Amfa Continues Downward Spiral

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seed said:
Basically, I am stating we shouldn't need unions.  Our profession has been dealt deadly blows, WE SHOULD REACT!!.

Honest question:  Do you think it is the TWU or the TWU membership that has become company friendly?  Do you think TUL, the majority, would pack up their tool boxes if requested by the TWU, or AMFA?  I mean really, let's face it, if Mr. Little stated "do not act in a militant way towards AA", and the membership wanted to, do you really think that would stop the membership? The membership is wishing the TWU stays low profile. Keep that paycheck coming every two weeks, no matter what!
[post="240590"][/post]​

Well many workers are reacting. They are reacting in ways that people react when they do not have a union, they are making arrangements to leave. Some have already done so.

You can not fight the company as individuals, thats why workers form unions. If you have a union in place but still can not fight then basically you do not have a union, you just pay dues.


Do you think soldiers want to go into battle? Instead of having armies why not just give everyone a gun and then if some country that still has armies invades just hope that everyone will just "REACT"?

Because it would not work.

While some would fight back, most would run for cover, however those same people in a structured organization that is well lead would fight and stand a much better chance of success. The same goes for workers, we stand a much better chance when properly organized and lead.

Corporations are highly organized and focused, they are organized in behalf of the owners with the sole objective of increasing the owners wealth. Workers need organizations that are just as focused at doing the same for the workers.

Several times in the past the membership has taken it upon themselves to be more militant, the TWU has not supported the membership, instead siding with the company every time.

The fact is that people need leadership and the TWU does not provide it even though they are paid to do so. To blame the membership for the leadership's incompetance has become a staple of todays weak labor movement. I dont buy it, if properly led todays workers could be just as effective at fighting for a better life as previous generations, the difference lies in the purely business union attitude of todays union leaders who give workers no reason for hope. In many cases this attitude is so ingrained that there is no cure, the union must be voted out and the members need to try a new union.

The fact is that most of the union leaders of today do not believe in the labor movement. Sure they spew out the same old rhetoric but any statement that is truly "theirs", in other words that expresses their true feelings, not something they read off old union propaganda sheets, reveals their true beliefs. They took these positions for one reason only-because they get paid a lot more than if they were on the floor. How much do you think Gless, Conley, Yingst or Little would make if they were still on the floor? Less than half of what they are making now!!

So they take these jobs, where they are not elected but appointed, with a built in excuse foir their incompetance-"the members dont participate". But as I've said before they never give the members anything of importance to participate in.

Bobby Gless became an International officer after realizing that it was either that or returning to the floor. He was not a good leader, not one member of the E-board would run on his ticket and he had no chance of being re-elected. The only reason why he won the first election was because it was a four way race and his biggest opponent was an aircraft cleaner and many mechanics felt that it would send the wrong message to elect a cleaner to lead the mechanics after years of mechanics claiming they want one of their own(even though the cleaner was "one of their own-Title 1). So what does the TWU do? They make him an International officer!

So now you have someone who is bitter toward his coworkers being their unchosen representative. How much sense does that make?

This is a common practice of the TWU/ATD, pick out loyal incompetants that the members reject and put them in charge of the membership that rejected them!

Did you check out the link?
 
Yes I did check out the link, very interesting history. I remember a few of the ones, as a kid, with TWA. I stood picket with the stews. Also I see the members of AMFA at Ozarks were willing to go to battle, that is a good thing as they are now here with us. One thing to remember though Bob, the TWU can jump up and down and yell vote strike, but if the populous does not vote to do so, it will not happen.

I can't see Local 514 voting in mass for a strike. This is not meant to be disrespectful to them, but many of the members there do not see their jobs at risk, the cost of living will assist future concessions, and they have no real history, in their short tenure, of aggression. They, and many other locals, are protected employees, unlike us at 530, we are represented by only part of your contract (WONDER IF WE SHOULD GET A CUT IN DUES). What little I have observed is that TUL gets what TUL wants, I may be way off track here, and hopefully so.

Anyhow, after all that mumbo jumbo I just typed, I wish UAL the best, they have a hard road ahead of them.
 
seed,Jan 20 2005, 09:33 PM]
Yes I did check out the link, very interesting history. I remember a few of the ones, as a kid, with TWA. I stood picket with the stews. Also I see the members of AMFA at Ozarks were willing to go to battle, that is a good thing as they are now here with us. One thing to remember though Bob, the TWU can jump up and down and yell vote strike, but if the populous does not vote to do so, it will not happen.

Once again you underestimate the influence of leadership on human behavior. The members are not that different, the leadership and the culture that they promote is. If we had real leadership this would never have happened the way it did.


I can't see Local 514 voting in mass for a strike. This is not meant to be disrespectful to them, but many of the members there do not see their jobs at risk, the cost of living will assist future concessions, and they have no real history, in their short tenure, of aggression.

As opposed to whom-MCI? The members of 514 standard of living probably rose up to their income. Perhaps nobody ever explained to them the relationship between their standard of living and the tickets sold out in New York, California and Florida. If the members at 514 had true leaders they would be just as willing to fight as the members in New York, well maybe.

As far as I know the members of Tulsa never elected anyone who said that once they got into office they were going to kiss managements behind, they voted for people who promised change and better contracts. The fact that once they got into office they changed has probably simply led most members to the conclusion that its pointless. Can you blame them?


They, and many other locals, are protected employees, unlike us at 530, we are represented by only part of your contract (WONDER IF WE SHOULD GET A CUT IN DUES).

Well the protection doesnt appear to really be worth that much because we all know that if the company wanted to do away with it it would be gone.

What little I have observed is that TUL gets what TUL wants, I may be way off track here, and hopefully so.


Well so long as that is what the International wants, which leads to whatever the company wants. I'm sure that Tulsa did not want system attrition, and to get booted out of the shops and replaced by SRPs. I also dont think that they wanted to see their hedacount cut by over 1000 members.

Anyhow, after all that mumbo jumbo I just typed, I wish UAL the best, they have a hard road ahead of them.

Well whether you realize it or not, we are on the same road. Have you made the 37 cent investment yet?
 
Name: T6
Email:
Employer: Nwa
Station:
Date: Friday March 18, 2005
Time: 08:34:35 PM


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Don't worry about Jeff Mathews negotiating concessions, these latest layoffs have his name printed on them along with practically all of the AMFA Local 33 Officers including the President and Vice President. Now you'll get to see how much they really believed in this AMFA crap about being "Highly Skilled" and "irreplaceable. " I would expect we'll see a concession package before the amendable date of our current contract. Get ready for some good old AMFA softening up tactics.
 
Name: Night Hawk
Email:
Employer: NWA
Station:
Date: Thursday March 17, 2005
Time: 07:11:48 PM


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The fat lady has sang for me. I'd like to thank Jim Young, Steve MacFarlane, Ray Hayes, Patty Ross, Joe Schomer, Jeff Mathews, Mike Young, Vic Reminisky, Pat Caulkins, and the rest of the AMFA organizing committee for completely screwing us all at NWA by bringing in AMFA. Thanks for the royal boning AMFA!
 
Name: Heard this at work today.
Email:
Employer:
Station:
Date: Thursday March 17, 2005
Time: 05:26:11 AM


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The latest. AMFA in an attempt to show good faith in negotiations and show that they're not just stalling is considering offering the company a reduced pension for those already retired. The negotiating committee is trying to save their own skin and jobs and as I see it figure they don't have to answer to the retiree's. This wouldn't be the first time Delle and McCormick sold out a group of retirees. At United Delle allowed cuts in medical benefits and is allowing the pension plans to be terminated.
 
Name: local 33 lec
Email:
Employer:
Station: thanks
Date: Sunday March 20, 2005
Time: 11:44:12 PM


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would like to thank the temp mechs in dlh ahead of time for giving up their jobs for me.sorry bout the no bumping rights.we didnt want to burden the unskilled overpaid people at the bid desk with extra paperwork.we will enjoy fishing and hunting and 4 wheeling without the hassle of having to drive up from the cities.if you know anyone with a boat or atv or crewcab dually pickup they cant afford anymore let us know.i have some extra money from working overtime,maybe we can work something out.did you see us on t.v the other day?pretty good huh?the parts i had in my hand were from my foreign car that i drive.i actually have not worked on a plane since i got my job with amfa. p.s. if you have any suggestions for the negotiators put them on the bulletin board in the hallway by the union office.they will be bumping to duluth as well.thanks again!
 
James T. Kirk,

When posting information from other bulletin boards since you cannot seem to generate your own opinions, remember one thing.

The members of the AMFA voted for their current labor agreement.

In contrast, we were forced to EAT ours via Jim Little's "without further ratification" letter of agreement after he claimed the only way to have a legitimate ratification is to re-vote using standard Presidents Council By-Law Procedures. One has legitmate membership ratification, one does not.

That may not make any difference to you. But to me, that means the leaders of AMFA allowed the membership to decide their current situation, and the TWU leaders forced ours upon us.

Therefore, you are comparing Apples to Oranges, and getting yourself nowhere by doing so.

That's like comparing us in Tulsa to the MRO's in head to head competition while we have to endure 37 levels management, unhedged fuel, more room throughout coach debacles, and many other issues that will not make the comparison fair and equitable. The employees of these MRO's that we are in competition with do not have the same dead wood to haul that we have.

Do you see what I mean?
 
Decision,

Its hard to be a team bubba twu believer when your judgement is constantly clouded by a bottle of booze in one hand, and a big fatty in the other. :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh:
 
Hasn't this thread run its course already, too?....

Nine months, and it's just the same crap y'all have been slinging at each other over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.............
 
Not until there is an election...Don't blame us, we produced the cards, mAAnagement are the ones to blame for stopping the election. :shock: 6 months exactly to we refile. :up: :up:

FM...Just wondering, did you actually type that "over and over," or copy and paste? :blink:
 
This could have been over last year, with an election. The company however wants to violate the RLA, and refuses to remain neutral to desperately hold on to the corrupt lapdog twu by any means necessary.

So you have a battle that will not stop.... NO VOTE? NO PEACE!!!! :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:
 
Name: temp
Email: noviruses
Employer: nwa
Station: dlh
Date: Wednesday March 23, 2005
Time: 01:29:12 AM


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I think you're right-game over-AMFA wins. Eliminating 900 more positions at NWA should wipe out all heavy maintenance done in house, a thorn in the airlines side for years. With AMFA'S help , that problem will be a non issue. Now again with AMFA'S help , they can work on farming out all line maintenance. Why pay a 35 year guy 75000 a year when they have a union at their disposal? What, you think the FARS require a certain number of mechs per airplane? Believe me, AMFA has people in place to change that language. I also hear AMFA is behind allowing illegal immigrants to work on our airplanes in this country. An intercepted internal memo expressed outrage at the fact that all heavy maintenance work wasn't being done off shores, and that a possible solution was to allow foreigners to work on them here. And now that I've seen the light and started doing some digging , I,ve come to realize that AMFA'S influence runs much deeper than that. To set the stage and justify the massive layoffs occurring in our industry today, something big had to happen. An event that would cause the airlines to lose more money in 2 years than they made the last 20. First an administration had to be put in place that would react accordingly. They obviously got their man. Second, AMFA decided that the best way of achieving their goal of outsourcing all maintenance was to infiltrate Al Qaeda. Hence the events that took place on 9/11. Paranoid, I don't think so. I heard, and this is only a rumor, that an AMFA membership card was found on one of the dead bodies of one of their hijacking cohorts. So yeah, now that the die has been cast, Ill stop lobbying my congressman about how this clashes with the homeland security act. Instead I'll be pushing for an increase in the minimum wage where hopefully my career at WAL-MART will take off, and sleep bettor knowing that outsourcing is creating a bettor standard of living for our partners in world trade. There's no doubt who's behind this, but I'm Done Fighting, We Can't Win
 
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