Day the Music Died

[Flying Titan]

Of course, Dell, none of Rep. Bachmann's prediction would even be remotely possible if Bush had actually decided to devote US troops to hunting down and killing UBL, al Qaeda, and the Taliban instead of foolishly opening the door for Iran to dominate the entire middle east by invading Iraq.

 

[delldude]

I think Iran was already on the planning board even before we did Iraq....remember the axis of evil and UBL hiding in Iran?
Please do not give any of this we've made them hate us even more stuff like Ch 12 attempts...These good ol' Arabs been hating us worldwide for a long long time.....CIA come to mind??
DO they hate us anymore or less since Bush??LOL those people make a living out of hate...just read the Bible....
We actually would be hated the same even if we stayed out the ME.Remember,we the only nation on Earth that supports Israel...and thats all it takes.

 

[local 12 proud]

Of course, Dell, none of Rep. Bachmann's prediction would even be remotely possible if Bush had actually decided to devote US troops to hunting down and killing UBL, al Qaeda, and the Taliban instead of foolishly opening the door for Iran to dominate the entire middle east by invading Iraq.

Would'nt it be peachy if it was all that cut and dried?

Al Qaeda (The Base) reaches around the globe, its not just confined to a Rich fanatic from saudi who cobbled together a terrorist cell composed exclusively of a bunch of bedouin Afghan goat herders. Bush did devote troops to the hunt for UBL, and in fact the Taliban (those nice guys) who made up a vast majority (not all) of his fighters in afghanistan were taken down. the problem is many have escaped and probably Osama himself into the bordering mountains and caves of pakistan and we know what a sensitive predicament this leaves us in.

The Islamic terror networks are linked together, they communicate and plot with each other, they have the same goal and agenda. We are fighting an Idealism not a specific geographically rooted enemy, and that is why Bush said this was a "Global" war on terror. Al Qaeda is only one branch of a very large tree, and this may come as a surprise to you but Iran has a few branches on that family tree.

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Feb2002/n0..._200202141.html

A Global Terror Group Primer
By Jim Garamone
American Forces Press Service

WASHINGTON, Feb. 14, 2002 -- When President Bush says the United States will bring terrorists to justice, he isn't just talking about Osama bin Laden and his Al Qaeda network.

Bush has said America will go after terrorist groups with worldwide reaches. The tools used will change with the circumstances, he has said. In some cases that may mean military action and, in others, economic starvation, diplomatic moves or law enforcement actions.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/wor...ra/al-qaida.htm

Location/Area of Operation
Al-Qaida has cells worldwide and is reinforced by its ties to Sunni extremist networks. Coalition attacks on Afghanistan since October 2001 have dismantled the Taliban–al-Qaida’s protectors–and led to the capture, death, or dispersal of al-Qaida operatives. Some al-Qaeda members at large probably will attempt to carry out future attacks against US interests. Other known areas of operation: United States, Yemen, Germany, Pakistan.

Al-Qaida is a multi-national network possessing a global reach and has supported through financing, training and logistics, Islamic militants in Afghanistan, Algeria, Bosnia, Chechnya, Eritrea, Kosovo, the Philippines, Somalia, Tajikistan, and Yemen, and now Kosovo. Additionally, al-Qaida has been linked to conflicts and attacks in Africa, Asia, Europe, the former Soviet Republics, the Middle East, as well as North and South America.

 

[UAL_TECH]

Would'nt it be peachy if it was all that cut and dried?

Al Qaeda (The Base) reaches around the globe, its not just confined to a Rich fanatic from saudi who cobbled together a terrorist cell composed exclusively of a bunch of bedouin Afghan goat herders. Bush did devote troops to the hunt for UBL, and in fact the Taliban (those nice guys) who made up a vast majority (not all) of his fighters in afghanistan were taken down. the problem is many have escaped and probably Osama himself into the bordering mountains and caves of pakistan and we know what a sensitive predicament this leaves us in.

The Islamic terror networks are linked together, they communicate and plot with each other, they have the same goal and agenda. We are fighting an Idealism not a specific geographically rooted enemy, and that is why Bush said this was a "Global" war on terror. Al Qaeda is only one branch of a very large tree, and this may come as a surprise to you but Iran has a few branches on that family tree.

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Feb2002/n0..._200202141.html
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/wor...ra/al-qaida.htm

Dude,

I see your problem. 😉
You are too informed.
So, who won the american idol contest? :blink:

B) UT

I think Iran was already on the planning board even before we did Iraq....remember the axis of evil and UBL hiding in Iran?
Please do not give any of this we've made them hate us even more stuff like Ch 12 attempts...These good ol' Arabs been hating us worldwide for a long long time.....CIA come to mind??
DO they hate us anymore or less since Bush??LOL those people make a living out of hate...just read the Bible....
We actually would be hated the same even if we stayed out the ME.Remember,we the only nation on Earth that supports Israel...and thats all it takes.

Please quit stating the obvious. People do not want to hear that…… 😛

B) UT

 

[Flying Titan]

I think Iran was already on the planning board even before we did Iraq....remember the axis of evil and UBL hiding in Iran?
Please do not give any of this we've made them hate us even more stuff like Ch 12 attempts...These good ol' Arabs been hating us worldwide for a long long time.....CIA come to mind??
DO they hate us anymore or less since Bush??LOL those people make a living out of hate...just read the Bible....
We actually would be hated the same even if we stayed out the ME.Remember,we the only nation on Earth that supports Israel...and thats all it takes.

Dell...
Re-read my post. I didn't say anything like "we've made them hate us even more." I said we opened the door for Iran to dominate the region by invading Iraq. That's something they've wanted to do for a long time. As much as he was an evil dictator, Saddam was no friend of Iran. He kept them occupied and off balance - and - he held their ambitions in check. By invading Iraq, now that country is keeping our forces occupied and limiting our options for dealing with other threats.

Even your buddy Local 12 now realizes that many of the Taliban managed to escape our attacks in Afghanistan...and we all believe that UBL is hiding out somehwere along the Afghan/Pakistan border. Of course, we can't seem to do much about this threat because we're dealing with a civil war in Iraq -- even as we watch the Taliban and al Qaeda return to Afghanistan right before our eyes because we don't have enough troops there.

 

[local 12 proud]

Even your buddy Local 12 now realizes that many of the Taliban managed to escape our attacks in Afghanistan...and we all believe that UBL is hiding out somehwere along the Afghan/Pakistan border. Of course, we can't seem to do much about this threat because we're dealing with a civil war in Iraq -- even as we watch the Taliban and al Qaeda return to Afghanistan right before our eyes because we don't have enough troops there.

FT don't become confused just because I stated the obvious and interpret that as one who has 'seen the light'. The war in 'Afghanistan' was only the beginning, not an end all to the war on terror. take one look at the layout of that country and it is no surprise that a group of people who are accustom to driving goats thru mountain trails are capable of evading human contact, nonetheless we managed to put a major hurt on UBL and his bunch in that region.

How is it your so sure we're not dealing with the threat? we still have boots on the ground and plenty of eyes and ears other wise we would'nt know that the Taliban is attempting a resurgence right? we put the enemy on the run once after killing untold numbers, which was accomplished primarily with Major air strikes and very limited casualties of our own, and we can do it again.

Iraq is a mess right now, no one is desputing that but we must see this thru to a victory for US, our allies, and the security of the region or we're going to see a bloodbath unlike anything we've seen since WWII. we get it already, there were no Nuclear tipped ICBM's found in the Iraqi desert (probably in syria now 😉) but plenty of bad things were uncovered and could have been handed off to terrorist groups eager to kill infidels just for sh!ts & grins. however right or wrong invading iraq may have been, you don't go to war with the mindset of placing strict limitations and guidelines and expect to be victorious. Our avowed enemies have shown they have no boundries, and nor should we!

You under estimate the capabilities of the American Fighting Forces, even after 8 years of Clinton/Gores ambitious attempt to GUT our Military we still have the most advanced and superior war machine ever devised by humans. after all we accomplished in less than six months what the former Soviet Union tried and failed for eleven long years.🙂

 

[local 12 proud]

Dude,

I see your problem. 😉
You are too informed.
So, who won the american idol contest? :blink:

B) UT
Please quit stating the obvious. People do not want to hear that…… 😛

B) UT

UT, you crack me up

Did'nt that bimbo who shaved her head and skipped out on rehab win? :unsure:

Later, L12... B)

 

[UAL_TECH]

UT, you crack me up

Did'nt that bimbo who shaved her head and skipped out on rehab win? :unsure:

Later, L12... B)

Can you narrow it down? 😛
Seems the MO for most.........

Stellar

Later Gator...... 😛
B) UT

 

[delldude]

Dell...
Re-read my post. I didn't say anything like "we've made them hate us even more."

I'm sorry that you took exception to that.....Actually(the part you brought up) it was focused on Ch 12.....Again I appologize. 😉

Dell

 

[UAL_TECH]

I'm sorry that you took exception to that.....Actually(the part you brought up) it was focused on Ch 12.....Again I appologize. 😉

Dell

Takes a person of integrity and humility to apologize on these boards.

Take Care,
B) UT

 

[local 12 proud]

Takes a person of integrity and humility to apologize on these boards.

Take Care,
B) UT

Ditto....class act

keep'em on their toes dell, ya da man! 😎

regards,
L12

 

[Flying Titan]

Takes a person of integrity and humility to apologize on these boards.

Take Care,
B) UT

UAL Tech... Agreed. Well said.

Dell... No need to apologize. Just a misunderstanding. Though you and I disagree on most of the issues we discuss here, I enjoy the discussion, nonetheless. Regards.

 

[Flying Titan]

FT don't become confused just because I stated the obvious and interpret that as one who has 'seen the light'.

Don't worry. I don't think there's much chance of that! 😀

take one look at the layout of that country and it is no surprise that a group of people who are accustom to driving goats thru mountain trails are capable of evading human contact, nonetheless we managed to put a major hurt on UBL and his bunch in that region.

How is it your so sure we're not dealing with the threat? we still have boots on the ground and plenty of eyes and ears other wise we would'nt know that the Taliban is attempting a resurgence right? we put the enemy on the run once after killing untold numbers, which was accomplished primarily with Major air strikes and very limited casualties of our own, and we can do it again.

Your assessment here is correct. We did manage to run the Taliban out of Afghanistan. We did manage to clear out al Qaeda's training camps. We did install a fledgling democratic government. We did manage to make some important social reforms for that country like schools for both boys and girls.

Unfortunately, we didn't provide enough boots on the ground to actually hold all of the territory that we took away from the Taliban. Many of the families who sent their kids to these schools, can't send them anymore because the Taliban is back - and in some key parts of the country - it's in charge again. Commerce that was starting to grow has collapsed in many sections of the country. In short, the same reason that we didn't get UBL and his cronies is the reason that Afghanistan is slipping away. Bush only gave a half-arsed commitment to winning in Afghanistan. If he had devoted even HALF the effort there that he's devoted in Iraq, we would be much safer today.

You under estimate the capabilities of the American Fighting Forces, even after 8 years of Clinton/Gores ambitious attempt to GUT our Military we still have the most advanced and superior war machine ever devised by humans. after all we accomplished in less than six months what the former Soviet Union tried and failed for eleven long years.🙂

I've never underestimated the power of our fighting men and women. I've been there. I know what we can do...if leaders like Bush/Rumsfeld would just get out of the way and stop micro-managing the Pentagon.

There were plenty of people in the Clinton administration who were not the biggest cheerleaders for the military -- but they did one thing right. For the most part, they stayed out of the Pentagon's business and let them do their job! Since 2001 when Rummy rode into town, that has not been the case -- and you don't have to go very far in DC to find plenty of people who will confirm that for you.