcing.

Doesn't Bob Owens drive a 17 year old imported car?...

Despite the argument about safety, or the lack thereof, how do you feel about the outsourcing of American jobs (USA) to other countries.
Are you of the Corporate mentality that if I can outsource it to a foreign country for half (if not more) of my current labor cost, that is the right thing to do. And, if you think it is, is it because it is better for the consumer or because it benefits both our shareholders and Corporate heads much much more. Love to here your take and any other who defends the outsourcing of jobs to other countries, including communist China...

Here's my take... We are a nation that was built on trade, and it's foolish to think that we can suddenly try to be protectionist because the balance of trade has tilted in the opposite direction from where it was 50 years ago.

We apparently had no problem taking jobs away from local companies like British Aerospace, Hawker-Siddley, Mitsubishi, or Dornier when it came time to sell Boeing aircraft to BA, JL, or LH. And those Boeing airplanes are also sold to companies in China and Airbus's home countries.

There really isn't a legitimate competitor to Caterpillar when it comes to heavy equipment. There are a few who have tried, but Cat still wins contracts from around the globe, and does most of its assembly here in the US. Is anyone in Australia or Brasil complaining about the loss of manufacturing jobs?...

General Electric and EMD (now a Cat subsidiary) pretty much own the market for manufacturing heavy locomotives. I don't hear a lot of complaining in Australia or Saudi Arabia when they're importing locomotives made in Muncie, IN or Erie, PA...

The xenophopes probably don't think twice about Microsoft or Oracle products being the leader in corporations worldwide, yet openly complain about iPods and iPads being made in China....

We don't think twice about the fact that you can see CNN anywhere in the world, but some people get all whipped up when they realize that there isn't a single major TV manufacturing plant left in the United States. Even the few that exists are entirely dependent upon components made in Asia, and just about every person who complains about the lack of manufacturing here probably won't be willing to spend the extra $100 or so it would cost to source everything local for an imported TV currently being sold for $200 @ Walmart.


For every one example of corporate greed you guys can produce, there is likely at least one example of union greed. Choking the golden goose for every last leg has a tendancy to either kill the goose, or piss it off so much that it flies away.

In the case of the auto industry, they've all managed to move to RTW states for the most part. GM hasn't closed as much production in RTW states as they have closed-shop states.

EMD, Cat, and GE have been doing the same thing. EMD's plant in Muncie (newly minted RTW state) is replacing a plant in London, Ontario where the C-UAW has been locked out for six months in a contract dispute. GE opened a new locomotive plant in Fort Worth last year, and I'd expect it will be growing at the expense of Erie. Cat has expanded very little in its Illinois homestead, with a dozen or so new facilities opened in the past ten years in RTW states.

When you bring this back around to airlines, the one trick in the bag that major manufactures have been able to use and airlines haven't is the ability to move work to RTW states, thus lowering some of the cost.

In conclusion.... I do not support outsourcing, but you really can't blame companies for looking at every possible avenue to matching the costs of their leanest competitor.

 

[cf6mech]

Doesn't Bob Owens drive a 17 year old imported car?...



Here's my take... We are a nation that was built on trade, and it's foolish to think that we can suddenly try to be protectionist because the balance of trade has tilted in the opposite direction from where it was 50 years ago.

We apparently had no problem taking jobs away from local companies like British Aerospace, Hawker-Siddley, Mitsubishi, or Dornier when it came time to sell Boeing aircraft to BA, JL, or LH. And those Boeing airplanes are also sold to companies in China and Airbus's home countries.

There really isn't a legitimate competitor to Caterpillar when it comes to heavy equipment. There are a few who have tried, but Cat still wins contracts from around the globe, and does most of its assembly here in the US. Is anyone in Australia or Brasil complaining about the loss of manufacturing jobs?...

General Electric and EMD (now a Cat subsidiary) pretty much own the market for manufacturing heavy locomotives. I don't hear a lot of complaining in Australia or Saudi Arabia when they're importing locomotives made in Muncie, IN or Erie, PA...

The xenophopes probably don't think twice about Microsoft or Oracle products being the leader in corporations worldwide, yet openly complain about iPods and iPads being made in China....

We don't think twice about the fact that you can see CNN anywhere in the world, but some people get all whipped up when they realize that there isn't a single major TV manufacturing plant left in the United States. Even the few that exists are entirely dependent upon components made in Asia, and just about every person who complains about the lack of manufacturing here probably won't be willing to spend the extra $100 or so it would cost to source everything local for an imported TV currently being sold for $200 @ Walmart.


For every one example of corporate greed you guys can produce, there is likely at least one example of union greed. Choking the golden goose for every last leg has a tendancy to either kill the goose, or piss it off so much that it flies away.

In the case of the auto industry, they've all managed to move to RTW states for the most part. GM hasn't closed as much production in RTW states as they have closed-shop states.

EMD, Cat, and GE have been doing the same thing. EMD's plant in Muncie (newly minted RTW state) is replacing a plant in London, Ontario where the C-UAW has been locked out for six months in a contract dispute. GE opened a new locomotive plant in Fort Worth last year, and I'd expect it will be growing at the expense of Erie. Cat has expanded very little in its Illinois homestead, with a dozen or so new facilities opened in the past ten years in RTW states.

When you bring this back around to airlines, the one trick in the bag that major manufactures have been able to use and airlines haven't is the ability to move work to RTW states, thus lowering some of the cost.

In conclusion.... I do not support outsourcing, but you really can't blame companies for looking at every possible avenue to matching the costs of their leanest competitor.

You really want to compare us to Australia, Saudi ..... etc?......Do you not believe in American Exceptionalism?......You seem , I could be wrong here,......to want to blame outsourcing on Union labor alone.....were I see the major contributing factor from 50 years ago to now is how much more the government has restricted and choked companies with high tax rates, EPA and OSHA standards..etc...etc.....just look at the cap and trade baloney....look how dependent we are the whims of others when it comes to oil when theres plenty here,....but the government wont let the oil companies drill......look how many more government entitlements programs there are.....I can go on and on if you want to go back 50 years.....its much more than matching costs with your nearest competitor.

 

[cf6mech]

For the same reasons jobs and opportunities are leaving states like Kalifornia and moving to states like Texas.....as their entitlement programs,.....(Kalifornia has like 30 plus santuary cities for illeglals ! ! how many pay taxes ?).. heavy restrictions locally and then federally ....(read the green movement etc.etc.,) heavy tax burdens,.....some companies are skipping state to state relief and searching outside the US......I dont see Unionized labor as the Demon here as you do.....I see big brother government...... I see every step towards Socialization one step away from Capitalism.....we cant have both.....if we do,..... we have a caste system with no middle class.....the very rich......and the very poor.

 

[Buck]

And you don't see that your big government is similar to your union?

 

[cf6mech]

And you don't see that your big government is similar to your union?

Not my point,..... What im reading is a shot at Unionized labor as the reason for outsourcing......which is wrong in my eyes....

 

[MCI transplant]

Doesn't Bob Owens drive a 17 year old imported car?...



Here's my take... We are a nation that was built on trade, and it's foolish to think that we can suddenly try to be protectionist because the balance of trade has tilted in the opposite direction from where it was 50 years ago.

We apparently had no problem taking jobs away from local companies like British Aerospace, Hawker-Siddley, Mitsubishi, or Dornier when it came time to sell Boeing aircraft to BA, JL, or LH. And those Boeing airplanes are also sold to companies in China and Airbus's home countries.

There really isn't a legitimate competitor to Caterpillar when it comes to heavy equipment. There are a few who have tried, but Cat still wins contracts from around the globe, and does most of its assembly here in the US. Is anyone in Australia or Brasil complaining about the loss of manufacturing jobs?...

General Electric and EMD (now a Cat subsidiary) pretty much own the market for manufacturing heavy locomotives. I don't hear a lot of complaining in Australia or Saudi Arabia when they're importing locomotives made in Muncie, IN or Erie, PA...

The xenophopes probably don't think twice about Microsoft or Oracle products being the leader in corporations worldwide, yet openly complain about iPods and iPads being made in China....

We don't think twice about the fact that you can see CNN anywhere in the world, but some people get all whipped up when they realize that there isn't a single major TV manufacturing plant left in the United States. Even the few that exists are entirely dependent upon components made in Asia, and just about every person who complains about the lack of manufacturing here probably won't be willing to spend the extra $100 or so it would cost to source everything local for an imported TV currently being sold for $200 @ Walmart.


For every one example of corporate greed you guys can produce, there is likely at least one example of union greed. Choking the golden goose for every last leg has a tendancy to either kill the goose, or piss it off so much that it flies away.

In the case of the auto industry, they've all managed to move to RTW states for the most part. GM hasn't closed as much production in RTW states as they have closed-shop states.

EMD, Cat, and GE have been doing the same thing. EMD's plant in Muncie (newly minted RTW state) is replacing a plant in London, Ontario where the C-UAW has been locked out for six months in a contract dispute. GE opened a new locomotive plant in Fort Worth last year, and I'd expect it will be growing at the expense of Erie. Cat has expanded very little in its Illinois homestead, with a dozen or so new facilities opened in the past ten years in RTW states.

When you bring this back around to airlines, the one trick in the bag that major manufactures have been able to use and airlines haven't is the ability to move work to RTW states, thus lowering some of the cost.

In conclusion.... I do not support outsourcing, but you really can't blame companies for looking at every possible avenue to matching the costs of their leanest competitor.

<_< ------- E! The way we beat the bad guys in WWII is that we out produced them! Simply fact is today we no longer can do that! Our heavy Industry has been outsourced! I realize that times have changed. And we have to adapt to that fact! But does that let me sleep any easyer at night?-------- Not really!!!!

 

[Buck]

Not my point,..... What im reading is a shot at Unionized labor as the reason for outsourcing......which is wrong in my eyes....

I understand, however if unionized labor would restructure itself maybe our competitiveness would be recognized again.