AMFA Boys/Spirit

[Don Smith]

...this much I do...Big Buisness/Government is attacking the middle class on all fronts. we stand together and fight or fall one by one.

terrible things have to happen local 12 in order for the working class man and woman to rise up. Airplane crashes just being on of the things that gets regular folks upset. We are getting pierced in all areas of life by taxes and higher prices...and yet...not high enough to make us stand up and fight. How high will gas have to get before we begin boycotting? How high the taxes?
We even have members of our own working class undercutting us. Who gives big business permission to try all of these extreme measures? We do. We continue to buy their products or fly on their airplanes. It will end someday in a showdown but I think it will have to be the next generation that does it. I'm training my fighters now...hopefully I'll be around to stand with them.

 

[local 12 proud]

The problem with you union guys is that you are divided you have no means of achieving you goals and you are small-minded.

Small minded? who is it that is degrading the craft again?

Why not stand beside your fellow middle classmen, instead of assisting in helping to destroy it?

chew on this quote for awhile:

"It is hard for thee to kick against the pricks."

 

[Don Smith]

...The problem with you union guys is that you are divided you have no means of achieving you goals and you are small-minded.

Thats funny...I suppose that a larger minded person would look at the situation of lower pay and crossing a picket line as the natural progression of things in this big global economy. Thinking that a man (or woman) with principles is a dinosaur in the workplace. When the principled people are out of a workplace then the business will suffer (eventually). The customer will suffer (immediately). I'm not divided in my small mind. My principles are intact and I am joined by thousands of others. We may need a new leader but the rank and file is still here.

 

[AP Tech]

So if you don't belong to a union and a group of people comes in and takes you job it's ok, but if you do belong to a union and some one takes you job that’s a bad thing.

Ding,Ding,Ding....You may have figured it out. The above is one of the reasons Unions came to be. With a large group of employees you require some sort of protection.

You don't come to a company "to take someones job", it is offered to you by the company! Why is it offered to you by the company? Why would they want to turn over employee's? Many reasons, poor employee, age,sickness, too much vacation, to high of salary, ect,ect.

 

[local 12 proud]

I bet your one of the idiots that think immigration is still a good thing for this country?

You know the more I think about this statement, the more my stomach churns. Is it wrong to long to be an AMERICAN, where a man can realize a since of true belonging with the hopes of giving his family something more than opression and inexcapable poverty?

For those who come here with the courage and hopes of being excepted and to contribute with a patriotism and will power that defines this nation, you are a pathetic disgrace unfit to stand in their ranks.

I guess for someone as yourself who refers to a minority as a "9th ward houstonion" we should not be suprised.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

You know the more I think about this statement, the more my stomach churns. Is it wrong to long to be an AMERICAN, where a man can realize a since of true belonging with the hopes of giving his family something more than opression and inexcapable poverty?

You're thinking Old School local, are you and Hackman brothers? There was a time and place for immigration but it is no more. Immigration is sucking the life out of this country and it is going to get worse, especially with the new bills that are being proposed. I do not think you have any idea of the billions of dollars that are lost from the American economy due to immigration. The bordering states medical systems are over taxed because of immigration. Every convenience store is owned by an immigrant. They purchase these stores with grants and government backed loans made up of your tax dollars. Then these stores operate for seven years tax exempt all the while dude is sending the money back overseas. Once the seven years is up the store is sold to a new immigrant, normally a family member. Now the dude returns to his country a very rich man and the cycle starts over again. This is the type of shet that turns my stomach local. Your family immigrated here as did mine. Mine came here in 1936 just before WWII. They came here and made a life for themselves without any government assistance in some of the worst economical times. Immigrants of today come here looking for a handout. You would not believe the programs that are out there for an immigrant to go to college. They are damn sure something a kid from a middle class working family will never see. Programs once again funded by your tax dollars. Sorry local but with the current system I have no sympathy for immigration of today.

For those who come here with the courage and hopes of being excepted and to contribute with a patriotism and will power that defines this nation, you are a pathetic disgrace unfit to stand in their ranks.

You are living in another time local. It is time to catch up to the present. If this is the case why do you have such problems with companies out sourcing overseas?

I guess for someone as yourself who refers to a minority as a "9th ward houstonion" we should not be suprised.

We have a recent new comer with the name "Brutally Honest". I like that name.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

The customer will suffer (immediately). I'm not divided in my small mind. My principles are intact and I am joined by thousands of others. We may need a new leader but the rank and file is still here.

Thousands huh? Like I said "small minded". Tens of millions Don. To do what needs to be done will take tens of millions. This whole country needs an overhaul and thousands will never get it done and if it is left up to unions you can forget it for sure.

Not to many years ago Canada passed a law banning smoking in bars. The moment it was announced every smoker lit up just where ever they happened to be. There was no union or organization. People just did it spontaneously in instant rebellion. To me this is the finest example of unionism. Unionism is not an organization you pay money to. It's a group of people coming together for a common cause on a whim such as that. A law that took months if not years to get passed was withdrawn within hours. That my dear Americans is the power of the People. Something Americans are seriously lacking. Like I said we are a weak people in a divided country.

 

[Hackman]

You're thinking Old School local, are you and Hackman brothers? There was a time and place for immigration but it is no more. Immigration is sucking the life out of this country and it is going to get worse, especially with the new bills that are being proposed. I do not think you have any idea of the billions of dollars that are lost from the American economy due to immigration. The bordering states medical systems are over taxed because of immigration. Every convenience store is owned by an immigrant. They purchase these stores with grants and government backed loans made up of your tax dollars. Then these stores operate for seven years tax exempt all the while dude is sending the money back overseas. Once the seven years is up the store is sold to a new immigrant, normally a family member. Now the dude returns to his country a very rich man and the cycle starts over again. This is the type of shet that turns my stomach local. Your family immigrated here as did mine. Mine came here in 1936 just before WWII. They came here and made a life for themselves without any government assistance in some of the worst economical times. Immigrants of today come here looking for a handout. You would not believe the programs that are out there for an immigrant to go to college. They are damn sure something a kid from a middle class working family will never see. Programs once again funded by your tax dollars. Sorry local but with the current system I have no sympathy for immigration of today.
You are living in another time local. It is time to catch up to the present. If this is the case why do you have such problems with companies out sourcing overseas?


We have a recent new comer with the name "Brutally Honest". I like that name.

Your right 'Cods, I am old school. I believe in laws and closing our borders, and accountable unions like AMFA. I also believe in the "American Dream" for workers, but thanks to people like yourself who take the man's side against your class while he enriches himself, that dream is fading for the average worker. I am also opened minded enough to see changes are needed, as nothing stays the same. The rich are getting richer, the class warfare is getting more brutal by the day. You as scab traitor should know this, since your the pawn in the game. Big money/big government is beating the working class to a pulp, and your kind is handing them the stick thinking they won't be using it on your ass next.

For once I agree with you on no more immigration 'Cods, as much as that kills me to say it. There was a great analogy by Neil Cavato? of Fox news last week. He said America is not the country it once was. American was like a great new restaurant back in the day. People started coming to this restaurant long ago, and they kept coming, and coming, and coming, to the point it is now crowded and full. The service is bad, the staff overwhelmed, the place is a wreck. We can no longer support or accept millions upon millions of illegal immigrants. It is taxing our system to failure. It must stop immediately, if that means troops and a 20 foot solid wall, then so be it.

You complain about immigrants and the special treatment they recieve, but your a hypocrite 'Cods. As a scab, you have assisted big business to destroy the craft, drive down wages and benifits, and in fact stole striking union members jobs. You did this hoping to make yourself a quick buck, selfishly not caring in the least what you did to the craft or its future. Except for being a legal citizen, your are no better than an illegal who is ruining our system. You have absolutely no room to talk, your a corporate whore.

I also would like to how AMFA members are stealing jobs at Spirit? Of course no IAM or TWU included right? Spirit workers are non-union "at will" workers like yourself. The man is free to hire/fire at any time, there is no contract to be broken. Union contracts are legally binding, and as you know a judge has to abrogate them in bankruptcy court, see the difference? Put your union hatred aside and open your eyes. I have a friend that used to work at Spirit, what a mess he said the operation was. Hard to believe they are still flying, kinda like Scab Air. :down:

 

[local 12 proud]

If this is the case why do you have such problems with companies out sourcing overseas?

... :huh: What does immigration have to do with outsourcing over seas?

I am old school, but i also believe the laws on the books need to be inforced. If that were the case we would'nt have 11 million illegals inside our borders with some 3000 pouring in weekly. Im all for an annual limit, where a person can come and realize his/her dream doing it the Legal way. the problem is our system is broken, and we have politicians not only looking the other way, but in fact endorse such behavior. im as frustrated as the next guy, but I don't believe that we should tottaly ban immigration.

while Rome burns, instead of joining the bucket brigade you choose to fan the flames. You point your finger and yet help assist in the destruction. your a hypocrite!

 

[PlayTheOdds]

Your right 'Cods, I am old school. I believe in laws and closing our borders, and accountable unions like AMFA…

What a delightful post Hackman, I even enjoyed the subtle insults that were made with a Hackman kind of class. I am indeed most impressed. You simply do not understand me Hackman, once again I am not against the idea of unionism. I am against the broken crumbs of todays unions that are useless. Unions are fighting an uphill battle with the cards stacked against them yet do nothing to correct the problem. There is a class war going on Hackman and you guys think that you can win it with dinosaur tactics and playing by the book, a book that has your failure already written at the end. In June AMFA will be in its strongest position it has ever been since this strike begun and they have done nothing to prepare for it. They have pissed off its members so bad with their pictures and Scab list on their little website that there is no way that they will help. You should hear the AMFA Scabs talk Hackman. Most are true Unionist but they have lost faith in their Unions and reading these posts so have you guys. I say it yet again Hackman, Rebuild your unions and build one that makes sense.

You want to make a difference Hackman? You, Ken and local seem to be smart men, though a bit misdirected. Build you a union that brings every A&P Mechanic into its fold. Forget about the companies for now they are small potatoes. You want to go after the FAA. Some will say you have to start at the bottom and work your way up. I call Bull Shet that’s the hard way. Start at the top and the bottom will fall in place. A union has got to be in a position to instantly have drastic effects on an entire industry to be effective today. This strike against Northwest was a mere buzzing gnat to the rest of the industry and simply a minor inconvenience for Northwest. Also throw the book away Hackman and make-up your own rules.

As far as Spirit goes, well a previous poster said they were working on getting their union. They were squashed at the gate, how prophetic.

You watch FOX? Amazing, I had you figured for a CNN kind of guy.

 

[Red Tail Bear]

What a delightful post Hackman, I even enjoyed the subtle insults that were made with a Hackman kind of class. I am indeed most impressed. You simply do not understand me Hackman, once again I am not against the idea of unionism. I am against the broken crumbs of todays unions that are useless. Unions are fighting an uphill battle with the cards stacked against them yet do nothing to correct the problem. There is a class war going on Hackman and you guys think that you can win it with dinosaur tactics and playing by the book, a book that has your failure already written at the end. In June AMFA will be in its strongest position it has ever been since this strike begun and they have done nothing to prepare for it. They have pissed off its members so bad with their pictures and Scab list on their little website that there is no way that they will help. You should hear the AMFA Scabs talk Hackman. Most are true Unionist but they have lost faith in their Unions and reading these posts so have you guys. I say it yet again Hackman, Rebuild your unions and build one that makes sense.

You want to make a difference Hackman? You, Ken and local seem to be smart men, though a bit misdirected. Build you a union that brings every A&P Mechanic into its fold. Forget about the companies for now they are small potatoes. You want to go after the FAA. Some will say you have to start at the bottom and work your way up. I call Bull Shet that’s the hard way. Start at the top and the bottom will fall in place. A union has got to be in a position to instantly have drastic effects on an entire industry to be effective today. This strike against Northwest was a mere buzzing gnat to the rest of the industry and simply a minor inconvenience for Northwest. Also throw the book away Hackman and make-up your own rules.

As far as Spirit goes, well a previous poster said they were working on getting their union. They were squashed at the gate, how prophetic.

You watch FOX? Amazing, I had you figured for a CNN kind of guy.

PTO,
Considering that you (in your own words) have had very little experience with unions. When did you (in your own mind) become such an expert on the subject?

 

[PlayTheOdds]

... :huh: What does immigration have to do with outsourcing over seas?

It is cheaper to send jobs to all those poor souls overseas than to bring them here to suck up tax payer dollars.

PTO,
Considering that you (in your own words) have had very little experience with unions. When did you (in your own mind) become such an expert on the subject?

Between me being able to learn by reading, learn from others and by pissing on the fence on occasion, not to mention a tremendous amount of common sense. I am fully capable of seeing what needs to be done. If you have issues with what I have stated in the above posts please do point them out.

 

[Red Tail Bear]

It is cheaper to send jobs to all those poor souls overseas than to bring them here to suck up tax payer dollars.
Between me being able to learn by reading, learn from others and by pissing on the fence on occasion, not to mention a tremendous amount of common sense. I am fully capable of seeing what needs to be done. If you have issues with what I have stated in the above posts please do point them out.

I just want to know where you get off commenting on and giving advice about something that you yourself have said you've had very little experience dealing with.

 

[PlayTheOdds]

I just want to know where you get off commenting on and giving advice about something that you yourself have said you've had very little experience dealing with.

Well? Are my comments right or wrong?

 

[Don Smith]

Thousands huh? Like I said "small minded"...

I was speaking of the AMFA members, undivided in the thousands.

[OUOTE]...Unionism is not an organization you pay money to. It's a group of people coming together for a common cause on a whim such as that...

I think I would refer to that as a "movement' not a union. After a movement becomes organized into leaders, followers and administrators then it becomes a union. The AMFA was a good idea...a craft association for aircraft mechanics. As it was run by members it ran into trouble in the end at nwa. What it needed was slick lawyer types just like the company's lawyers but with our interests at the forefront of their fight. When all of the unions and their leadership recognize that they need each other to form that movement you talk about then things may get done and change will happen. But as long as there is backbiting and suspicion then there won't be any workers movement. We don't have a Lech Walesa willing to take the lead.