Glad you want to keep the conversation going, Dawg. Gives me more opportunities to reinforce my points…..
No, Dawg, it isn’t about unions vs. non-unions. It is about companies that are well-run and have the labor flexibility to achieve the corporate goals. DL has it but so does WN…. Your desire to want to omit WN from the conversation is specifically because you don’t want to admit that unions aren’t the answer. Well run companies are. DL and WN share good mgmt and labor flexibility. That is why they both continue to find opportunities to grow their businesses at the expense of other carriers but don’t beat up on each other, managing to live peacefully side by side and focusing their competitive efforts against other carriers.
BK laws were just reformed… AA is restructuring under the new rules. But the ability to extract from labor in BK hasn’t really changed…. That’s why AA’s labor is rightfully upset.
You meant to say that for topped out DL employees, vacation accumulation isn’t as rich but for many DL low and medium seniority employees, time off benefits are as good as or better than for employees at other airlines. Yet DL has offered one voluntary package after another including many – and the most recent – with retiree medical assistance. If benefits are so bad at the end of your career, then take a package and double dip… many senior employees have done this… Part of the reason why unions haven’t won the vote is because DL is able to allow many of those who don’t like the current situation to get out and for the vast majority of employees, the few differences you highlight aren’t there.
But you also fail to note that all of those salary differences you highlight vaporize when you factor in profit sharing which is almost certain to be much higher for DL mechanics this year than for UA employees. Add in that UA will be forced to dramatically increase pay for its pilots or face revolt again and the amount of money for profit sharing at UA will drop even more. Those are just economic realities.
People like Kev have said they want more money in their pocket NOW and less at risk in profit sharing. That’s why DL changed it. And there will still be healthy profit sharing payouts even under the 2013 levels which are on par with other carriers.
You continue to focus on a false dichotomy between DL and PMNW employees and hubs that doesn’t exist. DL doesn’t have two sets of employees… all employees are free to bid on other jobs throughout the system in search of the best opportunities.
But just to use your dichotomy, DL has treated PMDL hubs and PMNW hubs the same…. Capacity has moved around the system from all hubs BUT full-time employees have been given the opportunity to transfer or if they choose not to do so, to accept voluntary packages. That is no different than it has been w/ DL since the time when your great-great-grandfather worked for DL.
And since you pride yourself in coming from a line with 27 generations of DL employees J then you know that DL has long used flexible staffing models. RR might be a newer name but the concept is well established at DL. You do know the reason why 30K DL employees decided to buy
The Spirit of Delta, don’t you?
…and that brings us to the point that you continue to perpetuate the union-driven myth that it is necessary to protect future jobs even though it is obvious that that strategy actually results in greater cuts to existing jobs. Unionized companies don’t want to be saddled with long-term commitments they can’t keep which is why BK has been so hard on unionized airlines = and why DL employees have fared better.
Yes, DL uses flexible staffing models to reduce costs – but they still manage to protect more CURRENT jobs than union-based models which try to keep CURRENT and FUTURE FT jobs but with the result that BOTH get cut.
DL reduces future FT jobs while doing a better job of protecting CURRENT FT jobs…
Your DL peers understand that…..
Finally, let me counter your notion that this is a union vs. non-union debate.
Your DL pilot colleagues voted to increase the amount of large RJs but got pay raises which make them the best paid pilots among legacy carriers… and topping WN scales for DL pilots on widebody aircraft.
While many pilots at other carriers chastise DL pilots for agreeing to the additional outsourcing of large aircraft, DL pilots were able to see that they have given the company to reduce the amount of costly small RJ flying while gaining access to large RJs which offer better passenger amenities.
The results are obvious from traffic results which you can see right here.
http://finance.yahoo...-130000580.html
DL has reduced its capacity throughout its system via Delta connection while keeping DL mainline flying much more stable. Note that in the month of Sept, DCI capacity was down 10% while DL mainline flying was practically flat – and the trend is there for the whole year.
With the arrival of the 739s and 717s, DL will be trimming even more regional carrier capacity…. Look at other carriers and it will be obvious they are not protecting mainline jobs while trimming their regional carrier capacity – in fact they are doing just the opposite.
It is precisely because other carriers use relaxed scope to reduce work for DL employees that unions fear the loss of jobs… yet DL employees, who have “no scope” as Kevin is keen to note, or the pilots who are unionized but have given up more scope, fare better than their peers at airlines that have fought to “hold the line on scope” only to end up losing more than their peers at DL.
You continue to want to ignore the work that DL employees have gained thru insourcing including via reduced DCI flying and through insourced maintenance, focusing instead on the jobs that have been outsourced.
Your DL colleagues continue to be able to see both sides of the equation which is why they don’t buy the false dichotomy you try to create, esp. since they realize that “losing” one thing at DL has come w/ gaining something else.
We don’t live in a perfect world. There are tradeoffs. It would be great if DL could do airframe overhauls AND insource engine work; it would be wonderful if DL could keep all the DCI employees on the payroll AND protect mainline flying… but the world is full of tradeoffs and your colleagues are smart enough to be able to weigh the options and choose what is best for them – which means increasing their pay and protecting their jobs in total better than at other carriers, including DCI carriers.
THAT Is why the majority of DL employees continue to not be interested in union representation. Even if 40% of employees want a union, the magic number is a simple majority and not one of the large non-unionized groups – mechanics, ACS, in-flight, res – have yet to achieve that simple majority to gain representation.
I’m still waiting for your numbers on:
1. The number of jobs other airlines have added since BK
2. The pay increases those carriers have given their employees post BK compared to pay raises by DL employees.
3. The number of maintenance employees at other airlines vs. at DL.
and you can add the number of cuts at other airlines in BK vs. at DL. When you come up w/ those numbers, you'll see why your list of questions is meaningless because it focuses only on what has been lost at DL withouth considering what has been gained AND it doesn't speak to the cuts at other airlines which have been far larger.
Cheers.
