Hubs, route structure, etc

[WCT]

Between DEN and PHX is really a tough one. Cons: DEN has high costs and aggressive expansion by SWA and F9, PHX has huge SWA presence and lower yields. Pros: DEN facilities and central location, PHX population growth, weather. Bottom line is SWA is gonna be big after F9 goes away and the DEN and PHX yields will be the same in time. With the high cost of facilities it may be hard to stay in DEN when it turns into a low cost hub for SWA. In the end PHX and DEN both reduced 20% but remain small hubs, SWA gains 50% of the market in both cities.

Okay. SWA has a huge presence in PHX, but US Airways(Old HP) is the Dominate carrier in PHX, bottom line!! I asked this question, before the merger? WHY would AWA of stayed alive and made money year after year if it weren't for the PHX and LAS market!!?? ANSWER: WE DO MAKE MONEY IN PHX AND LAS!! Stop this nonsense. HP would of been long gone before the MERGER WITH US Airways, IF we NEVER MADE MONEY in PHX and LAS! West ain't going nowhere for now! :angry:

 

[coolflyingfool]

SWA does more O & D traffic in PHX than LCC. LCC has a much higher transfer pax rate than SWA in PHX. That works for both of them for now, but IF UA and LCC hook up, then PHX will have to lose some flights due to less transfer traffic. just my thoughts.........

 

[WCT]

SWA does more O & D traffic in PHX than LCC. LCC has a much higher transfer pax rate than SWA in PHX. That works for both of them for now, but IF UA and LCC hook up, then PHX will have to lose some flights due to less transfer traffic. just my thoughts.........

My point is AWA brought something to the table, besides great employees! We get treated as the step children of US Air, please!? The west gave nothing my A$$??!! HP would of been out of business IF PHX and LAS didn't mean something to this merger! Investors also wouldn't of given the money either. I defend the East as much as the West, but sick of seeing posts about how East makes all the money! In that case, this merger would of never happened in the first place..

 

[coolflyingfool]

WOH! WOH! WOH! WCT I am not attacking anything to do with the East vs West argument of US and AWA. I was going with PHX stands to POSSIBLY lose a FEW flights IF the LCC and UAUA merger goes through as to the type of traffic that LCC currently moves at PHX. That was all. just my thoughts..........

 

[Poug Darker]

The last US-UAL merger attempt produced a great amount of concern by the DOJ about the choices the metro Wash DC market had if the combination had occurred. At that time, US was dominant in both DCA and BWI, with UAL the major player in IAD, with US having a small presence there also.
Besides UAL getting cold feet (as they did with Frontier once upon a time), the DOJ concerns gave UAL a reason to pull out of the deal.
Since that time, US has abandoned BWI. Let me say that again: US abandoned BWI - and gave it to LUV, the low-cost darling of the industry. There is now NO argument that there need be ANY metro DC divestitures for a US-UAL combo approval.
The good citizens of the DC metro area have a low-cost alternative choice and that is LUV in BWI.
US brings a few jewels to the trade, one being the dominant carrier in DCA - and I believe US has positioned itself perfectly for this combination in this regard.
Cheers.

 

[Travelpro72]

Absolutely Poug. Not only do you have Southwest in BWI you also have a pretty big operation from AirTran. I see no problem with a US/UA DCA/IAD combo. I also don't think you'd see the shuttle go ANYWHERE. That baby is a cash cow.

 

[hp-csr-phx]

Here are the Metro populations of the UA and US hubs and focus cities.

LAX 12.9 million
ORD 9.5
PHL 5.8
DCA 5.3
BOS 4.5
SFO 4.2
PHX 4.2
ONT 4.0
DEN 2.4
PIT 2.4
LAS 1.8
SJC 1.8
CLT 1.6

So PHX is quite a bit bigger than DEN, which is the same size as PIT. But both PHX and DEN server slightly different markets, HP always has focused on the Southern California connections. The US Southwest is definitely growing, AUS is now as big as CLT. AUS might someday make a great focus city for some carrier. I also included ONT and SJC to show just how big the LAX and SFO metro areas are.

 

[Pacemaker]

WHY would AWA of stayed alive and made money year after year if it weren't for the PHX and LAS market!!?? ANSWER: WE DO MAKE MONEY IN PHX AND LAS!! Stop this nonsense.

That was when we had unit costs roughly equal to WN. Since the merger units costs have skyrocketed, and that was before the fuel price runup. I frankly don't see how we can compete in the west with US Airways - style unit costs.

 

[FlyUs]

A combined US/UA will have 25.6% of the market share in Boston and be the largest carrier, surpassing DAL/NW with 21.7%. This could be considered a mini hub. Possible additions might include non stop flights to NRT, LHR and FRA.

 

[Pacemaker]

Regarding antitrust issues - I think it's going to be a bloodbath. Every politician from the major of Phoenix to the Governor of VA is going to making hay in the media over this. Congress is going to hold hearings, you can be sure. There's going to be little overall sympathy for the poor betrodden airline industry.

NW/DL is going to have enough trouble getting this past the DOJ. UA/US? Even shakier prospects, imo.
Major divesting to low-cost carriers required to even have a chance of getting it done.

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

That was when we had unit costs roughly equal to WN. Since the merger units costs have skyrocketed, and that was before the fuel price run up. I frankly don't see how we can compete in the west with US Airways - style unit costs.

Same story different year.

 

[jcw]

If you look at www.staralliance.com and check several markets like SFO/LAX/DEN to PHX & LAS or CLT to IAD/ORD/DEN or PHL to ORD/SFO/DEN/LAX etc. there is room for running larger aircraft cutting flights to deploy the aircraft to onto RJ routes. For example, CLT to IAD on both carriers are RJ's (except two flights a day by US). You can eliminate 1/2 the flights on that route move to an A319 or B737 still have the same number of seats and produce a lower cost product.

You would still need more widebody's to expand into South America and India, Europe etc. More Asia from Philly to NRT you could also add NRT to PHX and LAS to take advantage of the United hub at NRT.

 

[Travelpro72]

.
You would still need more widebody's to expand into South America and India, Europe etc. More Asia from Philly to NRT you could also add NRT to PHX and LAS to take advantage of the United hub at NRT.

This might work considering US has a lot of widebody a/c on the way.

 

[N903AW]

Looks like one of our western hubs is being dismantled already. Could the company already be laying the groundwork for consolidation??

US Airways to trim Las Vegas flights, eliminate hub

 

[back2CLT]

Other than BMW and the occasional NASCAR bent-metal fest, CLT really has no industry, to speak of.

True true....I think a couple of people also work at the 2 community banks down on main street...doubt you've ever heard of them. Bank of America and Wachovia?

Doubt they do much flying though....Kenny (that's the president of both banks, its an easy job) sometimes rides up to a place called NEW York....don't know what makes it so special though...he could get to regular old York (S.C.) in a couple of hours by horse.