Fll Routes -- How Are The Loads?

[BoeingBoy]

A look at the low cost competition from the NE to Florida....

BOS (FL, B6)
BTV (B6)
BDL (WN)
ALB (WN)
SYR (B6)
ROC (FL, B6)
BUF (FL, B6, WN)
PVD (WN)
ISP (WN)
JFK (B6)
LGA (FL, B6)
EWR (FL)
PHL (FL, WN)
PIT (FL, WN)
CLE (WN)
CMH (WN)
CAK (FL)
DAY (FL)
IAD (FL, B6)
DCA (FL)
BWI (FL, WN)
PHF (FL)
ORF (WN)

All with costs lower than ours, ranging from about 25% lower (FL) to 45% lower (B6).

Jim

 

[tadjr]

A look at the low cost competition from the NE to Florida....

[post="240269"][/post]​

Then where would you suggest we fly our planes? We're running out of country here guys. You dont have to get everyone to fly US, you dont have to have 8-10 flights a day in every market, but we need to be able to give our FFs an alternative on US if its even remotely possible so they dont head over to the other guys. Look at a B6 schedule in many markets. They offer 2-4 flights a day max into the hub (JFK), not every hour. Look at WN, they offer 1-4 flights in a lot of markets that you'd think, how can they do that in those city pairs? Obviously they not only carry enough local traffic, but can offer some connections in cities that arent considered true hubs in addition to through traffic onto the next city. Why couldnt we make minihubs scheduling with O&D traffic and if the connections are there thats a bonus. I thought this was what they had planned for PIT with a focus city.

Looking at the latest WN schedule I can find handy (6/03) they offer conx in BWI/LAS/AUS/MCO/MDW/RNO/DAL/ELP/PHX/HOU/STL/AMA/LBB/TPA/MCI/LAX/
ONT/SAN/BUR/MSY AND...AND get this, that is just from looking at the schedule from the first 3 cities in the timetable, Albany, Albequerque and Amarillo.

Now look at a US schedule and you see CLT/DCA/PIT/LGA/BOS/FLL and thats it for almost ALL cities unless you include the MCI Air Midwest ops or some other weird commuter connection. Otherwise its the 6 or nothing and LGA and BOS are mainly to Express flights only (and then only from the other hub cities or 1 stops) and FLL is to the new markets. Where is US on the rest? Why cant we schedule a MCO-CMH-BOS flight that just happens to connect in CMH to a FLL-CMH-MKE flight? (Just picked some cities as examples). Look at all the cities that USED to be big for US and then start there.
IND/CMH/DAY/SYR/BUF/CLE/GSO/RDU/ORF/ROC/BDL.... it isnt working the way it is now, so why not TRY something else? IF WN can make some of these city pairs work, why cant US when the alternative is 10 flights a day into CONGESTED PHL?

It doesnt matter if we have 0 nonstops to the others 10, we still are competing against them on price, only we are doing double the work with 2 flights, 2 loading, 2 unloading bags, 2 agents to have to work them at the gates, etc. How productive is that?

 

[BoeingBoy]

tadjr,

You've covered the quandry we find ourselves in pretty well. Unfortunately, I don't have the answer. It'll come as no surprise when I say that I think the only thing we have plenty of is "outta's".

We're outta money.

We're outta time.

We're almost outta places to run.

The point 2 point offers benefits - most realize that. Lower costs all around. The question is can we survive in that battlefield long enough to reap any rewards. To do that, lower unit costs are crucial, but adding RJ's and subtracting Boeings and Airbuses is counterproductive - unless the bigger RJ's are replacements for the smaller ones. It's somewhat ironic that nearly all of the LCC's the company uses for cost comparisons have no RJ's - Frontier being the exception.

Jim

 

[FlyUs]

US Airways is too late on the BOS/LGA-florida market. Jetblue alone has over 24 daily flts between NYC-FLL. It's very tough for US to compete against that. On top of the that Song and American both have some flts from LGA/BOS-Florida. Those routes are essentially maxed out and a lonely 1x weekly US flt from BOS-MCO isn't going to get much attraction when its up against several daily Song and Jetblue flts

[post="240261"][/post]​

It's not like we can't fill the airplane. Flight 1181 BOS-MCO is full every Saturday. I remember when I counted 24 non-stop flights from BOS-MCO one Saturday in the early 90s. Most of them were charter flights on the dc-9 but they were all full. I do think Boston is one of the cities we have left where we should be able to take advantage of our position. We have 21 gates, a fairly modern terminal and there are no perimeter rules to restrict flying. I'm sure JetBlue would expand like crazy if they had the gate space. Actually, they are expanding in BOS with additional frequencies to the west coast. Rumor has it they will start BOS-SJU this spring.

 

[tadjr]

Unfortunately, I don't have the answer. Jim

[post="240286"][/post]​

Well then why are we paying you the big bucks?

Maybe someone in CCY with actual numbers available to crunch and a computer program to do the crunching should be able to figure this out? Nah, didnt think so either. :down:

 

[NeedForSpeed]

VOTE NO IS EASIEST WAY

[post="240179"][/post]​

Vote yourself out of a job!!!! :down:

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Where you start is take your assets: gates, planes, slots, employees and a ff base. Look at where these are concentrated in the NE: DCA, PHL, PIT, LGA, BOS

THEN FLY THE TENS OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE who live near these airports to where THEY want to go. A little less to places where you make less money (and offer some connections) and little bit more to places where you make more money. THEN think about CMH, IND and DAY and BUF.

Ditch the strategy of exercising monopoly power by flying folks from ROC, BTV and SYR where they'd kind of like to go, in exchange for friendly congress people and political protection and ditch the strategy of isolating business flyers and targetting them like some kind of survivor island punishment racket.

Seems to me that that's a big enough bite, considering you're going to have to do what Seigel said was too painful...... turn into an LCC on the backs of employees wages.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Well then why are we paying you the big bucks?

[post="240298"][/post]​

Heck, I thought that the formula worked that way around here - pay inversely proportional to answers.....

Jim

 

[Hope777]

Tad, maybe shortly we will see additional flights from the cities you listed. Just as soon as the ramp work is contracted out.