Dec 2012 / Jan 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[nic4us]

Obviously reading comprehension is not one of your strengths.
From the MOU:

h. US Airways agrees that neither this Memorandum nor the JCBA shall provide a basis for
changing the seniority lists currently in effect at US Airways other than through the process set forth in
this Paragraph 10.
And what are the seniority lists currently in effect????
Did I hear you say, "...not the Nic..."???

The Nic is in effect at LCC. It is the only system seniority list for use of combined ops, unless and until uscaba can find a LUP and change it,,,and get it into a ratified JCBA prior to any merger, while at the same time avoiding an injunction against that JCBA from the West and AOL for changing it in the first place.

What you quoted says tha the MOU does not trigger the Nic,,,,,,Cleardirect was wrong on that part, however, it remains to be seen whether an MTA would trigger the Nic, and for certain he Nic is not going away and will be considered once we reach an AMR/LCC SLI.

 

[traderjake]

CLT RECALL UPDATE #2​

Dear Fellow Pilots:

As USAPA members in good standing since inception, we would appreciate some of your time to explain why you should vote to recall our CLT Reps. In just 60 days, together with a cross section of over 400 of your peers, we initiated, and they signed, a petition for the recall.

This election is about the future, and is a choice for the CLT based pilots to decide between electing new leadership that is proactive, unifying, inclusive and respectful of their constituents, fellow BPR members/Officers, Advisors and adversaries, or the status quo. Respectfully, we do not question their dedication or hard work, but a leadership style that transcends bargaining agents and is too often divisive, disrespectful, and lacking in good judgement as exemplified by:

• Filing charges alleging multiple election violations which were all dismissed by the Dept Of Labor at a cost of $50,000 to the Union.
  

• In the runoff election, their suggesting a vote for the West candidate in order to have him recalled and replaced by Bill McKee.
  

• Attempting to partner with a PHX resolution to recall our Union President, which failed.
  

• Threatening to violate the terms of the NDA (their 1/19/13 email to USAPA and USAirways)
• Rather than respecting differing opinions, they malign and cast their constituents into ‘Teams’.
• Their Domicile updates which were used as evidence in a Judge Conrad’s decision to place an injunction on the USAirways pilots for an alleged slowdown.
• Inability to accept the will of the majority following the election of our Union President by;
• Disrespectful behavior, including walking out of meetings, towards invited guests such as Hegland (Teamsters), Butler (UCC), Parker and others.
• Continuing their history of ignoring the advice of our Professional Negotiators.
• Rather than moving forward in Unity following the unanimous MOU vote, and acknowledging the hard work of all parties involved, they sought credit while maligning their fellow BPR members and Officers - Steve Crimi email 1/10/13 “Some BPR Reps are going to try and take credit for certain things when in fact they deserve blame for their cowardice and their enabling of a treacherous President”.
  

We appreciate a ‘fighting’ spirit and agree that healthy debate is productive as long as it results in consensus to move forward in unity, but, as our Reps have demonstrated again and again, whether it is an election, Safety Culture survey, MOU or any other Union debate, their behavior is often divisive, disrespectful, does not represent the leadership qualities we expect, and does not abide by the Code of Ethics as outlined in our Constitution.

This is an exciting time for our pilot group, a new beginning and tipping point that will in part be governed by your vote. As a USAPA pilot you now have the right to effect change from the ground up. More than 400 of your peers are exercising this right. We ask that you consider the facts and help make a difference so that we can all have the futures we deserve. We ask that you vote for the Recall of our Reps. https://www.BallotPoint.com/USAPA/

Sincerely,
Tom McGuirk
CLT AB Capt
Mike Bake
CLT AB F/O

Campaign messages are not union-endorsed or paid for with union funds.

 

[Bill Brasky]

The Nic is in effect at LCC. It is the only system seniority list for use of combined ops, unless and until uscaba can find a LUP and change it,,,and get it into a ratified JCBA prior to any merger, while at the same time avoiding an injunction against that JCBA from the West and AOL for changing it in the first place.

What you quoted says tha the MOU does not trigger the Nic,,,,,,Cleardirect was wrong on that part, however, it remains to be seen whether an MTA would trigger the Nic, and for certain he Nic is not going away and will be considered once we reach an AMR/LCC SLI.

Wrong again on all counts. Get real. Stop dreaming out loud. The Nic is an ALPA fabrication. Won't be back unless ALPA returns to the property before a combined contract or SLI. Doug AND Scott have told you that the Nic is dead numerous times and you fail to listen. Get the crap out of your ears.

 

[nic4us]

WHO? SEEHAM NOT EMPLOYED BY USAPA


MOU, IF RATIFIED, ALL PARTIES AGREE TO SET ASIDE PREVIOUS AGREEMENTS.

Yes, Seeham is no longer employed by uscaba, but he is $10 million rich thanks to you crybabies. He did a bang up job though, got you the wonderful ruling from the 9th that warned of the "pain of an unquestionably ripe DFR" if you ever get a non-Nic list ratified.

MOU, IF RATIFIED....best read that again...it is not until the MTA is "fully implemented" that prior agreements and the current status quo are rendered a nullity.

 

[767one]

767one
Are you done with flying? Or do you miss any of it? I read an interesting article about the high demand for pilots in China. This year Bejing will eclipse ATL as the busiest airport in the world. You can take the man out of the 767, but you can't take the 767 out of the man.

Pi brat

Good to hear from you. Perhaps we need to start a petition to have the MOU re-written in plain English, no lawyerspeak, even a caveman can understand.

Yep! All done with flying of any sort. I have had a standing job offer which I declined for personal/family reasons. 49 years 6 mo. of flying and just shy of 40 with the airline....stick me with a fork I am done!

I miss flying a little bit but less each day. Do I miss the airline....not so much. I sure as hell miss all the fine people that I've worked with over the years and wish nothing but the best for all of you.

Regards,

Bob

 

[nic4us]

Wrong again on all counts. Get real. Stop dreaming out loud. The Nic is an ALPA fabrication. Won't be back unless ALPA returns to the property before a combined contract or SLI. Doug AND Scott have told you that the Nic is dead nemerous times and you fail to listen. Get the crap out of your ears.

The Nic is not an ALPA fabrication....go look it up.

It is not between ALPA and the company. Or east ALPA v. west ALPA.

The Nic is between the pilots in the service of AAA and the pilots in the service of AWA, regardless of who represents us.

The Nic is between you and me,,,and guess what,,, I am collecting on our agreement.


Doug and Scott have never said the Nic is "dead". Quite contrary they have affirmed that the only "accepted system seniority list at LCC" is the Nic. Further, they have gone to court, and are now appealing Silver's ruling, because they do not want the liability your scab union has brought upon them!

Get it yet? There is a reason it is called "BINDING ARBITRATION"!

 

[nic4us]

I sure as hell miss all the fine people that I've worked with over the years and wish nothing but the best for all of you.

Regards,

Bob

Do not worry about that, we will take it from here and make sure they get what is coming to them!

 

[Piedmont1984]

Yep! All done with flying of any sort. I have had a standing job offer which I declined for personal/family reasons. 49 years 6 mo. of flying and just shy of 40 with the airline....stick me with a fork I am done!

I miss flying a little bit but less each day. Do I miss the airline....not so much. I sure as hell miss all the fine people that I've worked with over the years and wish nothing but the best for all of you.

Regards,

Bob

Happy trails then, hope there's a fish on every hook you cast.

KV

 

[Pi brat]

Yep! All done with flying of any sort. I have had a standing job offer which I declined for personal/family reasons. 49 years 6 mo. of flying and just shy of 40 with the airline....stick me with a fork I am done!

I miss flying a little bit but less each day. Do I miss the airline....not so much. I sure as hell miss all the fine people that I've worked with over the years and wish nothing but the best for all of you.

Regards,

Bob

Enjoy Bob! Best to you and your family.

 

[dca319]

If the MOU is voted in, the trigger is BK judge approval of POR with merger.

The "lists" are simply the data both AA and US have on its pilot employees. TWO lists.

All prior agreements/status quo are nul and void....PERIOD.

In thought we get the new pay rates as soon as we vote in the MOU, do we not? So that means you're wrong in that a POR triggers the MOU - it doesn't.

Secondly, per Szymanski, there will be three lists because on our side we currently operate ith two lists. Take the west guys who went east and are on the bottom. Your guess means they're put under new hires does it not? So stop making these invalid points as they're completely wrong. USAPA will submit two lists and then submit an integration method based on those two lists and APAs list.
As for the arbitrators. you're naive. Those guys are tight with each other and just as on any industry, they won't undercut one of their own. And the precedence it would send would rock the foundation of arbitration. I find it hard to believe anyone could simply brush that off.

 

[dca319]

Wrong again on all counts. Get real. Stop dreaming out loud. The Nic is an ALPA fabrication. Won't be back unless ALPA returns to the property before a combined contract or SLI. Doug AND Scott have told you that the Nic is dead numerous times and you fail to listen. Get the crap out of your ears.

That's very naive. Even Szymanski doesn't think that.

 

[Phoenix]

Take the west guys who went east

Busted.

 

[dca319]

Busted.

What's broken?

 

[luvthe9]

Yep! All done with flying of any sort. I have had a standing job offer which I declined for personal/family reasons. 49 years 6 mo. of flying and just shy of 40 with the airline....stick me with a fork I am done!

I miss flying a little bit but less each day. Do I miss the airline....not so much. I sure as hell miss all the fine people that I've worked with over the years and wish nothing but the best for all of you.

Regards,

Bob

Now sit back and enjoy life, Congrats!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

 

[AAviator]

In thought we get the new pay rates as soon as we vote in the MOU, do we not? So that means you're wrong in that a POR triggers the MOU - it doesn't.

Rates come with a merger transaction.

You can thank APA now if you'd like....