Competition in the Skies: Is Delta the Problem, or the Solution?

[eolesen]

It certainly didn't require any written documentation to dump a lav and I have yet to hear anyone say it does today.

Still focusing on the specks instead of the log?... (probably not the wright analogy for a lav conversation...)

The larger point you are glossing over is that CBP owns the airplane from the time it is on the ground until they give the go ahead to start cleaning and servicing.

Dump a lav before CBP has released the plane, and you'll find out what documentation is. Typically, it's a verbal or an understanding that you're free to do so after X minutes.

Again, it's all about coordination at the local level. You'll never find a written policy. CBP doesn't want to be predictable.

Why that's even an issue here is a bit boggling in itself....

 

[WorldTraveler]

no the speck supports the notion which I never challenged that CBP approval to do anything is required.  Some here said that deplaning could occur first and my experience is that is not allowed.  Approval for lav service comes with pax deplaning at DL unless someone can tell me it is different now. 
 
yes, I was wondering why lav procedures are part of a competition issue and fully agree that the way CBP operates in CLT may well be different than in CVG or ATL.

 

[700UW]

Well I can tell you what the procedures are for US systemwide and have all ready.
 
You can only deplane, and unload cargo before CBP and USDA give clearance.
 
And at US ETOPS paperwork is done by the mechanics and the lav block is signed off by whomever serviced it.
 
And yes at US there is a form placed in the cockpit to show the flight crew the servicing was accomplished.
 
US had a plane divert from CLT to BOS before going over the pond as the lavs werent serviced properly and debris got on the sensor and shut the system down.

 

[737823]

Well I can tell you what the procedures are for US systemwide and have all ready.
 
You can only deplane, and unload cargo before CBP and USDA give clearance.
 
And at US ETOPS paperwork is done by the mechanics and the lav block is signed off by whomever serviced it.
 
And yes at US there is a form placed in the cockpit to show the flight crew the servicing was accomplished.
 
US had a plane divert from CLT to BOS before going over the pond as the lavs werent serviced properly and debris got on the sensor and shut the system down.

Are you sure you should be posting company procedures on a public forum? And besides you have been separated from US since 2005, the procedures have likely changed.

Josh

 

[swamt]

I'm sure most of you know that SWA use to have the 15 minute turn time, once upon a time.   It has since moved to 20 min and is now (I believe) at more like 25-35 minutes.  I do know as we still are getting the 800's with more seats, they are moving all gate times to 30 +/-  as it will just increase on time by the smaller airplane gates and help with the larger 800's.  20 mins can and probably will be done when SWA runs 20 flights per day out of 2 gates.  Example, first flights of the day start after 6 am, and with the noise ordinance, are suppose to end by 9 or 10 pm.  with 10 flights per day per gate that leaves approx. about 5 hours to do all the services required for a days worth of flights.  Pretty sure we could easily run 11-12 per gate per day but pretty sure that would push us into delays and cancelations.

 

[LD3]

Not knowing much about intl ops, but don't the pax go to FIS directly from the aircraft while staying in a sterile zone?

 

[700UW]

Are you sure you should be posting company procedures on a public forum? And besides you have been separated from US since 2005, the procedures have likely changed.

Josh

So go turn me in, lol.
 
I posted nothing proprietary, so kiss off.
 
And never signed a non-compete or a confidentiality agreement.
 
And the procedures havent changed, I have plenty of friends who still work out there, and as does my son's mother.
 
So go try to attack me some other way.

 

[swamt]

AMAZING how this thread went from "Competition in the skies"  to "When your allowed to dump Lavs". 

 

[700UW]

Not knowing much about intl ops, but don't the pax go to FIS directly from the aircraft while staying in a sterile zone?

Yes, that is how it is done.

 

[LD3]

AMAZING how this thread went from "Competition in the skies"  to "When your allowed to dump Lavs". 

It is amazing, but it has become a bit more of a civil conversation, I think we need a group hug....

 

[737823]

So go turn me in, lol.
 
I posted nothing proprietary, so kiss off.
 
And never signed a non-compete or a confidentiality agreement.
 
And the procedures havent changed, I have plenty of friends who still work out there, and as does my son's mother.
 
So go try to attack me some other way.

See you when you come for the alliance roadshow.

Josh

 

[700UW]

No you wont.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I'm sure most of you know that SWA use to have the 15 minute turn time, once upon a time.   It has since moved to 20 min and is now (I believe) at more like 25-35 minutes.  I do know as we still are getting the 800's with more seats, they are moving all gate times to 30 +/-  as it will just increase on time by the smaller airplane gates and help with the larger 800's.  20 mins can and probably will be done when SWA runs 20 flights per day out of 2 gates.  Example, first flights of the day start after 6 am, and with the noise ordinance, are suppose to end by 9 or 10 pm.  with 10 flights per day per gate that leaves approx. about 5 hours to do all the services required for a days worth of flights.  Pretty sure we could easily run 11-12 per gate per day but pretty sure that would push us into delays and cancelations.

 
 
yes. thank you.
 
IF WN can turn a flight on 30 minutes that will carry at least twice as many passengers as DL will carry on a large RJ but apparently some don't want to admit that DL will have to adapt its operational procedures to what WN uses if it wants to argue that DL should be allowed to slot its flights into WN's schedule and argue for the use of gate space at DAL. 
 
BTW, even with the curfew, WN would to be running more than 20 flights/day with 30 minute turn times ON AT LEAST SOME BUT NOT EVERY GATE and even a 15 minute separation between flights
 
There is more than enough room at DAL to accommodate the flights WN, VX, and DL has announced and what UA currently operates. 
 

AMAZING how this thread went from "Competition in the skies"  to "When your allowed to dump Lavs". 

 
 
again, yes, thank you.

 

[eolesen]

Not knowing much about intl ops, but don't the pax go to FIS directly from the aircraft while staying in a sterile zone?

 
In theory. Unless you're DL at JFK... just let the pax out into the baggage claim. It will be OK...
 

It is amazing, but it has become a bit more of a civil conversation, I think we need a group hug....

That's only because WT doesn't know crap, and making up crap about crap won't work with people who do know their crap.

 

[700UW]

So will DAL be done by vendors or will DL actually use their own employees?