Furloughs = Dealbreaker
- Thread starter USAirUnited
- Start date
RowUnderDCA
Veteran
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2002
- Messages
- 2,123
- Reaction score
- 1
Simply, I find the need to deal with a person to conduct your personal business to be a distasteful personality quirk. If I were going to lunch with a work colleague that I didn't know well, and he/she insisted on dealing with a teller to get money for lunch, I would be less likely to seek out this person for future socializing. Some people's preference for dealing with people is just that a preference. It is not better. What is better is to use people for situations that require people and to free up people to do that by using automation.ktflyhome said:
MarkMyWords
Veteran
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 1,900
- Reaction score
- 1
One way that technology has helped US is with the collection of fees. Prior to some of our tech advancements, add collects and excess bag charges were collected hap-hazardly. With advancements in technology, add collects and fees can be collected at the time of ticket changes, versus at the airport. Excess baggage fees can be automatically collected when customers check-in at Kiosks. Machines are much less subjective when it comes to collecting moneys owed.
Not supporting replacing people with maachines, but there are a few benefits there.
Not supporting replacing people with maachines, but there are a few benefits there.
only those who will tolerate higher benefit payments and lower wages will remain until the end.
dave even left the door open to his exit...he said he was WILLING to forgo his golden chute...he didn't say he WOULD .
pay attention....he's BS'ing us.
did you notice he said some things were being considered or they were adding this to the plan???
doesn't this indicate they don't have a plan after all this time??
so lets all ante up and delay the inevitable for a short time.
THESE CLOWNS HAVE NOT A CLUE
dave even left the door open to his exit...he said he was WILLING to forgo his golden chute...he didn't say he WOULD .
pay attention....he's BS'ing us.
did you notice he said some things were being considered or they were adding this to the plan???
doesn't this indicate they don't have a plan after all this time??
so lets all ante up and delay the inevitable for a short time.
THESE CLOWNS HAVE NOT A CLUE
youngblood
Senior
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2004
- Messages
- 373
- Reaction score
- 0
Okay, so you find me distasteful. Quite frankly I find your analogy cold. I am not saying I eliminate automation entirely, but when needed and convenient I would rather deal with a person than a machine. There are benefits to technology. I have never denied that. As a matter of fact, I file my taxes online. What I am saying is that there are also benefits to dealing with people. For example, if I call and make a payment for my gas bill over the phone and speak to a customer service rep, they are taking the information and entering it for payment. I am not. Although this creates more room for human error, I know that if a mistake is made upon entering the data the rep is responsible for said mistake, not me; therefore, I can eliminate late charges or excess fees. I deal with this on a daily basis. People book their own reservations online and make mistakes. They entered the information. If it was my mistake, I would correct it. Since they essentially acted as their own travel agent and we all know a computer does not arbitrarially enter incorrect information, they pay for their mistake.RowUnderDCA said:
Mweiss,
I don't think it's an issue of which generation is discussing the topic at hand. I am only thirty and to a certain degree agree with Pitbull and Oldie. Perhaps it's geological. I live right outside of PIT and the banks are constantly busy from opening to closing.
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
- Messages
- 16,512
- Reaction score
- 5,865
I agree with youngblood. I never go into a bank to just get cash - I use the ATM machine (and changed banks because of the charges the old one levied). However, when I make a deposit, I either go thru the drivethru or go inside. The ATM will give me a receipt but it's just for the amount I typed in. If there's an error later when someone actually totals up the deposit, I really have no way to prove what amount I deposited. However, the teller totals the deposit on the spot and if there is a descrepancy I can resolve it before leaving.
And there's almost nothing I hate more than those voice response systems that go thru several menus of 6-8 choices each. Seems like there's never a choice that matches what I want exactly, so I end up getting the wrong person or department and have to be transfered or start over again. I've gotten to the point that whenever I hear one, I hit "0" just in case that takes me to a live person who can transfer me to the correct person.
Jim
And there's almost nothing I hate more than those voice response systems that go thru several menus of 6-8 choices each. Seems like there's never a choice that matches what I want exactly, so I end up getting the wrong person or department and have to be transfered or start over again. I've gotten to the point that whenever I hear one, I hit "0" just in case that takes me to a live person who can transfer me to the correct person.
Jim
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
- Messages
- 16,512
- Reaction score
- 5,865
Back to the topic...and my guesses about the company's desires only...
ALPA will agree to more furloughs if it comes to that - half the MEC is already running around shouting "The sky is falling, give before it's too late" and I suspect furloughs alone will not result in the membership voting any agreement down (I'm assuming 5% of the active pilot group at most). The other things in the concession package (pay, rigs, higher cap, etc) will carry more weight than any furloughs for most.
AFA will probably be similiar to the pilots - relatively few furloughs (although those returning from VLOA will affect the number unless you can keep that language intact). The changes in pay, benefits, and "options" will be the big things (those "me too" changes in the rigs are a given. I suspect the "standard" option will be 90-95 hours with reduction/elimination of the low options (especially 50-55)
More stations will be "expressed", so I don't know how many furloughs will be in the CSA and ramp ranks. I'm guessing (again) not many - it's not like we're way overstaffed there anyway.
RES, from what I read on here, is already tight on staffing - furloughing would seem counterproductive to me (but what's logic got to do with it). Of course, if more people use the "new & improved" website to book, that could change down the road.
Then there's the IAM. For the mechanics and fleet service, I would expect to see the outsourcing issue be a big part - heavy maintenance for mechanics and a/c cleaning/servicing for fleet service. This could mean major furloughs and is (guessing again) a non-starter with those groups.
Ok, who did I miss?
Jim
ALPA will agree to more furloughs if it comes to that - half the MEC is already running around shouting "The sky is falling, give before it's too late" and I suspect furloughs alone will not result in the membership voting any agreement down (I'm assuming 5% of the active pilot group at most). The other things in the concession package (pay, rigs, higher cap, etc) will carry more weight than any furloughs for most.
AFA will probably be similiar to the pilots - relatively few furloughs (although those returning from VLOA will affect the number unless you can keep that language intact). The changes in pay, benefits, and "options" will be the big things (those "me too" changes in the rigs are a given. I suspect the "standard" option will be 90-95 hours with reduction/elimination of the low options (especially 50-55)
More stations will be "expressed", so I don't know how many furloughs will be in the CSA and ramp ranks. I'm guessing (again) not many - it's not like we're way overstaffed there anyway.
RES, from what I read on here, is already tight on staffing - furloughing would seem counterproductive to me (but what's logic got to do with it). Of course, if more people use the "new & improved" website to book, that could change down the road.
Then there's the IAM. For the mechanics and fleet service, I would expect to see the outsourcing issue be a big part - heavy maintenance for mechanics and a/c cleaning/servicing for fleet service. This could mean major furloughs and is (guessing again) a non-starter with those groups.
Ok, who did I miss?
Jim
Jim: If there were to be a reduction/elimination of the lower options, i.e. 50-55 and even perhaps 75. The Non-option upped to 90-95, then I would presume, especially with the Preferential Bidding to start (whenever) that more furloughes would result. Many more. Right now, as it stands there are very few trips for Reserves. I have flown one 2-day all month!!!!!
But if what you posted earlier this week about the a/c utilization going up a couple hours in a day, I guess this could make a difference. Although from where I am sitting it is all GREEK to me. :huh:
But if what you posted earlier this week about the a/c utilization going up a couple hours in a day, I guess this could make a difference. Although from where I am sitting it is all GREEK to me. :huh:
what happens when and if dave gets stonewalled by one or two of the unions?
does davey run with 4.5 mill or would you think he might do an end around on the unions and take HIS concession package to the rank and file for them to vote on?just like he threatened to do to IAM and they caved and allowed a second vote...or didn't you know that?
does davey run with 4.5 mill or would you think he might do an end around on the unions and take HIS concession package to the rank and file for them to vote on?just like he threatened to do to IAM and they caved and allowed a second vote...or didn't you know that?
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
- Messages
- 16,512
- Reaction score
- 5,865
kt,
I'm assuming that aircraft utilization will go up - to do that under current contracts (pilots & flight attendants) would mean possibly recalling people which I suspect Dave is loathe to do. Much better from his perspective to fly the extra time with the same number of people or less.
dell,
I have no idea what might happen if, for example, the IAM turned down any contract changes. I run out of guesses at that point. I was aware the IAM ended up voting twice before the last concessions passed, though I'll readily admit to not knowing all the ins and outs of what happened in back rooms.
Jim
I'm assuming that aircraft utilization will go up - to do that under current contracts (pilots & flight attendants) would mean possibly recalling people which I suspect Dave is loathe to do. Much better from his perspective to fly the extra time with the same number of people or less.
dell,
I have no idea what might happen if, for example, the IAM turned down any contract changes. I run out of guesses at that point. I was aware the IAM ended up voting twice before the last concessions passed, though I'll readily admit to not knowing all the ins and outs of what happened in back rooms.
Jim
I will be very surprised if there are not more fourloughes coming in the next couple of months. The VF8 was 200. Well, this June over 200 are coming back, which means they will have an excess of 200 again, as I see it.
Right now, the end of the month, 122 Reserves sitting,just alone, in Pit. Blockholders are doing everything they can to get trips. And they should. Everyone should be trying to work as much as possible. I would gather everyone would want to fatten their pocketbooks while they can.
God help me if they decide to railway through and eliminate the MIN. Monthly Guarantee. I have flown one 2-day all month.
The company even offered Vacation Flyback for April, and in light of our uncertain future, I am sure BH's will certainly take advantage of that. As they should, which means even less flying for RSV's. So, I will be very surprised if there are not more Fourloughes forthcoming. <_<
Right now, the end of the month, 122 Reserves sitting,just alone, in Pit. Blockholders are doing everything they can to get trips. And they should. Everyone should be trying to work as much as possible. I would gather everyone would want to fatten their pocketbooks while they can.
God help me if they decide to railway through and eliminate the MIN. Monthly Guarantee. I have flown one 2-day all month.
The company even offered Vacation Flyback for April, and in light of our uncertain future, I am sure BH's will certainly take advantage of that. As they should, which means even less flying for RSV's. So, I will be very surprised if there are not more Fourloughes forthcoming. <_<
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2003
- Messages
- 16,512
- Reaction score
- 5,865
kt,
I knew the reserves were having trouble breaking guarantee, but I didn't realize that so many were flying so little. That puts a dent in my guesses.
As for the VLOA's returning, I frankly don't know what your contract says about offering more VLOA's to offset them. If there are no more VLOA's offered, my guess is looking pretty battered.
Jim
I knew the reserves were having trouble breaking guarantee, but I didn't realize that so many were flying so little. That puts a dent in my guesses.
As for the VLOA's returning, I frankly don't know what your contract says about offering more VLOA's to offset them. If there are no more VLOA's offered, my guess is looking pretty battered.
Jim
