Disgruntled Employees

Maybe we should get all the Disgruntled employees at AA...US...UA to get to gether and run their own airline. With unlimited pay unlimited benifits...unlimited ot...unlimited time off unlimited holidays and see how much money they make and how long they last.

We could call is UBA...Union Brotherhood Airline.
We love to cry and it shows

 

[Busdrvr]

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On 5/12/2003 10:42:04 AM A77IGW wrote:

Maybe we should get all the Disgruntled employees at AA...US...UA to get to gether and run their own airline. With unlimited pay unlimited benifits...unlimited ot...unlimited time off unlimited holidays and see how much money they make and how long they last.

We could call is UBA...Union Brotherhood Airline.
We love to cry and it shows

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Yeah, that''s pretty funny, pretty ignorant, but funny. The WSJ had a letter published from a AMR 767 F/O. the guy was an Ex-Navy fighter pilot, who had spent much of his younger days fighting for your freedom and gaining experience to be an airline pilot. he now flies a 100 million dollar airplane (200 pax) to points around the world, safely and on time, and is based in the San fran area. He makes LESS than a San Fran BUS DRIVER and his take home pay his roughly HALF what a naval officer of his age and experience makes (and we all KNOW those folks in the mil are overpaid). So I guess that''s "unlimited" to you? Mechanics are paid even less to keep these technological marvels operating safety. Truely pathetic post. May you be blessed to expeience only the level of competance you are willing to pay for...just as Paul Wellstone did.

Ignorance is Bliss

 

[Mach85ER]

We only have gruntled employees at AA.

 

[mrman]

<
Yeah, that''s pretty funny, pretty ignorant, but funny. The WSJ had a letter published from a AMR 767 F/O. the guy was an Ex-Navy fighter pilot, who had spent much of his younger days fighting for your freedom and gaining experience to be an airline pilot. he now flies a 100 million dollar airplane (200 pax) to points around the world, safely and on time, and is based in the San fran area. He makes LESS than a San Fran BUS DRIVER and his take home pay his roughly HALF what a naval officer of his age and experience makes (and we all KNOW those folks in the mil are overpaid). So I guess that''s "unlimited" to you? Mechanics are paid even less to keep these technological marvels operating safety. Truely pathetic post. May you be blessed to expeience only the level of competance you are willing to pay for...just as Paul Wellstone did.

Ignorance is Bliss

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But as long as there is a huge supply of qualified pilots looking for jobs, wouldn''t the market bear lower costs. Seems the problem maybe too many pilots, hence driving the cost down. The question to ask is if the said pilot quit, would there not be a line of qualified people clammering for his job

 

[Busdrvr]

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On 5/12/2003 11:55:34 AM mrman wrote:

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But as long as there is a huge supply of qualified pilots looking for jobs, wouldn''t the market bear lower costs. Seems the problem maybe too many pilots, hence driving the cost down. The question to ask is if the said pilot quit, would there not be a line of qualified people clammering for his job

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You are 100% correct. The rub, however, is your use of the word "qualified" A 300 hour monkey in "qualified" to sit in the right seat (See Gulf Air''s most recent crash), and a 23 YO 1500 hour HS dropout is "qualified" to sit in the left seat. Is that who you want flying your family? who do you think will quit the industry? the 40 something YO annapolis or AFA grad with his masters and considerable management experience (read marketable) or the 300 hour monkey? the 300 hour monkey would likely be willing to do it for the free hotel room in Maui. Paul wellstones flight crew was "qualified"...up until they killed him. The pilot groups (and IAM for that matter) are somewhat responsible for the current situation. I would prob have been in our favor had we had a less advisarial relationship with the companies and actual made makerting efforts ourselves in pointing out to the public just which airlines hire the "best of the best". the consumer will pay will pay a premium for a Wendy''s single over somebody elses burger, but doesn''t understand that he needs to pay a premium in airtravel to get the best.


Ignorance is Bliss

 

[Wild Onion]

Supply and Demand. There are too many pilots out there flying too few passengers. No on is entitled to a dime more than what the free market will bear.

Is flying a commerical airplane a big responsiblity? Yes, but so is school crossing guard.

Maybe the guy in the article should go drive the bus. I''d take any job that paid me double what I currently make.

 

[bagsmasher]

Or maybe AA should start treating their employees like assets rather than liabilities. Southwest seems to be doing an excellent job in this area. AA on the other hand is a "disgruntled employee machine" cranking out more and more every year.

 

[Segue]

Everybody makes their own choice when choosing a career. The big mistake is to think that the airline business, or any industry for that matter, will continue to produce consistent, year over year growth in wages. If you really love your job, then take thanks in that and get on with your life. If you got into aviation with the expectation of making the big bucks, well I think the ride is over.

 

[Busdrvr]

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On 5/12/2003 2:16:52 PM Segue wrote:

There are lots of folks now in all sorts of industries making less than they were two years, five years, even ten years ago. Heck, many don''t even have jobs!!


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Really!! NAME THEM! Especially the ones that require 15 years experience for an entry level position, and the ones that have laid of nearly 10% industry wide in the last two years. Pretty sickening to see posts like "Wild Onions" that seem to revel in the damage done to our industry from TERRORISM.

 

[Busdrvr]

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On 5/12/2003 12:27:25 PM Wild Onion wrote:

Supply and Demand. There are too many pilots out there flying too few passengers. No on is entitled to a dime more than what the free market will bear.

Is flying a commerical airplane a big responsiblity? Yes, but so is school crossing guard.

Maybe the guy in the article should go drive the bus. I''d take any job that paid me double what I currently make.



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RTFP, He reported that "Bus Driver" paid more, not double. Give me a MFin break on your ludicrous "crossing guard" analogy. BTW, what do YOU do? what does that job pay in CUBA? Mexico? Why shouldn''t the US allow those folks to come into the country and do YOU job for a fraction of the cost? As for the free market, in aviation I may have to pay the price for YOUR cheap @ss. What if Wellstones incompetant flight crew had hit somebodies home? What if the vendor installed wheel that came off a SWA jet at 150 miles per hour in Burbank had hit a family''s minivan traveling near the conjested airport? Do you realize that had it not been for a remarkable effort by a UAL flight crew in avoiding "free market wages" Mexicana jet that mistakenly entered an active runway at LAX, there''d be two less Sen Doles on this planet (liddy and bob were on board the UAL flight. There is curently an excess of a completely perishable product. That product will be dumped until that excess capacity goes away. the empoyees will pay the price and subsidize your travel. that will not last forever. Ticket prices WILL go up and you WILL lose service to places that used to enjoy the perks of the 20th century, and you can blissful exclaim your uninformed views on "free market economics" while you wait in the airport for the one flight 3 hours later that "free market rolling hubs" bought you.

Ignorance is Bliss.
P.S. I guess you oppose the minimum wage to huh?

 

[Busdrvr]

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On 5/12/2003 127 PM Segue wrote:

The big mistake is to think that the airline business, or any industry for that matter, will continue to produce consistent, year over year growth in wages. If you really love your job, then take thanks in that and get on with your life. If you got into aviation with the expectation of making the big bucks, well I think the ride is over.

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Is it a big mistake to think your wages should keep track with inflation? especially when you become more productive year after year? How about just wanting the same dollar amount (unadjusted for inflation) that you made 10 years ago? This isn''t a career you decide you want on monday and start on tuesday. the average mainline airline pilot got hired on with over 15 years of experience and in his late 30''s. it will be a while before the effect of collapsing wages takes it''s toll on safety, but you''ve got to be one blissful person to think it won''t

Ignorance is Bliss

 

[Segue]

Some from my personal aqaintences. Both over different time frames.

1) Computer programmer (dotcom bust)
2) Medical doctor (managed healthcare)
3) Steel worker (lost job due to overseas competition)
4) Middle level manager (reorganization)
5) Management consultant (slowdown in business)

I''ve got more, but get the picture?

Keep yourself diversitfied. Develop multiple skill sets. Move to another industry if you can.

 

[Busdrvr]

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On 5/12/2003 2:32:32 PM Segue wrote:

Some from my personal aqaintences. Both over different time frames.

1) Computer programmer (dotcom bust)
2) Medical doctor (managed healthcare)
3) Steel worker (lost job due to overseas competition)
4) Middle level manager (reorganization)
5) Management consultant (slowdown in business)

I''ve got more, but get the picture?

Keep yourself diversitfied. Develop multiple skill sets. Move to another industry if you can.

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So 10% of those guys have lost thier jobs in the last 2 years and they now make about what they made 10 years ago (we''re closer to what we made 20 years ago) recheck your math. about the only one even close is steelworker and even the republican whitehouse was willing to put in protectionist measures on their behalf.

 

[Segue]

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On 5/12/2003 1:59:46 PM Busdrvr wrote:

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On 5/12/2003 127 PM Segue wrote:

The big mistake is to think that the airline business, or any industry for that matter, will continue to produce consistent, year over year growth in wages. If you really love your job, then take thanks in that and get on with your life. If you got into aviation with the expectation of making the big bucks, well I think the ride is over.

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Is it a big mistake to think your wages should keep track with inflation? especially when you become more productive year after year? How about just wanting the same dollar amount (unadjusted for inflation) that you made 10 years ago? This isn''t a career you decide you want on monday and start on tuesday. the average mainline airline pilot got hired on with over 15 years of experience and in his late 30''s. it will be a while before the effect of collapsing wages takes it''s toll on safety, but you''ve got to be one blissful person to think it won''t

Ignorance is Bliss


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There are lots of folks now in all sorts of industries making less than they were two years, five years, even ten years ago. Heck, many don''t even have jobs!!

 

[KCFlyer]

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On 5/12/2003 1:54:42 PM Busdrvr wrote:

Do you realize that had it not been for a remarkable effort by a UAL flight crew in avoiding "free market wages" Mexicana jet that mistakenly entered an active runway at LAX, there''d be two less Sen Doles on this planet (liddy and bob were on board the UAL flight.

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Couldn''t help but respond, but if Bob Dole had his druthers, he''d have been on an ADM Gulfstream piloted by those "Wellstone wannabes".