FA Deal

[MiAAmi]

I said it once and I''ll say it again no airline has done better in BK court.. One exception - TWA was the only airline to get a raise after they declared BK. But look were they are.

 

[L1011Ret]

In reply to MiAAmi, Like Who?, those who are about to be furloughed May 1 and losing their furlough pay. And perhaps others who will follow soon after with no furlough pay.

 

[MiAAmi]

Are you willing to sacrifice the entire airline and all its employees over furlough pay?

 

[spacewaitress]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 139 PM MiAAmi wrote:

Are you willing to sacrifice the entire airline and all its employees over furlough pay?

----------------​

If I was a TWAr I would. You guys really screwed them...royally.

 

[FA Mikey]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 3:12:03 PM spacewaitress wrote:

----------------
On 4/5/2003 139 PM MiAAmi wrote:

Are you willing to sacrifice the entire airline and all its employees over furlough pay?

----------------​

If I was a TWAr I would. You guys really screwed them...royally.


----------------​

Two things for you to think about. One TWANR is not an employee of American or AMR. Two the responsibility of a union is to protect there dues paying members jobs, pay and working conditions. If you want to offer your seniority up for someone be my guest. I do remember the grumbling and the UAL, F/A''s looking for ways to protect themselves in a U/UAL merger.

 

[TWAnr]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 3:30:31 PM FA Mikey wrote:

----------------
On 4/5/2003 3:12:03 PM spacewaitress wrote:

----------------
On 4/5/2003 139 PM MiAAmi wrote:

Are you willing to sacrifice the entire airline and all its employees over furlough pay?

----------------​

If I was a TWAr I would. You guys really screwed them...royally.


----------------​

Two things for you to think about. One TWANR is not an employee of American or AMR. Two the responsibility of a union is to protect there dues paying members jobs, pay and working conditions. If you want to offer your seniority up for someone be my guest. I do remember the grumbling and the UAL, F/A''s looking for ways to protect themselves in a U/UAL merger.

----------------​

First of all, the poster was not referring to me. He was referring to any TWA person. He wrote TWA[color=" red"]r[/color] not TWA[color=" red"]nr[/color], which in the context of his comment is clearly meant to be TWA[color=" red"]er[/color].

Secondly, you write: "the responsibility of a union is to protect there (sic) dues paying members jobs, pay and working conditions." This is exactly what the union is NOT doing. The leadership elected to support the haves at the expense of the have nots. Taking away furlough pay from the junior flight attendants, who are bound to be furloughed en mass with the massive return of those on overage leaves, after that program was gutted, is about as amoral and despicable an act as I can think of.

Thirdly, if you want only employees to partake in your debate, confine it to the APFA Bulletin Boards and the members’ only sites such as 4M. You many not understand the concept of marriage. It is a complete partnership. I have a stake in the outcome of this debate and you are not going to shut me up. I will fight for my wife and her colleagues until my last breath. I fight for the underdog for a living. Not everyone is as selfish as you are.

 

[spacewaitress]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 3:30:31 PM FA Mikey wrote:
I do remember the grumbling and the UAL, F/A''s looking for ways to protect themselves in a U/UAL merger.

----------------​

There was grumbling, but that''s as far as it went. The fact was, and is still, both are AFA carriers and would have merged seniority - and may still for that matter.

I understood that TWA was bought by AA and the flight attendants became APFA members.

And TWANR is correct...I was speaking of former TWA employees. Do you say that they will not be able to vote on this contract that they will be working under as well?

 

[spacewaitress]

To FA Mikey,

I was with some TWA crew (pilots and FAs) on a hotel crew bus this morning. 2 of the gals had 32 years and will end up with nothing because of what apparently your union has done for them.

Your attitude really is aloof concerning their plight. I wonder how you will feel when it comes back to visit you, and it will. Hopefully when it does you will have the awareness to connect the dots. You might learn something then.

I must say the pilots were more upset for them than these gals seemed to be for themselves. They were real class acts. I daresay with their attitudes they'll do just fine. It is disheartening to see the injustice though.

 

[MiAAmi]

Save it for the courts.

 

[MiAAmi]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 3:12:03 PM spacewaitress wrote:

----------------
On 4/5/2003 139 PM MiAAmi wrote:

Are you willing to sacrifice the entire airline and all its employees over furlough pay?

----------------​

If I was a TWAr I would. You guys really screwed them...royally.


----------------​

Well space girl I guess getting a raise after your company has declared bankruptcy is really taking the screws. And if that is justification for voting no then I hope you don''t work for AA. Your value system is a little warped.

 

[FA Mikey]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 6:28:08 PM spacewaitress wrote:



I understood that TWA was bought by AA and the flight attendants became APFA members.

----------------​

Well, AA purchased the assets of bankrupt TWA and offered employment to its 20,000 employees. TW became part of AA on April 10, 2001. When the NMB ruled the singe carrier status in terms of representation. At that point they were offered membership in the APFA.

----------------
On 4/5/2003 6:28:08 PM spacewaitress wrote:

And TWANR is correct...I was speaking of former TWA employees. Do you say that they will not be able to vote on this contract that they will be working under as well?

----------------​

Yes, they will not be able to vote on the contract. But they can vote on the tentative agreement to amend the current contract. In fact every dues current member is eligible to vote.

 

[Fly]

The PanAm flight attendants merged into UAL as well. Not bottom of the list, merged seniorities.

 

[FA Mikey]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 1057 PM twaokc wrote:

FA Mikey


Mike,

I know this is one that we disagree on, but the ozark employees were merged into TWA without one day loss of senority. AA''s non-union so-called unions are the only unions that have done what was done to the TWA employees..

----------------​

I agree this is the area where we disagree. I will say though, That DOH was not the first call by the IFFA at the time. Ulimitly though they gave it to Ichan, and what he wanted.

 

[FA Mikey]

----------------
On 4/5/2003 6:40:30 PM spacewaitress wrote:

To FA Mikey,

I was with some TWA crew (pilots and FAs) on a hotel crew bus this morning. 2 of the gals had 32 years and will end up with nothing because of what apparently your union has done for them.

Your attitude really is aloof concerning their plight. I wonder how you will feel when it comes back to visit you, and it will. Hopefully when it does you will have the awareness to connect the dots. You might learn something then.

I must say the pilots were more upset for them than these gals seemed to be for themselves. They were real class acts. I daresay with their attitudes they''ll do just fine. It is disheartening to see the injustice though.

----------------​

A few corrections. The gals as you call them had 2 years at AA and 30 at TW. There is a difference. I disagree they dont end up with nothing. What they lose in the TA is 2 months furlough pay. Nothing else in terms of a possible furlough.

I just love how these sanctimonious holier than thou people who have or had absolutely nothing to lose in the deal between AA and TW. Tell us about how bad we all are and how they are so much better. How they THINK or try to believe that''s how they would have done it, at their airline. Until you forced to face it head on, until you face a real loss in the situation. Your opinion is just that, an opinion, weightless and of no bearing. You have no idea of the impact or how you will act or react, until you are faced with it.

 

[twaokc]

FA Mikey


Mike,

I know this is one that we disagree on, but the ozark employees were merged into TWA without one day loss of senority. AA''s non-union so-called unions are the only unions that have done what was done to the TWA employees..