CWA Tentative Agreement?

roabilly said:
With a 401k... It’s not your money until you actually contribute it to the plan. NO contribution = NO match… you lose! I have personally spoken with over half of the younger members (less than 10 years) in my department, and most do NOT contribute to the 401k… nor would they even if we had a company match. They do not care about 30 years from now… they want every penny NOW!

Now, with the IAMNPF you have no option but to participate, and the Company contribution is automatic. This fact will save most of these members from a life of poverty in a few decades when they retire!

The current monthly distribution numbers for a vested member that has participated since the inception of the IAMNPF is now equal to over $200,000.00 in a 401k! I have spoken to over half of the older members (with 20 years or more), and very few have over $70,000.00 in their 401k’s. Actually, a lot of them screwed up post 911 when the markets tanked, and they pulled their money out of equities. What this essentially did was to “lock them into” that loss with no chance of making it up, even with today’s soaring markets!

Face it… the average blue collar worker is not a good investor. Corporate America knows this, which is why they lobbied for 401k legislation in the 70’s to replace their pension obligations. It has saved them BILLIONS… and cost American workers BILLIONS!
Click to expand...
IMO, you are necessarily biased Roabily. That isn't a knock, just a recognition that you said you will retire fairly soon. I understand your point.

The IAMPF has whacked future benefits by 40% overnight, so I'm not comfortable with any future decisions that may be partly based on a membership loss.
A 401k, not match, is a nice feature to have as part of the so called '3 prong' of retirement. I certainly hope our NC is listening, and will negotiate more retirement, in the form of getting company contributions into the already existing 401k. Keeping everything in the IAMPF has cost us once.

As far as the young members. You must remember, that many quit before the 5 year mark. The IAMPF doesn't give them any realized credit for that if they don't participate for 5 years. In this age of migrant and transient workers, young people staying at a job for 5 years is becoming uncommon. Sorta like the IAM robbing them, wouldn't you say?

Also, the IAMPF, in the contract is a joke. If one is to have it, then it should be based on a % and not a dollar amount. At United it is 6.5%. When a new wage is negotiated then the IAMPF rate necessarily goes up.

At US AIRWAYS, close to 40% of the membership is part time and is only getting .65 put in. WTF? That's a complete joke. Be Fair NC! At United, it doesn't matter if one is part time or full time regarding medical, pension, etc. Canale really hosed the hell out of everyone, but he got the part timers pretty damn good!
 
Tim,

No one's benefits have been cut. What has been accrued has not and will not be cut.

Future benefits can be cut if a new agreement isnt reached.

Why do you keep posting misinformation?

No pension is vested until five years, thats the law and that is what all pensions follow.
 
Tim Nelson said:
IMO, you are necessarily biased Roabily. That isn't a knock, just a recognition that you said you will retire fairly soon. I understand your point.

The IAMPF has whacked future benefits by 40% overnight, so I'm not comfortable with any future decisions that may be partly based on a membership loss.
A 401k, not match, is a nice feature to have as part of the so called '3 prong' of retirement. I certainly hope our NC is listening, and will negotiate more retirement, in the form of getting company contributions into the already existing 401k. Keeping everything in the IAMPF has cost us once.

As far as the young members. You must remember, that many quit before the 5 year mark. The IAMPF doesn't give them any realized credit for that if they don't participate for 5 years. In this age of migrant and transient workers, young people staying at a job for 5 years is becoming uncommon. Sorta like the IAM robbing them, wouldn't you say?

Also, the IAMPF, in the contract is a joke. If one is to have it, then it should be based on a % and not a dollar amount. At United it is 6.5%. When a new wage is negotiated then the IAMPF rate necessarily goes up.

At US AIRWAYS, close to 40% of the membership is part time and is only getting .65 put in. WTF? That's a complete joke. Be Fair NC! At United, it doesn't matter if one is part time or full time regarding medical, pension, etc. Canale really hosed the hell out of everyone, but he got the part timers pretty damn good!
Click to expand...

No, Roabilly is 100% correct.
 
700UW said:
Tim,

No one's benefits have been cut. What has been accrued has not and will not be cut.

Future benefits can be cut if a new agreement isnt reached.

Why do you keep posting misinformation?

No pension is vested until five years, thats the law and that is what all pensions follow.
Click to expand...
700. Our future benefits got cut. Bottom line. Ok, technically "D Day" hasn't happened as we have 5 more months. WHo the hell cares because it is in process. Future benefits are suppose to be whacked by January regardless of an agreement. Who are you kidding? BTW, why the hell would I want my union pension trustees to cut one dime of MY MONEY???? F Them! And I'll be pissed if our NC dump more money into the IAMPF to bring it up just so these trustees can cut it again. A 401k is already in place so it makes TONS MORE SENSE to utilize it and not have to worry if our union pension is going to rob us again. Having all eggs in the IAMPF basket is absolutely foolish. BTW< it's foolish that we even have to have this conversation since 'not so defined' benefit plans are DINOSAURS. STUCK IN CONCRETE and subject to being frozen or slashed. It isn't even a knock against the IAMPF, all defined pensions that made it out of the Jurassic era are under attack. New legislation is VERY REAL and it is reasonable to believe that the new legislation slashing the benefits of actual retirees will also be in play fairly soon. All those Detroit pensions will most likely get frozen as well. Sorry, 700, but I'd like to have any additional negotiated retirement benefit in My Money in a more secure 401k that I can have access to with less restriction.
 
700, the company is contributing "your money" to a DB plan, they are simply the ones putting the money in the envelope. The Co considers this in negotiations and without a DB plan you could take that same amount (and more) to provide higher base rate, better scope, better medical. There is no such thing as a free lunch, haven't you read Kevin's posts about this matter?

Josh
 
Tim Nelson said:
700. Our future benefits got cut. Bottom line. Ok, technically "D Day" hasn't happened as we have 5 more months. WHo the hell cares because it is in process. Future benefits are suppose to be whacked by January regardless of an agreement. Who are you kidding? BTW, why the hell would I want my union pension trustees to cut one dime of MY MONEY???? F Them! And I'll be pissed if our NC dump more money into the IAMPF to bring it up just so these trustees can cut it again. A 401k is already in place so it makes TONS MORE SENSE to utilize it and not have to worry if our union pension is going to rob us again. Having all eggs in the IAMPF basket is absolutely foolish. BTW< it's foolish that we even have to have this conversation since 'not so defined' benefit plans are DINOSAURS. STUCK IN CONCRETE and subject to being frozen or slashed. It isn't even a knock against the IAMPF, all defined pensions that made it out of the Jurassic era are under attack. New legislation is VERY REAL and it is reasonable to believe that the new legislation slashing the benefits of actual retirees will also be in play fairly soon. All those Detroit pensions will most likely get frozen as well. Sorry, 700, but I'd like to have any additional negotiated retirement benefit in My Money in a more secure 401k that I can have access to with less restriction.
Click to expand...
Where was your outrage during chapter 11 part 2 when the pension was terminated.
 
no matter how you feel about the pension, it's an absolute crime the way part timers are done on .
it. And no I am not part time.
 
johnjohn. Thanks for bringing to attention the GAME CHANGER issue that ALL should pay attention to working at AMR Group as a CSA , B/T/Wing, F/S , P/S , Class 2 Station Agent. G2 SECURED SERVICE. DBP's and 401'k IMO won't matter if 50% + of Current Union Membership loose their jobs to changes of #1 Issue . SCOPE !
 
I have heard it said; that this CWA/IBT TA offers no scope protection for the represented Passenger Service Group at US. I have heard it said; the language in the TA allows Passenger Service at AA and their Vendors to perform the work and duties of the Passenger Service employess at US. I have heard it said; the language guarantees no US Passenger Service employee will be displaced, as a result of AA employees or their vendors, performing the work of former US Passenger Service employees. Without seeing the actual agreement... I ask if what I have heard, concerning the scope of this agreement, is true? Additionally, I would ask for further interpretation and clarification if this language is true.
 
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