April/May 2013 IAM Fleet Discussions

[robbedagain]

while 26 would be nice im only suggesting that a pay scale for all fsa should be along the lines of ua dl wn n the current aa not this current rate of 20.56 and i think we must have all of the current stations we have now an enhanched scope language n better sick as well as the things such as a no repeat of the 2005 clauses that caused grieve for those returning from furlough status

 

[Jester]

We waited 15 years to get in section 6 so lets embrace it and make sure we dont leave it for transition talks until we attain enhanced scope (with no attached drop dead dates), a fair wage and some other increases, including enhancing the retirement by getting a 401 match to go along with the current iam pension.

Silly question, but does Section 6 have an expiration or 'stale date' upon it? There seems to be a big hurry to use it or lose it versus waiting for a joint contract negotiation. Of course, I understand how everyone wants more pay, more benefits, more sick, etc., now versus later, as we do have some protection with out-sourcing for a year with the Letter of Agreement, but it seems that waiting and negotiating with the financial benefits of a merged operation would make the IAM's ability to demand higher compensation more feasible.

 

[robbedagain]

jester i think most are looking at the wages and benes and sick bec the company has been profitable and making tons off of the bag fees and would like to have something now and then going into the transition talks may be go for more i think the sentiment is enough is enough with these chicken wages

 

[charlie Brown]

while 26 would be nice im only suggesting that a pay scale for all fsa should be along the lines of ua dl wn n the current aa not this current rate of 20.56 and i think we must have all of the current stations we have now an enhanched scope language n better sick as well as the things such as a no repeat of the 2005 clauses that caused grieve for those returning from furlough status

Robbed
No disrespect my friend, but the only one of the above mentioned airlines that's close to 26, is WN.

 

[charlie Brown]

Silly question, but does Section 6 have an expiration or 'stale date' upon it? There seems to be a big hurry to use it or lose it versus waiting for a joint contract negotiation. Of course, I understand how everyone wants more pay, more benefits, more sick, etc., now versus later, as we do have some protection with out-sourcing for a year with the Letter of Agreement, but it seems that waiting and negotiating with the financial benefits of a merged operation would make the IAM's ability to demand higher compensation more feasible.

Jester
One of the things that was hanging over the NC,s head before the coalition was announced, was that even though we were in section 6 negotiations, we also had this run off election raising its ugly head soon down the road, which would have pretty much shut negotiations down until a winning union was declared. So saying section 6 expires would not be a correct statement. But we were up against a unknown time limit, which due to the coalition, has been removed now.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Silly question, but does Section 6 have an expiration or 'stale date' upon it? There seems to be a big hurry to use it or lose it versus waiting for a joint contract negotiation. Of course, I understand how everyone wants more pay, more benefits, more sick, etc., now versus later, as we do have some protection with out-sourcing for a year with the Letter of Agreement, but it seems that waiting and negotiating with the financial benefits of a merged operation would make the IAM's ability to demand higher compensation more feasible.

no expiration. The company wants a quick merger and that works for me provided they give a fair shake. Section 6 usually takes 3-5 years before serious contentions begin to boil over. Mx already filed for a release but my hunch is that the nmb may not grant it for another year or two. Its procedural and everyone ought to be aware of that. But transition talks also go between 3-5 years and the thought of starting new talks after walking away from section 6 talks with only crumbs to show for 3 years of talks would be silly. Lately, airline trends have used transition talks as a stall to frustrate union leaders into making themselves look like jack arses accepting antilabor deals. In the case of united, the eboard screwed that strategy up so bad they went from section 6 into transition, now back into section 6. It isnt that hard to figure out where the leverage is but labor unions have been putting their own wallets ahead of the members. Maybe our nc can change that. regards,

 

[robbedagain]

Robbed
No disrespect my friend, but the only one of the above mentioned airlines that's close to 26, is WN.

its ok my friend i was not sure where some of the other air carriers wages sit at but i figure somewhere along the lines of 23 to 26 should be a relative point of getting wages though i knew wn was somewhere around 26 or 28 area but not sure of the exact top out

 

[blownkneesbob]

Question for everyone on here.
Do you think that everything in our contract would be better handled in section 6 negotiations as the number 5 carrier. Or do you think certain things would be better negotiated in joint talks as the worlds largest carrier? Give me your opinions.

 

[blownkneesbob]

CB
UA is the worlds largest carrier and it didnt favor them membership at all and the IAM is the largest union on property . I don't think it's necesarily the size thats critical but what do you have that the company wants or needs (ex single carrier status) thats where the leverage is No way should we leave sect 6 without getting everything that was requested long before this merger was ever consummated if anything the merge should be used as leverage to get what we may not of gotten had there not been a merger to begin with once that is achieved then and only then do we move into merger talks. That's my nickels worth

 

[Tim Nelson]

its ok my friend i was not sure where some of the other air carriers wages sit at but i figure somewhere along the lines of 23 to 26 should be a relative point of getting wages though i knew wn was somewhere around 26 or 28 area but not sure of the exact top out

continental is at 2013 base wages of $22.85 in front of joint talks. Amr bankrupt contract will be at $22.55 in front of joint talks. Non union delta is at $23.16. Wn is at $25.97 2010 wage but in negotiations for last couple years. United iam is at $20.812009 bankrupt wages still. Prior ua negotiated wage was $25.06 in 2004. Im quite sure united members expect somewhere between $25-$26 immediate.
Usairways management should have a bottom proposal of at least what amr has in front of joint talks and that means an immediate 10% pay hike. Our unions negotiations stance ought to be northward as they have tons more leverage than the twu did in bankruptcy. regards,

 

[robbedagain]

thanks tim with those wages they have i agree there tim that we should have something like that or may be a lit bit more for fsa

 

[blownkneesbob]

Roa,
That's exactly my point. We are in section 6 negotiations for US Airways. There are certain things though that maybe better handled as the largest carrier in the world. My point is this. If you get a T/A before the merger is finalized. The company is hell bent on saying that we are the 5th largest carrier. And the merger still stands a possibility of not being finalized. So their stance is, they are not going to give in on leading industry standards until joint talks. Because they don't know for sure on the merger being approved. Their position is the leading industry contract will come in joint talks, once the merger is finalized.

 

[blownkneesbob]

Then CB if the company is hell bent on standing pat then the NC needs to take a stance and inform that we will WAIT until we are the largest carrier we have Waited 14 years for this no need to rush things to appease the company's timeline. That would be throwing away the little bit of leverage we have and when has AH or any other company official been true to there word to benefit us. Never. There job is to get us under contract as cheap as possible. Don't fall for that things will be better next time around cause thats just a sales pitch

 

[charlie Brown]

CB
UA is the worlds largest carrier and it didnt favor them membership at all and the IAM is the largest union on property . I don't think it's necesarily the size thats critical but what do you have that the company wants or needs (ex single carrier status) thats where the leverage is No way should we leave sect 6 without getting everything that was requested long before this merger was ever consummated if anything the merge should be used as leverage to get what we may not of gotten had there not been a merger to begin with once that is achieved then and only then do we move into merger talks. That's my nickels worth

I like your post! Except I do think the members once we all are part of the worlds largest carrier, should not settle for anything less than leading industry contract. That's where I think the size matters. If the largest airline doesn't get industry leading, then that doesn't bode well for the unionized airlines below the biggest. Now we actually have section 6 without a election looming which is good!

 

[charlie Brown]

Then CB if the company is hell bent on standing pat then the NC needs to take a stance and inform that we will WAIT until we are the largest carrier we have Waited 14 years for this no need to rush things to appease the company's timeline. That would be throwing away the little bit of leverage we have and when has AH or any other company official been true to there word to benefit us. Never. There job is to get us under contract as cheap as possible. Don't fall for that things will be better next time around cause thats just a sales pitch

I here ya!!