How Low Does Employee Pay Have To Go?

[USAirBoyA330]

usfliboi:

Can I just ask you to set aside your management pom poms for a moment and ask you a question? How many years do you have with USAirways? I would be willing to bet more than 7 and if not then maybe we need to lay off the coolaid and relize what is happeneing.
With my 5 years I have gotten numerous furlough notices (all rescinded) and I can't remember how may displacement letters. I just use them to make origamis or line the bird cage now. My senority is in constant flux. While the 15 year people are worried about the R word (reserve) we worry on a daily basis about our jobs and what base we get thrown too. Tell me how productivity improvments will affect you? Management is telling us they want to do more with LESS. That means people under you will disappear and your life just got a whole lot more complicated. We are already at the bare bone but I don't think 1 more employee esp F/A's should be sacrificed for these goons.

 

[Mike W]

Asked if US Airways has any future, Bronner said, "It has that potential." But rising tensions with the company's unions could be a problem. If the unions say, "I am not willing to put in another penny, you have what you have had with other airlines. It dissolves. It goes away.

If this doesn't sound like they're coming back for more pay concessions,then I'd like to have the rose colored glasses you're looking through. I voted for two concession packages because I thought it might give them what they needed to make this company work. I'm commuting 1200 miles because I was dispaced from the station I had worked in for twenty five years. I'm afraid there's just no more to give. Talk to an ex-TWA employee and asked them how well it turned out for them after giving concession after concession.

 

[wnbubbleboy]

What is the motivation to beat SW in PHL even if we could?

The average South West employee has a stock option account worth over $100,000. They also have a very nice profit sharing plan (They do make money). And a retirement plan.

If we succeed then Siegel makes a mint and we make what?

What I am saying is simple. The Southwest employee is MOTIVATED to the max to kick our butt. Just like they did in BWI! The SouthWest employee is motivated in a positive way to save their standard of living. They will fight very hard.

We are motivated by what? Fear I guess................How hard am I/are we going to fight to line the pockets of Dave and Dave with cash?

Most U employees won't take much of a paycut even if we have to start over somewhere (except for Pilots) else. Our Unions already gave our futures away over MidAtlantic.

The fight is over before it even gets started. It didn't have to be this way.

Our major competition will beat us senseless because Management of SouthWest and JetBlue have decided the only way to make it in today's airline industry is to share the wealth with all of their employees. Our Management wants to have it all for themselves. This is why they will never win!

I find in hard to believe that the "average" southwest employee has a stock portfolio of "over 100.00." What do you base this on?

Take a look at the SEC filings for the last five years. Some groups did well some didn't do as well depending on when the contract was negoitiated. I give you and example of our dept (stores clerks) which negotiated pre-911. If you were topped out (five years) when the contract was negotiated you have approx 10,000 shares of stock but the strike price is 19.81 (after one stock split) or so. Our excersise date is in 2008 though, if the stock rises to $30 + that would give us around $100,000. Also, we don't have a pension but we have up to a 7.3 company match for the 401K and profitsharing is the bonus for our retirement plan.

 

[MarkMyWords]

cwa.net 12/17/03

In the coming "Battle for PHL" US Airways execs have a big passenger service cost advantage over Southwest Airlines...
US Airways execs have a big advantage over Southwest in the Battle for PHL. Southwest passenger service salaries are currently about 6% higher than US Airways', and in the years from now until 2008 they will range from 9% higher to almost 19% higher, depending upon the year. This is an incredible cost advantage for US Airways execs over Southwest.
To put this into perspective, US Airways execs will spend an average of $5,772 less than Southwest per agent, per year, at top rate.
When you multiply that by the entire passenger service workforce (about 6,000 agents and reps) US Airways will be spending an average of $34.6 Million per year less systemwide than Southwest for passenger service salaries at top rate.
The very large advantage in passenger service employee salaries, along with the concessions made by other US Airways employee groups, should allow US Airways executives to devise a business plan that will defeat Southwest at PHL.
The message: We gave our executives the tools to compete - now it's time to produce a winning business plan!
In future bulletins we will outline the other passenger service benefit and workrule advantages US Airways enjoys over Southwest.

Wouldn't the cost advangate we have be offset by the fact that WN is hiring and constantly has employees at the low end of the scale. US has very few, if any, that are not topped out in mainline ground services. Without a growth plan we are to top heavey at the high end of the payscales with nothing on the bottom to skew the average pay numbers.

 

[wrenchbender]

As of august 2003 a aircrcft mechanic at SWA earns $31.00 per hour plus $4.00 for licenses. Total of $35 per hour with a generous 401k. dollar for dollar match to $5,000 per year. Based on a 40 hour week (2080 hours) thats a total of $72,800 per year.

A mechanic at USAirways earns 24.26 per hour and 2.80 for licenses 27.06 total per hour, Same 40 hour week equals $56,284 per year. USAirways mechanics have a defined pension but is it secure? There is no longer a 2% 401k match.

As far as aircraft maintenance, mechanics at USAirways earn about 16,600
less than thier counterparts at SWA

Mechanic and related also gave back one week vacation per year. If factored into salary equation the figure is more like $18,000 per year.
.
As far as contract maintenance, SWA contracts out about 70 percent and USAirways about 50 percent, these number are from USA Today.
USAirways no longer does any engine overhaul work and many components are outsourced.


The contract at SWA is far more generous that USAirways UAIR should have a competive advantage as far as labor contracts are concerned.

I believe the situation with the Pilots is simular but I don't have the details. I think the
Pilots would gladly swap contracts with SWA.

Bottom line, Its not about labor contracts, it's what management does with them.

References.
http://www.amfalocal18.org/Mechanics%20Contract.pdf
http://www.iam141m.org/usairways4.htm

 

[usfliboi]

Air boi You may ask ! I have 16 years and Ill be happy to tell u since the late eighties esp after the first merger my friend i recieved 3 furlough notices and was displaced three times. You wont find sympathy here but understanding of your point i take to heart . As for my pom poms i dont carry them too often all be it my major in college was buisness and i can tell you from out side yours and my opinion , it all makes sense. I dont like it nor do you but the goal here and slogan should be the needs of the many outway the needs of the few or one. I have just as much if not more than you to lose simply because i have more time energy tears anger involved than you.

 

[USA320Pilot]

W-2, benefits, and retirement are not out of line with the LCC's. The difference is in aircraft, facility, and work force productivity.

For the pilot group and I suspect for most other employees, the plan does not now include W-2 cuts or furloughs.

The plan will include rolling hubs (at least PHL & maybe CLT), a PIT hub similar in scope to CVG (current mainline flight schedule) if a deal can be completed with the ACAA, more point-to-point flying, 60 additional A320 family aircraft with 30 added in 2004 and 2005.

There will be facility and airport consolidation, to lower rental expense. Expect more airport integration with United and a possible corporate transaction at some point in the future, once US Airways stabilizes and if United can emerge.

All work groups will participate with productivity changes to fly dramatically more block hours with the same amount of employees. The intent is to average down the CASM to permit the reduced RASM to return the company to profitability.

The Mainline and MDA trip cost goal 8 and 6 cents, respectively.

Regards,

Chip

 

[700UW]

There will be no concessions from the IAM, can you not understand that?

Here Chip, case you cant understand it let me reiterate it for you:

The Concession Stand is Closed!

To All IAM Members at US Airways:

Dear Sisters and Brothers,

District 141 and 141-M Representatives today met with US Airways at the carrier’s headquarters in Arlington, VA.

CEO David Siegel again spoke about the need to reduce costs, due in part to increased competition from low-cost carriers such as Southwest Airlines and JetBlue. However, Siegel did not make any specific requests to the IAM. It appeared obvious that there is a lack of a strategic plan on the part of US Airways.

While we are willing to discuss plans to permit the carrier to remain a viable employer, the Machinists Union today informed US Airways that we will not enter into any discussions to change the terms of our collective bargaining agreements – the concession stand is closed!

Our members ratified significant cost reductions while the company was in bankruptcy, providing the carrier with the tools needed to return US Airways to profitability. If US Airways’ executives are incapable of successfully running this airline within the framework of our existing collective bargaining agreements, a more capable management team should be employed.

IAM members have made significant sacrifices to save US Airways. The fate of the airline now rests solely in the hands of David Siegel and his management team.

No further discussions are scheduled.

Sincerely and fraternally,


Scotty Ford
President and General Chairman
IAM District 141-M

S.R. (Randy) Canale
President and General Chairman
IAM District 141

 

[USA320Pilot]

700UW:

In my opinion, there will either be contract changes or the airline will bleed to death. In today's market you cannot have a significantly higher number of workers than the LCC's and survive long term.

The company's plan to improve across-the-board productivity and increase block hours to average down unit costs has merit.

For employees the issue is headcount. Management has hinted there will be no pay cuts or large scale furloughs, but they want us to work and fly more to lower unit costs to an acceptable level.

It either happens or the company fails, regardless if we like it or not.

Regards,

Chip

 

[700UW]

There will be no concessions given to thieves and liars.

Let the place shut down then, they can't make it work then so be it.

How come AA, UA, DL and NW are making it?

Dave has no clue.

Hey Chip, hows that pension he took from you guys?

And you still believe in him and trust him.

Guess P.T. Barnum was right.

 

[USA320Pilot]

700UW:

I bet you are wrong. It's easy to pound your chest, until you are faced with filing the unemployment claim and then seeking another job. It will happen, you just wait and see.

Regards,

Chip

 

[700UW]

Been there done that, and we will both make the same amout from unemployment.

Let me ask you this, looking thru a years worth of posts, you were Dave's #1 fan, then he stole your pension and you wanted to shut the place down, and now you are back to his #1 fan.

Personally anyone who has been here has been getting ready for the day when this place shuts down, I will not pay Dave to work here and many people are tired of his lies and deciet, take off the rose colored glasses and give yourself a reality check.

 

[USA320Pilot]

700UW:

My comments are not about being a so called "fan", but instead calling it like I see it in a rapidly changing industry.

In regard to the pension, it's clear you do not understand my third-party comments. Moreover, for me the DC Plan target benefit is acceptable because I will have more than 30 years of employment with about 26 years as a Captain -- thus I am fortunate.

It appears there will be an number of airline DB Plan terminations in 2004 because ALPA R&I says the proposed legislation will not provide enough benefit to restore funding.

As I said before, I believe there will be contract modifications in exchange for mainline growth because people will not vote them self out of a job. Management and most of the rank-and-file employees know this.

Regards,

Chip

 

[USA320Pilot]

700UW:

700UW said: How come AA, UA, DL and NW are making it?

Chip comments: With all due repsect, I believe you are confused.

AA has the lowest legacy carrier pay rates and nearly averted bankruptcy.

United is bankrupt and on Friday the New York Times wrote Robert W. Mann Jr., an industry analyst based in Port Washington, N.Y., said, "I don't see this as a slam dunk at all (obtaining the loan guarantee). I see it as just the opposite," he said. Because United is asking for almost twice as much as US Airways, the loan board could say, "'We have to take a very circumspect view with regard to this big nut in front of us,' " Mr. Mann said.

Separately, the Times said the Justice Department antitrust investigation "cast a cloud over United's application for the federal aid" and the Washington Post commented "United still faces multiple challenges that could make securing loan guarantees difficult."

What happens if United does not obtain a loan guarantee and their application is rejected again?

For Delta, the Atlanta-based airline is losing more money than any other U.S. airline.

Meanwhile, Northwest is lobbying hard for major contract and pension changes and ALPA believes the company could be bankrupt next year.

700UW, with all due respect, did you miss this news and can you tell me exactly how they are making it?

Respectfully,

Chip

 

[700UW]

Chip, wrong

AA, DL, NW and UAL's Ramp, Mechanics, Utility, Customer Service Agents, Cleaners and Res agents make more then US Airways Employees.