Company agrees to ALPA Pension Legislative Relief
- Thread starter Smoke and Mirrors
- Start date
PITbull
Veteran
- Dec 29, 2002
- 7,784
- 456
Some AlPA members may want to delude themselves in thinking they help save the IAM an AFA pensions through their concessions, but I am here to say to ALPA that specifically the factual recorded give back from 7,800 f/a at USAirways is a grand total of $102 Million per year. And we ALL know that the winter concession of $26 Million give back (with even a more reduced work force than the above 7,800, was much more, as initially, medical increases were OFF the table three days before we had the liquidation deadline date of the 20th. So, placing medical increases on the table raises our "give back" to higher than the $26 million, but the company would not work out the figures, as they told us at the table, the other labor groups would get upset....(NO, AFA WOULD GET UPSET!) We did this to SAVE our own pensions folks. Just as ALPA was lead to give $101 Million to save their pensions from the liars at the table, we too, were told, they would take our pensions OFF as the funding was NOT in jeopardy. Our actuary told us in the summer that our pensions were 2.2% of the liability of the company's with our concessions.
So, If you think U took your money, because they wanted to place the money to fund our pensions....you have lost your minds and are looking for excuses to take ours to resurrect yours. The laibilities were separate. Our acutuaries told us this in the summer. Mangement wanted to lump them all in so they could have an excuse to terminate all of them, but they couldn't. And now I see that ALPA is assisting the company to do the very thing the company wanted to do in the summer..."lump" the liabilities together. Do you really trust this management to help you guys? Remember, these are the same guys that requested to have the PBGC terminate your pensions. The same mangement that lead you guys down the road (and I watched in negotiations how easy that was for your leadership) to bleed you out of every penny, change your medical contributions, that you guys hurried and willingly negotiated with speed, twice, and lead you to also believe you were saving your pensions...and they waited for last to take this from you...same as the lease agreement terminations with PITTSBURGH Airport. This is how this mangement operates...and you trust them? In a few years ALPA will "snap back in their wages"...all of them by 2009. This is when mangement will CLOBBER you guys on the head again, and possibly this time, dragging us in and terminating everyones plan. If you think we as AFA or IAM will travel down this road with you in silence....think again. Your leadership has not approached AFA or IAM, WHY?
So, you see boys, your not saving anyone's pensions, not even your own. This management was crying about pilot pension liability since June of 2002. It was the first thing spouted out of the NEW CEO's mouth in March of 2002. In retrospect, they were going to take ALPA's pensions no matter what.
I will not go up against another union, as I supported ALPA in their quest to save their pension in January. But IT IS WRONG for ALPA to now resurrect their pensions on the little pensions the rest of the remaining employees have through a defined plan by lumping the liability together with ALPAs. Keep in mind, specifically AFA has A SOCIAL SECURITY OFF SET TO BOOT, 50%. ALPA did not have that. Rest assured, pensions may be small to you therefore, of no consequence, but we will fight like hell to keep us out of that legislation...we are working on that now. If you want to resurrect your "defined plans" then write the legislation with regard to your liability, not ours.
I will not support a piece of legislation that places the other defined plans in any "harms" way or "play" for the next 30 years, with no possibility of ever improving these plans in the future and possibility of a termination in the future, and the legislation stating that we would all be "caped" at 2002 for infinity no matter what the year of termination is. Why would we agree to that????
So, if your concessions given, help to save all our pensions, what was our give backs for....to save pilots jobs, or was the IAM and AFA give backs just "piss" money to this mangement?
Notice, Chip has not answered my above post. Why? Hope the IAM is vigilent like we are. Have a feeling this mangement is hoping for unions to go up against each other on this and force everyone to support lumping these payments together and stretching them over 30 years....then poof, egventually, they could terminate all of them, when wages snap back. In their eyes divide and conquer is a "good thing".
There are no more livable wages or benefits to the flight attendant job here at U...so goes the pension, so goes the integrity of the profession...
Just will not go there...
So, If you think U took your money, because they wanted to place the money to fund our pensions....you have lost your minds and are looking for excuses to take ours to resurrect yours. The laibilities were separate. Our acutuaries told us this in the summer. Mangement wanted to lump them all in so they could have an excuse to terminate all of them, but they couldn't. And now I see that ALPA is assisting the company to do the very thing the company wanted to do in the summer..."lump" the liabilities together. Do you really trust this management to help you guys? Remember, these are the same guys that requested to have the PBGC terminate your pensions. The same mangement that lead you guys down the road (and I watched in negotiations how easy that was for your leadership) to bleed you out of every penny, change your medical contributions, that you guys hurried and willingly negotiated with speed, twice, and lead you to also believe you were saving your pensions...and they waited for last to take this from you...same as the lease agreement terminations with PITTSBURGH Airport. This is how this mangement operates...and you trust them? In a few years ALPA will "snap back in their wages"...all of them by 2009. This is when mangement will CLOBBER you guys on the head again, and possibly this time, dragging us in and terminating everyones plan. If you think we as AFA or IAM will travel down this road with you in silence....think again. Your leadership has not approached AFA or IAM, WHY?
So, you see boys, your not saving anyone's pensions, not even your own. This management was crying about pilot pension liability since June of 2002. It was the first thing spouted out of the NEW CEO's mouth in March of 2002. In retrospect, they were going to take ALPA's pensions no matter what.
I will not go up against another union, as I supported ALPA in their quest to save their pension in January. But IT IS WRONG for ALPA to now resurrect their pensions on the little pensions the rest of the remaining employees have through a defined plan by lumping the liability together with ALPAs. Keep in mind, specifically AFA has A SOCIAL SECURITY OFF SET TO BOOT, 50%. ALPA did not have that. Rest assured, pensions may be small to you therefore, of no consequence, but we will fight like hell to keep us out of that legislation...we are working on that now. If you want to resurrect your "defined plans" then write the legislation with regard to your liability, not ours.
I will not support a piece of legislation that places the other defined plans in any "harms" way or "play" for the next 30 years, with no possibility of ever improving these plans in the future and possibility of a termination in the future, and the legislation stating that we would all be "caped" at 2002 for infinity no matter what the year of termination is. Why would we agree to that????
So, if your concessions given, help to save all our pensions, what was our give backs for....to save pilots jobs, or was the IAM and AFA give backs just "piss" money to this mangement?
Notice, Chip has not answered my above post. Why? Hope the IAM is vigilent like we are. Have a feeling this mangement is hoping for unions to go up against each other on this and force everyone to support lumping these payments together and stretching them over 30 years....then poof, egventually, they could terminate all of them, when wages snap back. In their eyes divide and conquer is a "good thing".
There are no more livable wages or benefits to the flight attendant job here at U...so goes the pension, so goes the integrity of the profession...
Just will not go there...
Twicebaked
Veteran
- May 22, 2003
- 1,788
- 18
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On 6/5/2003 10:23:00 PM LavMan wrote:
One thing I noticed, ALPA is like a Wolf, they will eat their young at any cost.
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On 6/5/2003 10:23:00 PM LavMan wrote:
One thing I noticed, ALPA is like a Wolf, they will eat their young at any cost.
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CAREFULL EVERYONE!!!!! WE ARE STARTING TO TURN ON EACH OTHER AND THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THEY(DELETED AT THE PALACE) WANT US TO DO. ALL LABOR HAS IS EACH OTHER. LET'S TRY NOT TO GO THERE!!
